om606.962 swap into 1997 F150 4x4
om606.962 swap into 1997 F150 4x4
50harleyrider
07-07-2015, 06:41 AM #1I'm planning this swap and posting my build thread here. Before I begin collecting my expensive parts, I'd like to get a critique of my plan and if required,fine tune it. I plan on a Bendtsen supplied adapter plate, dieselmeken om603 IP, a Holset H351VE turbo with an appropriate header, stand alone boost controller, 3" or 4" exhaust with a muffler, big IC, and a PCS tranny controller for the E4OD which will be upgraded with a 7.3 Ford diesel torque converter. The OM has 175k on it and would like maintenance suggestions for prepping it for around 300HP so I can tow with the truck and still get decent fuel mileage. If I need to post my build elsewhere, hopefully the moderators on here can point me in the right direction. I'm a TDI guy and am looking forward to my MB diesel adventure. I bought this truck new and it only has 49k but what a gas guzzler and pitiful low end torque the 5.4 2v is!
there´s only a few things u have to built around a 606.96X to give u long term pulling ability on the 300HP area, and one is EGT how to lower EGT´s . so basic cooling , oil , water, intake charge, the rest is a very good engine.
good luck...
FD,
Powered by tractor fuel
u´re in the right place mate!!!
there´s only a few things u have to built around a 606.96X to give u long term pulling ability on the 300HP area, and one is EGT how to lower EGT´s . so basic cooling , oil , water, intake charge, the rest is a very good engine.
good luck...
FD,
Powered by tractor fuel
87 300SDL OM606 swapped HE351VE 722.633 swapped, Crower cams, KM valvesprings
76 300TD custom lots of stuff
06 Mercedes CL65 AMG 619 WHP, http://TurboTims.com
You will have pitiful low end tq with that turbo. I have that turbo and you will have to downshift to 4k to get any usable power otherwise you are just smoking out people behind you. That is pretty much an HX40 and so your usable power band is really 4500 to 7k. I ran an HX40/35 Hybrid and it really worked well with the stock Power band and redline. It was a 16cm Hx35 housing. I would actually consider selling at some point. I drive a 300SDL so it's a fairly big car and I just finished my setup about a week ago. I pull a trailer a lot for camping and stuff and I am just learning that this turbo isn't as ideal as my last setup for the heavy loads I pull. I can give you my phone number if you like.
87 300SDL OM606 swapped HE351VE 722.633 swapped, Crower cams, KM valvesprings
76 300TD custom lots of stuff
06 Mercedes CL65 AMG 619 WHP, http://TurboTims.com
87 300SDL OM606 swapped HE351VE 722.633 swapped, Crower cams, KM valvesprings
76 300TD custom lots of stuff
06 Mercedes CL65 AMG 619 WHP, http://TurboTims.com
Go check out the pics of my manifold though if you have time. I started a thread with pics.
87 300SDL OM606 swapped HE351VE 722.633 swapped, Crower cams, KM valvesprings
76 300TD custom lots of stuff
06 Mercedes CL65 AMG 619 WHP, http://TurboTims.com
What Tim said. You'll need a small turbo to make that any fun to drive. Smaller than hx35 IMO.
I think if you got in a newer 5.4 2v, you'd be surprised.
raysorenson
07-07-2015, 10:16 AM #5ESOF uses the PCM to send vehicle speed data over the SCP network to the cluster. MSOF uses the x-fer case speed sensor signal, spliced to both the GEM and the PCM. The GEM in this setup has a dedicated wire to send VSS to the cluster. Less trouble dumping the pcm with MSOF.
What Tim said. You'll need a small turbo to make that any fun to drive. Smaller than hx35 IMO.
I think if you got in a newer 5.4 2v, you'd be surprised.
TurboTim: How did you go about getting sourcing your Mech IP? Go the $$ dieselmeken route? I see stock ones on ebay all the time.
50harleyrider
07-07-2015, 01:00 PM #6I have considered a couple of VNT17/22 hybrids in parallel just to get the low end power up and keep lag at a minimum. The more I research the Holsets, I may steer away from them. I would like to get an OM603 IP or convert my IP to mechanical just to get my rig up and running. I don't like the idea of investing a fortune in a dieselmeken built one. Is there anyone stateside that can tweak an OM603 pump or convert and tweak mine? No ecu is enticing and with a PCS tranny controller and a stand alone boost controller, I can go with a VNT setup. City driveability, torque, and Fuel mileage are my primary motivators. The 5.4 2v and 3v modular Ford gassers have none of the above. I have the 97 2v and an 04 3v and now that I'm a 'dieselholic' from owning and modding TDIs, time for a nice 1/2 ton diesel without a $55k price tag like the new Dodge.
TurboTim: How did you go about getting sourcing your Mech IP? Go the $$ dieselmeken route? I see stock ones on ebay all the time.
