OM617 convert from MW to M pump

OM617 convert from MW to M pump - Printable Version

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OM617 convert from MW to M pump - dieselmeken - 04-25-2011

This 88" Landrover has a 617 engine that has been in Morocco for outlet challange.
It has a Defender frame, so it´s app 90,4" ore something.
The engine has a 10 mm MW pump built by me, problem is that the engine is to powerful, problems with gearbox, drivshaft etc.
10 mm pump app 2 bar turbopressure, hard knock, heating problems but a lot of power
Now I have mounted a 6 mm M pump, also built by the pro! that deliver app 90cc@1500 rpm.
Testrun today, everything ok, no smoke at full power, that we had with the 10 mm pump, smoot idle etc.
1-1,2 bar boost, no heating problem etc etc

Engine install with MW 10mm pump this is a nice installation.

6mm M pump installed.
NOTE, the M pump has lubrication thru camshaft on 617 original, when you swap pumps like this you must have lubrication from outside by a hose, as the MW has.
When M serie is original, there is another kind of gear that has a slot that puts in oil in put thru camshaft.

Also you need other high pressure pipes, the MW pipes dont fit on M pump

I bee happy to answer the question I can.

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - dieselboy - 04-25-2011

That thing is so awesome.

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - Captain America - 04-25-2011

Thing is way cool! Can you make that much power for us please!?!

I am slightly lost on the oiling...

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - winmutt - 04-25-2011

Oh god that is so clean its sex.

So how much for a slightly used 10mm pump? Big Grin

RE Oil, Forced has a write up on it around here somewhere. Meken is saying that the original M pump got oil from the gear the input shaft (I thought it was the other way around).

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - OM616 - 04-25-2011

(04-25-2011, 01:47 PM)dieselmeken The engine has a 10 mm MW pump built by me, problem is that the engine is to powerful, problems with gearbox, drivshaft etc.
10 mm pump app 2 bar turbopressure, hard knock, heating problems but a lot of power

We got about 300 miles or so on the 300dt with the modified 10mm MW that I built before the trans grenaded, and the max fuel quantity was set to match the 5.5mm "turned up" pump as close as possible.

Everything needs to be changed when going to 10mm from the 5.5mm stock set up. After reading this I am very pleased with my set up, as the Idle was clean, it didn't nail (after it warmed up that is), and was very drivable. Gobbs of power potential.

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - mike-81-240d - 04-25-2011

Can I haz this defender? Me want...

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - Captain America - 04-25-2011

(04-25-2011, 03:34 PM)winmutt Oh god that is so clean its sex.

So how much for a slightly used 10mm pump?

RE Oil, Forced has a write up on it around here somewhere. Meken is saying that the original M pump got oil from the gear the input shaft (I thought it was the other way around).

Well the MW pumps have oil lines going to them... Guess the M pumps dont... I get it now

ps. I got dibs on that pump! Wink

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - dieselmeken - 04-26-2011

The 10 mm is not for sale for the moment, we need to see if the 6 mm leaves the power that the car needs, otherwise the 10 mm goes in to my workshop for modification. This is try and error, I havent heard of any 617 with this high poweroutput.

10 mm gives around 140cc, hard knock on low idle, this can bee reduced with a lower alpha angel or different elements with reducing slot, but as we need the power I had to go for 24 degrees BTDC with the 10 mm, On high rpm, over 1500 the engine was stabil and WERY powerful, but too much smoke, even at 2 bar so it was overfuelling a lot. 6 mm dont give any smoke at 1,2 bar, but is a bit lack of power for the moment. Another turbo may bee the answer. For the moment we have a VNT from 320CDI that I dont think work as I would like. Maybee a smaller Schwitzer will be the answer?
Also the M serie for 617 has the RSF first generation governor, that one has no ALDA, so for the moment we have a slight smokepuff when putting throttle to maximum.
The engine is now running absolutly perfect, the battery in my camera died, otherwise I would have a small filmclip of the testrun, Have to come back with that later on.

(04-25-2011, 03:34 PM)winmutt So how much for a slightly used 10mm pump?

http://media.jnytt.se/resources/news/2008-05-02-vattenh%C3%A5l2.jpg
http://www.jnytt.se/editorupload/vattenh%E5l1.jpg

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - Captain America - 04-26-2011

Man that sounds sweet.

I like the smoke puffs!

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - pp d - 04-26-2011

(04-25-2011, 01:47 PM)dieselmeken

Does the "stopper" stay there with good luck Big Grin

Sorry, I had to....