87 300SDL OM606 swapped HE351VE 722.633 swapped, Crower cams, KM valvesprings
76 300TD custom lots of stuff
06 Mercedes CL65 AMG 619 WHP, http://TurboTims.com
My car came this a mechanical pump when I first had an OM603 but I did send mine to Deiselmeken.
87 300SDL OM606 swapped HE351VE 722.633 swapped, Crower cams, KM valvesprings
76 300TD custom lots of stuff
06 Mercedes CL65 AMG 619 WHP, http://TurboTims.com
(07-07-2015, 10:16 AM)raysorenson ESOF uses the PCM to send vehicle speed data over the SCP network to the cluster. MSOF uses the x-fer case speed sensor signal, spliced to both the GEM and the PCM. The GEM in this setup has a dedicated wire to send VSS to the cluster. Less trouble dumping the pcm with MSOF.
What Tim said. You'll need a small turbo to make that any fun to drive. Smaller than hx35 IMO.
I think if you got in a newer 5.4 2v, you'd be surprised.
I've decided for the first phase of my swap to use the entire Mercedes engine/722.6 tranny and all supporting modules and wiring and go 2wd. I'll even use the immo transponder key and wire it under the dash. Both the Benz and the F150 have analog speedometers and tachs,fuel gages so I'll put boost/egt ,oil pressure,water temp gages on the F150 a-pillar. Mike at tdtuning will provide a tune to get my horsepower and torque up to the level the 5.4 2v has now without having to wind the engine and can enjoy that lower RPM torque. I can upgrade to a mechanical IP later if I decide to start chasing horsepower. DPUK has an adapter if I decide to go the T3/T4 Holset route a bit later. If I get lucky with my funds, I'll even put a tubular header on it.
The MB has a return line on the fuel line as well as a fuel heater. Will I have to rig this system to work on the F150 since I'm planning on using the MB ECU/TCU? I do run biodiesel and it would be nice in the winter as that stuff will gel below 40F. Thanks for all the input guys.
50harleyrider
07-20-2015, 06:53 AM #8(07-07-2015, 10:16 AM)raysorenson ESOF uses the PCM to send vehicle speed data over the SCP network to the cluster. MSOF uses the x-fer case speed sensor signal, spliced to both the GEM and the PCM. The GEM in this setup has a dedicated wire to send VSS to the cluster. Less trouble dumping the pcm with MSOF.
What Tim said. You'll need a small turbo to make that any fun to drive. Smaller than hx35 IMO.
I think if you got in a newer 5.4 2v, you'd be surprised.
I've decided for the first phase of my swap to use the entire Mercedes engine/722.6 tranny and all supporting modules and wiring and go 2wd. I'll even use the immo transponder key and wire it under the dash. Both the Benz and the F150 have analog speedometers and tachs,fuel gages so I'll put boost/egt ,oil pressure,water temp gages on the F150 a-pillar. Mike at tdtuning will provide a tune to get my horsepower and torque up to the level the 5.4 2v has now without having to wind the engine and can enjoy that lower RPM torque. I can upgrade to a mechanical IP later if I decide to start chasing horsepower. DPUK has an adapter if I decide to go the T3/T4 Holset route a bit later. If I get lucky with my funds, I'll even put a tubular header on it.
The MB has a return line on the fuel line as well as a fuel heater. Will I have to rig this system to work on the F150 since I'm planning on using the MB ECU/TCU? I do run biodiesel and it would be nice in the winter as that stuff will gel below 40F. Thanks for all the input guys.
A way around this might be to make all four ABS sensors read from a trigger wheel on the driveshaft.
Oh btw if you want a lot of power you can use the EDC pump almost just as well as the mechanical one.
Good luck with that. The engine ECU can be tricked to run standalone and it has been done before, but the TCU requires wheel speed input from ABS. If the wheel speed doesn't match the ECU expectation it will go into limp mode. The only way to get a 722.6 to work in another chassis is to transplant the ABS system from the W210. And even then if the final drive ratio is different the TCU will think the trans is slipping and go into limp.
A way around this might be to make all four ABS sensors read from a trigger wheel on the driveshaft.
Oh btw if you want a lot of power you can use the EDC pump almost just as well as the mechanical one.
50harleyrider
07-20-2015, 10:18 AM #10Fooling the MB ABS with sensors on the driveshaft would sure help that issue. My truck doesn't have abs so that feature isn't needed anyhow. Are you talking about the stock IP? Wouldn't it need larger elements to support a bigger turbo?
The problem with electronic pumps is that they can't rev past 5500 rpm due to some kind of secret limiter in the ECU that no tuner has been able to remove yet i think. But you probably won't rev that much.
Btw you can also get a standalone controller for the 722.6 that makes it pretty much a plug and play job for the trans.
I always dreamed about a compound-sequential setup HX35 over the stock turbo
But that is quite a bit of work to build 
You'll have to upgrade to 7.5mm elements to reach 300hp regardless of what pump you use. Both will function pretty well, the difference is tuning. On the mechanical pump you just turn a couple of screws to adjust the fueling. The electronic pump will have to be mapped. But the electronic pump can be fine tuned much better and more precise than the mechanical one.
The problem with electronic pumps is that they can't rev past 5500 rpm due to some kind of secret limiter in the ECU that no tuner has been able to remove yet i think. But you probably won't rev that much.
Btw you can also get a standalone controller for the 722.6 that makes it pretty much a plug and play job for the trans.
I always dreamed about a compound-sequential setup HX35 over the stock turbo But that is quite a bit of work to build
50harleyrider
07-20-2015, 02:28 PM #12Yeah,those compound setups also are space hogs. I think I'm gonna get a 603 M pump and send it to Dieselmeken or preferably buy one from him that's ready to go. I'll probably put a small Holset on it off an early 90's 6BT to start with and use the DPUK T3 or T4 adapter. My TDI's run OK with cast iron oem exhaust headers and bigger turbos. I usualy put nice big downpipes and 3" exhaust on them. I'm not gonna waste my time with the oem K14.
50harleyrider
03-03-2016, 08:52 AM #13My f150 4x4 swap took a hit this week. The 97 f150 4x4 has front torsion springs and it so happens the cross member they attach to midway back on the frame will be smack in the way of mounting a divorced NP205 Tcase back there thus eliminating my goal to use the donor 2wd 722.6 out of my w210. I guess it's back to the Ford E44OD which will make some things easier as far as driveline is concerned but another aftermarket TCU will be required and I can't use the 722.6 controller by Ole. I can and will use Baldur's ecu still. This planning stuff is getting old. Ford is supposed to offer a 3 liter V6 diesel and 10 sp tranny in late 2016 or early 2017 but will probably be $55k. Ugh!
Read this page: http://www.allpar.com/mopar/transmission...WA580.html
The Mercedes-Benz 5G-Tronic (also called 722.6) is an electronically shifted 5-speed overdrive automatic transmission with torque converter lockup. In Chrysler applications this transmission is identified as the New Automatic Gearbox Generation One, or NAG1. Here are the Chrysler applications:
- 2002-2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee[8] (02-04 WG Diesel, 05-10 WK V6)
- 2006-2010 Jeep Commander XH 3.0 litre diesel export model
- 2011-2012 Dodge Durango (V6 Models only)
- 2005-2014 Chrysler 300 (AWD, 300C, SRT8 only)
- 2005-2008 Dodge Magnum (AWD, RT, SRT8 only)
- 2009-2014 Dodge Challenger
- 2006-2014 Dodge Charger (AWD, RT, SRT8 only) (2006 3.5L V6 HO)
- 2007-2011 Dodge Nitro (4.0L Models only)
- 2012-Present Jeep Wrangler[9]
- 2004-2008 Chrysler Crossfire, all models[10]
- 2004-2010 Chrysler 300 C CRD (with OM 642 V6 Diesel engine)[11]
- 2001-2006 Freightliner Sprinter Vans (USA)
- 2003-2006 Dodge Sprinter Vans ( N. America)
Maybe you can use a 4wd tranny version from a chrysler vehicle that has the "NAG1" transmission which is the same as 722.6. You need to swap the removable bellhousing from your 2wd 722.6 tranny to the 4wd NAG1 tranny. I plan to do this for my swap and use Olefer's TCU and Valdur's ECU for engine/transmission control.
Read this page: http://www.allpar.com/mopar/transmission...WA580.html
The Mercedes-Benz 5G-Tronic (also called 722.6) is an electronically shifted 5-speed overdrive automatic transmission with torque converter lockup. In Chrysler applications this transmission is identified as the New Automatic Gearbox Generation One, or NAG1. Here are the Chrysler applications:
- 2002-2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee[8] (02-04 WG Diesel, 05-10 WK V6)
- 2006-2010 Jeep Commander XH 3.0 litre diesel export model
- 2011-2012 Dodge Durango (V6 Models only)
- 2005-2014 Chrysler 300 (AWD, 300C, SRT8 only)
- 2005-2008 Dodge Magnum (AWD, RT, SRT8 only)
- 2009-2014 Dodge Challenger
- 2006-2014 Dodge Charger (AWD, RT, SRT8 only) (2006 3.5L V6 HO)
- 2007-2011 Dodge Nitro (4.0L Models only)
- 2012-Present Jeep Wrangler[9]
- 2004-2008 Chrysler Crossfire, all models[10]
- 2004-2010 Chrysler 300 C CRD (with OM 642 V6 Diesel engine)[11]
- 2001-2006 Freightliner Sprinter Vans (USA)
- 2003-2006 Dodge Sprinter Vans ( N. America)
50harleyrider
03-28-2016, 05:10 AM #15Thanks roycem3, I'll look into it now that Zeeman has discovered a mis-clock of his Bendtsen adapter plate. I'll be pulling the OM606.962 out of the donor car this week and see if my already bought,delivered and paid for Bendtsen adapter is also off. I'm waiting to hear from Bendtsen as we post and will report back. Thanks again and will keep your suggestion at the forefront of my path forward. Looks like there should be a lot of NAG1 tranny/transfer cases in the US. The 722.666 out of the V8 American ML would have worked also but I want to keep my F150 part time 4WD and that 722.666 is AWD with an ABS based traction control. Are all the transfer cases you listed AWD same as the ML or part time 4WD like American trucks mostly are? Your list looks to be only cars, 2wd vans and SUVs is why I ask. The AWD are fine if you have a traction control system through your ABS which of course my 97 does not. In fact it doesn't even have ABS so I can't go there. Three diffs=poor traction.