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - dieselmeken - 04-26-2011

(04-26-2011, 01:49 AM)pp d
(04-25-2011, 01:47 PM)dieselmeken

Does the "stopper" stay there with good luck

Sorry, I had to....

No problems, this is when we bulid the new bracket for the throttlewire, the one that was on the MW dont fit, you should know that.... Smile

So we made a new one in aluminium. As I wrote earlier, the battery in my camera died. BTW, You dont need a Hartridge 2500 VDM Testbench? Have one for sale

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - pp d - 04-26-2011

No problems, this is when we bulid the new bracket for the throttlewire, the one that was on the MW dont fit, you should know that.... Smile

So we made a new one in aluminium. As I wrote earlier, the battery in my camera died. BTW, You dont need a Hartridge 2500 VDM Testbench? Have one for sale

[/quote]

Like I said, I had to Smile

I don`t really need that bench but how much costs that kind of 500 € bench?

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - Einar - 04-26-2011

http://cgi.ebay.com/Dieselworkshop-complete-Hartridge-15HP-Testbench-/140533958832?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20b87a08b0

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - pp d - 04-26-2011

(04-26-2011, 10:25 AM)Einar http://cgi.ebay.com/Dieselworkshop-complete-Hartridge-15HP-Testbench-/140533958832?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20b87a08b0

If I understood correct, there was whole workshop and not just the bench Dodgy

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - DeliveryValve - 04-27-2011

(04-25-2011, 01:47 PM)dieselmeken ....
Now I have mounted a 6 mm M pump, also built by the pro! that deliver app 90cc@1500 rpm.....

Is that max fuel? And is that pump RPM or engine?

(04-26-2011, 12:51 AM)dieselmeken ....
10 mm gives around 140cc, ...

What is the boost level at 140cc?

(04-26-2011, 12:51 AM)dieselmeken otherwise the 10 mm goes in to my workshop for modification.

What sort of modifications are planned if you go that route?

Overall, nice looking setup!

.

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - dieselmeken - 04-27-2011

(04-27-2011, 12:46 AM)DeliveryValve
(04-25-2011, 01:47 PM)dieselmeken ....
Now I have mounted a 6 mm M pump, also built by the pro! that deliver app 90cc@1500 rpm.....

Is that max fuel? And is that pump RPM or engine? No, It´s not max, it will deliver around 120 at max. Pumprpm = 3000 engine rpm

(04-26-2011, 12:51 AM)dieselmeken ....
10 mm gives around 140cc, ...

What is the boost level at 140cc? App 2 bar, still smoking so it overfuels

(04-26-2011, 12:51 AM)dieselmeken otherwise the 10 mm goes in to my workshop for modification.

What sort of modifications are planned if you go that route? Make a retard slot on element for timing at low idle, and a not so much fuel at full load

Overall, nice looking setup!

.

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - mr_manny - 04-29-2011

dieselmeken,
Was the inter-cooler is necessary?
I am actually towards the end of a similar conversion, only mine is an early land cruiser.
We have enough room for an IC, just waiting to see how high my EGTs get Smile

Tires look like 35s...what are driving/wheeling characteristics like?

any input you can provide would be appreciated,
manny

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - Diesel-Wiking - 05-16-2011

how much do you take for 10mm pump rebuild if I come to you with my car? in and out with the pump + 10mm element?

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - Captain America - 05-16-2011

Me want video see now! Lol

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - Lance Carbuncle - 11-21-2011

Why did you choose to go from the MW pump to the M pump rather than just using smaller elements in a MW pump? (sorry if this a dumb question, but I am a diesel newbie trying to get a grasp on all this diesel technology)

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - dieselmeken - 11-21-2011

(11-21-2011, 01:24 AM)Lance Carbuncle Why did you choose to go from the MW pump to the M pump rather than just using smaller elements in a MW pump? (sorry if this a dumb question, but I am a diesel newbie trying to get a grasp on all this diesel technology)

There is no good smaller element on the market for MW pump. The M-serie also has a better governor i think.

RE: OM617 convert from MW to M pump - tomnik - 11-21-2011

(11-21-2011, 01:57 AM)dieselmeken There is no good smaller element on the market for MW pump.

long time ago there were Holly elements available with 6 and later 6.5mm elements Cool

Can't say anything about the governor but the MW pump seems to be the better pump in terms of max. pressure and much easier to adjust from outside due to the flange type barrels.
And it's original on 617a engines...

Tom