50harleyrider
04-14-2016, 12:52 PM #18Thanks and am sure looking forward to it. The load leveler needs to be left to right to get that engine level! I'll probably rig it with the intake off with connections low on the block when I drop it in the truck. Patiently waiting on our buddy Bendtsen.
raysorenson
04-14-2016, 01:15 PM #19fyi, mine weighs 4600# w/4.6l, M5OD, 8.8 axle, 4x4, original front of tire exit '97 exhaust, short cab 8' bed. That's about the same as the W210 curb weight. The E4OD probably adds around 100#, 9.75" axle about 60#. Cab options would also penalize. Keeping it light expands big turbo options.
.The Ford starter is on the right side but the way Bendtsens adapter is designed, I keep the Benz starter and original left side location so it becomes a simple wiring issue.
My other concern is making sure there are no interferences around the steering column with the AC compressor and PS pump. I really want to keep all that intact and just plumb to them.
50harleyrider
04-16-2016, 02:27 PM #20That's good to know. I'm gonna keep the Dieselmeken 7.5 super M-pump on the shelf for now and the HX35 and play with the OE pump/turbo and Baldurs ecu and see what it does. I did some serious measuring today and found I only need 2" extra clearance to make the OEM 606.961 pan clear the axle tube, so it looks like a 2" or 3" body lift and subsequent engine/tranny lift will get me enough pan clearance at the front axle tube and I won't have to buy the very expensive and hard to find OM648 pan/pump which incidentally the sellers are very fond of .
The Ford starter is on the right side but the way Bendtsens adapter is designed, I keep the Benz starter and original left side location so it becomes a simple wiring issue.
My other concern is making sure there are no interferences around the steering column with the AC compressor and PS pump. I really want to keep all that intact and just plumb to them.
(03-28-2016, 05:10 AM)50harleyrider Thanks roycem3, I'll look into it now that Zeeman has discovered a mis-clock of his Bendtsen adapter plate. I'll be pulling the OM606.962 out of the donor car this week and see if my already bought,delivered and paid for Bendtsen adapter is also off. I'm waiting to hear from Bendtsen as we post and will report back. Thanks again and will keep your suggestion at the forefront of my path forward. Looks like there should be a lot of NAG1 tranny/transfer cases in the US. The 722.666 out of the V8 American ML would have worked also but I want to keep my F150 part time 4WD and that 722.666 is AWD with an ABS based traction control. Are all the transfer cases you listed AWD same as the ML or part time 4WD like American trucks mostly are? Your list looks to be only cars, 2wd vans and SUVs is why I ask. The AWD are fine if you have a traction control system through your ABS which of course my 97 does not. In fact it doesn't even have ABS so I can't go there. Three diffs=poor traction.
I believe the 2012 Jeep Wrangler comes with the option of part-time 4WD, but you need to do some research.
(03-28-2016, 05:10 AM)50harleyrider Thanks roycem3, I'll look into it now that Zeeman has discovered a mis-clock of his Bendtsen adapter plate. I'll be pulling the OM606.962 out of the donor car this week and see if my already bought,delivered and paid for Bendtsen adapter is also off. I'm waiting to hear from Bendtsen as we post and will report back. Thanks again and will keep your suggestion at the forefront of my path forward. Looks like there should be a lot of NAG1 tranny/transfer cases in the US. The 722.666 out of the V8 American ML would have worked also but I want to keep my F150 part time 4WD and that 722.666 is AWD with an ABS based traction control. Are all the transfer cases you listed AWD same as the ML or part time 4WD like American trucks mostly are? Your list looks to be only cars, 2wd vans and SUVs is why I ask. The AWD are fine if you have a traction control system through your ABS which of course my 97 does not. In fact it doesn't even have ABS so I can't go there. Three diffs=poor traction.
I believe the 2012 Jeep Wrangler comes with the option of part-time 4WD, but you need to do some research.
(04-24-2016, 09:16 PM)roycem3Nope,(03-28-2016, 05:10 AM)50harleyrider Thanks roycem3, I'll look into it now that Zeeman has discovered a mis-clock of his Bendtsen adapter plate. I'll be pulling the OM606.962 out of the donor car this week and see if my already bought,delivered and paid for Bendtsen adapter is also off. I'm waiting to hear from Bendtsen as we post and will report back. Thanks again and will keep your suggestion at the forefront of my path forward. Looks like there should be a lot of NAG1 tranny/transfer cases in the US. The 722.666 out of the V8 American ML would have worked also but I want to keep my F150 part time 4WD and that 722.666 is AWD with an ABS based traction control. Are all the transfer cases you listed AWD same as the ML or part time 4WD like American trucks mostly are? Your list looks to be only cars, 2wd vans and SUVs is why I ask. The AWD are fine if you have a traction control system through your ABS which of course my 97 does not. In fact it doesn't even have ABS so I can't go there. Three diffs=poor traction.
I believe the 2012 Jeep Wrangler comes with the option of part-time 4WD, but you need to do some research.
staying with the Ford oe tranny/transfer case, US Shift TCM, and Bendtsen adapter. I'll have my hands full anyhow without dealing with trannys and linkages.
50harleyrider
04-25-2016, 07:22 AM #22(04-24-2016, 09:16 PM)roycem3Nope,(03-28-2016, 05:10 AM)50harleyrider Thanks roycem3, I'll look into it now that Zeeman has discovered a mis-clock of his Bendtsen adapter plate. I'll be pulling the OM606.962 out of the donor car this week and see if my already bought,delivered and paid for Bendtsen adapter is also off. I'm waiting to hear from Bendtsen as we post and will report back. Thanks again and will keep your suggestion at the forefront of my path forward. Looks like there should be a lot of NAG1 tranny/transfer cases in the US. The 722.666 out of the V8 American ML would have worked also but I want to keep my F150 part time 4WD and that 722.666 is AWD with an ABS based traction control. Are all the transfer cases you listed AWD same as the ML or part time 4WD like American trucks mostly are? Your list looks to be only cars, 2wd vans and SUVs is why I ask. The AWD are fine if you have a traction control system through your ABS which of course my 97 does not. In fact it doesn't even have ABS so I can't go there. Three diffs=poor traction.
I believe the 2012 Jeep Wrangler comes with the option of part-time 4WD, but you need to do some research.
staying with the Ford oe tranny/transfer case, US Shift TCM, and Bendtsen adapter. I'll have my hands full anyhow without dealing with trannys and linkages.
50harleyrider
05-10-2016, 08:55 AM #23I'm planning on using the ps pump out of the Mercedes in my swap. What ps fluid should I use and will it be compatible with the fluid still in the F150 system? Same for antifreeze? AC refrigerants are both R134A so that's a no brainer.
Coolant: Zerex G05. Good for the OM606, won't hurt anything else
The PS system is not very picky. I'd probably go with whatever the truck is using now. This, on the theory that if something fails, replacing the PS pump is really easy and they are cheap to find in a junk yard.
Coolant: Zerex G05. Good for the OM606, won't hurt anything else
50harleyrider
06-06-2016, 06:24 AM #25
Here's a photo of the Bendtsen adapter plate installed. It's a precision, well made unit after the clocking issue was resolved thanks to Zeeman. I'm still at odds what to use fuel line wise. I have no clue if the oe Ford supply and return lines will be biodiesel compatible. I'd like to re-use them if possible. Summit here in the states sells spring lock adapters so it would be quite easy to connect them to the 606 (see fuel lines in the photo). I know the 606 E-pump has a built in scavenging pump similar to the VW TDI VE engine pumps so I wouldn't need the Ford oe lift pump and will most likely remove it from the tank. I sure won't use it at any rate as the 40psi head might damage the e-pumps' scavenging pump. The om606 donor w210 had aluminum fuel lines so they're a no go for biodiesel (Unless they are stainless since all I did was a magnet test on them so they could be stainless). They are painted black is why I assumed they were aluminum. Comments welcome.
(06-06-2016, 06:55 PM)baldur The Ford OE plastic lines are compatible with pretty much anything. They're polyethylene or similar chemical resistant plastic.Thanks Baldur, makes sense so I'll re-use them. I've used polyester and polyethelene for biodiesel with no chemical breakdown issues. I'll let the in-tank pump just take up space unrestricted and inactive and just flush it. As soon as I get the rust cleaned off in the engine bay, I should start making real progress with mounts,plumbing,wiring and linkages. I want to beat Fords' introduction of the Lion F150 diesel slated for 2017 model introduction.
50harleyrider
06-07-2016, 07:31 AM #27(06-06-2016, 06:55 PM)baldur The Ford OE plastic lines are compatible with pretty much anything. They're polyethylene or similar chemical resistant plastic.Thanks Baldur, makes sense so I'll re-use them. I've used polyester and polyethelene for biodiesel with no chemical breakdown issues. I'll let the in-tank pump just take up space unrestricted and inactive and just flush it. As soon as I get the rust cleaned off in the engine bay, I should start making real progress with mounts,plumbing,wiring and linkages. I want to beat Fords' introduction of the Lion F150 diesel slated for 2017 model introduction.
87 300SDL OM606 swapped HE351VE 722.633 swapped, Crower cams, KM valvesprings
76 300TD custom lots of stuff
06 Mercedes CL65 AMG 619 WHP, http://TurboTims.com
I would run the OE pump otherwise it's a restriction and honestly you can not have enough feed pump!
87 300SDL OM606 swapped HE351VE 722.633 swapped, Crower cams, KM valvesprings
76 300TD custom lots of stuff
06 Mercedes CL65 AMG 619 WHP, http://TurboTims.com
50harleyrider
06-09-2016, 07:01 AM #29The F150 lines look to be about the same diameter and shorter than the oe on the w210 which didn't have a lift pump. I'm a KISS believer so probably will just gut and bypass it.
87 300SDL OM606 swapped HE351VE 722.633 swapped, Crower cams, KM valvesprings
76 300TD custom lots of stuff
06 Mercedes CL65 AMG 619 WHP, http://TurboTims.com
Yes and you need a lift pump if you want anything over stock....if you send out your injection pump the mechanical pump will be removed because it's a restriction. It was made to fill stock elements and have no psi.
87 300SDL OM606 swapped HE351VE 722.633 swapped, Crower cams, KM valvesprings
76 300TD custom lots of stuff
06 Mercedes CL65 AMG 619 WHP, http://TurboTims.com
50harleyrider
06-11-2016, 04:24 PM #31Thanks. I'll keep that in mind and talk to my tuner. Right now I plan to leave the stock pump and turbo on it maxed out with Baldurs' ecu.
Given the inherent smoothness of the OM606, maybe worth a try. I could even use two on each side. One type I won't use are polyurethane. They transmit vibration badly.
50harleyrider
06-23-2016, 06:22 PM #32While trying to retain as much of the oe W210 stuff in my swap, those darn motor mounts are about 5" tall and will really present a challenge to use. Is this something I'm just going to have to deal with or are there any good options for lower profile ones that I won't have to hack my frame up to use? Are shorter viscous mounts available and are they even necessary? I don't want my teeth to chatter and ruin my swap either of course. These Ebay motor mounts are almost 3" shorter: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Trans-Dapt-9314-...fq&vxp=mtr
Given the inherent smoothness of the OM606, maybe worth a try. I could even use two on each side. One type I won't use are polyurethane. They transmit vibration badly.
(06-23-2016, 06:22 PM)50harleyrider While trying to retain as much of the oe W210 stuff in my swap, those darn motor mounts are about 5" tall and will really present a challenge to use. Is this something I'm just going to have to deal with or are there any good options for lower profile ones that I won't have to hack my frame up to use? Are shorter viscous mounts available and are they even necessary? I don't want my teeth to chatter and ruin my swap either of course. These Ebay motor mounts are almost 3" shorter: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Trans-Dapt-9314-...fq&vxp=mtr
Given the inherent smoothness of the OM606, maybe worth a try. I could even use two on each side. One type I won't use are polyurethane. They transmit vibration badly.
I use Dodge Cummins 24 v engine mounts. They last forever and work well in 4x4. The stock 606 mounts don't hold up.
(06-23-2016, 06:22 PM)50harleyrider While trying to retain as much of the oe W210 stuff in my swap, those darn motor mounts are about 5" tall and will really present a challenge to use. Is this something I'm just going to have to deal with or are there any good options for lower profile ones that I won't have to hack my frame up to use? Are shorter viscous mounts available and are they even necessary? I don't want my teeth to chatter and ruin my swap either of course. These Ebay motor mounts are almost 3" shorter: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Trans-Dapt-9314-...fq&vxp=mtr
Given the inherent smoothness of the OM606, maybe worth a try. I could even use two on each side. One type I won't use are polyurethane. They transmit vibration badly.
I use Dodge Cummins 24 v engine mounts. They last forever and work well in 4x4. The stock 606 mounts don't hold up.
(06-09-2016, 07:01 AM)50harleyrider The F150 lines look to be about the same diameter and shorter than the oe on the w210 which didn't have a lift pump. I'm a KISS believer so probably will just gut and bypass it.
Hey man you can just delete the stock lift pump on the 606 IP and fit a blanking plate if you want to keep the stock in tank pump, as it's already stock it will be reliable I would have thought.
I was reading about thr 4x4 tranny in the ML and it is a BorgWarner 4409 chain drive, 2 speed tranny case, shame no centre diff lock because it would have been perfect for your build. It would have been electronic so dash button to engage dirt every day mode.. lol
Installed:
OM606/722.6, big IC, W220 brakes.
Planned:
DIY manifold, compound, 722.6 controller, built IP.
[i]Less rust.. [/i]
(06-09-2016, 07:01 AM)50harleyrider The F150 lines look to be about the same diameter and shorter than the oe on the w210 which didn't have a lift pump. I'm a KISS believer so probably will just gut and bypass it.
Hey man you can just delete the stock lift pump on the 606 IP and fit a blanking plate if you want to keep the stock in tank pump, as it's already stock it will be reliable I would have thought.
I was reading about thr 4x4 tranny in the ML and it is a BorgWarner 4409 chain drive, 2 speed tranny case, shame no centre diff lock because it would have been perfect for your build. It would have been electronic so dash button to engage dirt every day mode.. lol
Installed:
OM606/722.6, big IC, W220 brakes.
Planned:
DIY manifold, compound, 722.6 controller, built IP.
[i]Less rust.. [/i]
50harleyrider
06-26-2016, 02:13 PM #35It looks like I can mod the oe 5.4 mounts to bolt to the 606 aluminum arms which should be sufficient. I'll be granny driving in 4x4. Will post up pics once fabbed. Those 6bt mounts are indeed beasts! Your fabrication skills are impressive, Zeeman. Where is your om648 dipstick tube? Should be in front of the starter. Your post somehow got out of place.Thx.
(06-26-2016, 02:13 PM)50harleyrider It looks like I can mod the oe 5.4 mounts to bolt to the 606 aluminum arms which should be sufficient. I'll be granny driving in 4x4. Will post up pics once fabbed. Those 6bt mounts are indeed beasts! Your fabrication skills are impressive, Zeeman. Where is your om648 dipstick tube? Should be in front of the starter. Your post somehow got out of place.Thx.
This is a mock up engine I use for fabrication. The dipstick tube will be in front of the starter, and I make a bracket to fasten it to the back of the intake.
(06-26-2016, 02:13 PM)50harleyrider It looks like I can mod the oe 5.4 mounts to bolt to the 606 aluminum arms which should be sufficient. I'll be granny driving in 4x4. Will post up pics once fabbed. Those 6bt mounts are indeed beasts! Your fabrication skills are impressive, Zeeman. Where is your om648 dipstick tube? Should be in front of the starter. Your post somehow got out of place.Thx.
This is a mock up engine I use for fabrication. The dipstick tube will be in front of the starter, and I make a bracket to fasten it to the back of the intake.
50harleyrider
07-05-2016, 05:24 AM #37I got my dipstick tube, oil pump chain and tensioner, and all fasteners for the 648 pan last week and will be installing it all on the engine this week. The tube wouldn't fit into the pan with the starter in place so I assume I have to remove the starter to install it. I also confirmed the 97 F150 indeed does have black polyethene or similar material lined fuel lines so it should be no trouble using them with petrodiesel or biodiesel. To start with, I plan to leave the oe lift pump functioning in place and see if the 40-50 psi pressure causes issues with the 606 E-pumps' scavenging pump. If that works out, The future E-pumps' mods I have planned if necessary down the road should be fed nicely. Right now, I just want to get it up and running with Baldurs' ecu.
raysorenson
07-06-2016, 08:47 AM #38The '97 used a 3 bar FPR in the fuel rail. Taking out the fuel rail will result in very high fuel pressure, so you'll need another FPR.
(07-06-2016, 08:47 AM)raysorenson The '97 used a 3 bar FPR in the fuel rail. Taking out the fuel rail will result in very high fuel pressure, so you'll need another FPR.
Yeah, I was worried about that in a previous post. You figure this 0-160psi one will be good? http://www.protuninglab.com/red16adalfup...3172509376 That way if I go with a Dieselmeken super M-pump, I'll be prepared for his 1 bar requirement. It's aluminum too so that's good. Will mount nicely on the firewall.
50harleyrider
07-06-2016, 11:56 AM #39(07-06-2016, 08:47 AM)raysorenson The '97 used a 3 bar FPR in the fuel rail. Taking out the fuel rail will result in very high fuel pressure, so you'll need another FPR.
Yeah, I was worried about that in a previous post. You figure this 0-160psi one will be good? http://www.protuninglab.com/red16adalfup...3172509376 That way if I go with a Dieselmeken super M-pump, I'll be prepared for his 1 bar requirement. It's aluminum too so that's good. Will mount nicely on the firewall.
raysorenson
07-08-2016, 02:22 PM #40Sure, I guess. As long as the diaphragm isn't damaged by diesel.
. If I recall, thw210 was that way. Also does anyone know what the high pressure supply fitting is at the PS pump outlet? I lost the oe hose so I have to start from scratch and adapt. Maybe if someone posted a photo of a removed hose? Cheers and beers! Suggestions welcome.
50harleyrider
09-30-2016, 05:47 PM #41A little update. Got the drivetrain all in place. The serpentine belt is back on. The 6BT 24v MMs worked out nicely. Cudos to zeeman. I have to get all the plumbing sorted out now. The radiator hose connections will be a challenge as they are reversed on the F150 so long hoses are in my future. I can't quite figure out the heater hose routing. I see two connections on the block. I'll try the one on the head as the return and the one on the right front beside the main outlet to the radiator as the supply and tee it into the puke tank bottom inlet . If I recall, thw210 was that way.
Also does anyone know what the high pressure supply fitting is at the PS pump outlet? I lost the oe hose so I have to start from scratch and adapt. Maybe if someone posted a photo of a removed hose? Cheers and beers! Suggestions welcome.
(09-30-2016, 05:47 PM)50harleyrider A little update. Got the drivetrain all in place. The serpentine belt is back on. The 6BT 24v MMs worked out nicely. Cudos to zeeman. I have to get all the plumbing sorted out now. The radiator hose connections will be a challenge as they are reversed on the F150 so long hoses are in my future. I can't quite figure out the heater hose routing. I see two connections on the block. I'll try the one on the head as the return and the one on the right front beside the main outlet to the radiator as the supply and tee it into the puke tank bottom inlet
Also does anyone know what the high pressure supply fitting is at the PS pump outlet? I lost the oe hose so I have to start from scratch and adapt. Maybe if someone posted a photo of a removed hose? Cheers and beers! Suggestions welcome.
On the heater hoses, the one coming from the head by the oil filter is the outlet going to the heater. Out from the heater ties into the hose coming off the bottom of the fill tank and goes to the thermostat housing. I make a bracket and mount the fill tank on the side of the head.
If you have a brass radiator a good radiator shop can switch the inlet and outlet with the correct size and do a clean job.
Enclose are some pics of the Jeep JK I did. It all worked well.
I have a power steering hose I can post for you.
(09-30-2016, 05:47 PM)50harleyrider A little update. Got the drivetrain all in place. The serpentine belt is back on. The 6BT 24v MMs worked out nicely. Cudos to zeeman. I have to get all the plumbing sorted out now. The radiator hose connections will be a challenge as they are reversed on the F150 so long hoses are in my future. I can't quite figure out the heater hose routing. I see two connections on the block. I'll try the one on the head as the return and the one on the right front beside the main outlet to the radiator as the supply and tee it into the puke tank bottom inlet
Also does anyone know what the high pressure supply fitting is at the PS pump outlet? I lost the oe hose so I have to start from scratch and adapt. Maybe if someone posted a photo of a removed hose? Cheers and beers! Suggestions welcome.
On the heater hoses, the one coming from the head by the oil filter is the outlet going to the heater. Out from the heater ties into the hose coming off the bottom of the fill tank and goes to the thermostat housing. I make a bracket and mount the fill tank on the side of the head.
If you have a brass radiator a good radiator shop can switch the inlet and outlet with the correct size and do a clean job.
Enclose are some pics of the Jeep JK I did. It all worked well.
I have a power steering hose I can post for you.
50harleyrider
10-01-2016, 09:33 AM #43The oe Ford hose connection has the same threads as the benz but an inverted flare. The benz is something different like an AN6 or most likely an M9.5 o-ring connection. I took the connection off the pump for the second photo which doesn't want to open.. I would like to see the oe benz hose at the pump connection, zeeman.
raysorenson
10-02-2016, 05:26 PM #44The Ford fitting does not seal at the flare. It seals at the white plastic square cut ring at the top of the threads. If you can seal the threads, it will not leak.
50harleyrider
10-02-2016, 06:20 PM #45I see the plastic ring you're talking about in the first photo. What you say makes sense as that is a swivel fitting. I plan to use Teflon tape or Loctite 545 on the threads and OTC power steering fluid in the system. Heck it's worth a try and if it works, no adapter required. From what I've gathered, PS fluid isn't critical and the only fluid I need to make sure I use is Zerex orange antifreeze. Thanks Raysorenson.
(10-02-2016, 06:20 PM)50harleyrider I see the plastic ring you're talking about in the first photo. What you say makes sense as that is a swivel fitting. I plan to use Teflon tape or Loctite 545 on the threads and OTC power steering fluid in the system. Heck it's worth a try and if it works, no adapter required. From what I've gathered, PS fluid isn't critical and the only fluid I need to make sure I use is Zerex orange antifreeze. Thanks Raysorenson.
This is the Mercedes style fitting for the pressure line. It is a o-ring pilot fitting. It is a common metric fitting, M16 x 1.5. Summit has the fitting with a 6 A/N on the other side so you could use a 6 A/N fitting and hose.
Also there are three different style Power steering pumps for the OM 606 engine. The one for the USA engine has the plastic tank. Hope this helps you.
(10-02-2016, 06:20 PM)50harleyrider I see the plastic ring you're talking about in the first photo. What you say makes sense as that is a swivel fitting. I plan to use Teflon tape or Loctite 545 on the threads and OTC power steering fluid in the system. Heck it's worth a try and if it works, no adapter required. From what I've gathered, PS fluid isn't critical and the only fluid I need to make sure I use is Zerex orange antifreeze. Thanks Raysorenson.
This is the Mercedes style fitting for the pressure line. It is a o-ring pilot fitting. It is a common metric fitting, M16 x 1.5. Summit has the fitting with a 6 A/N on the other side so you could use a 6 A/N fitting and hose.
Also there are three different style Power steering pumps for the OM 606 engine. The one for the USA engine has the plastic tank. Hope this helps you.
One issue I haven't figured out is vacuum. I am using the large oe Mercedes vacuum line from the pump to the brake booster as it is about the same size and length as the F150 line. It has a tee in it from which I am using the small oe hard plastic line to the turbo and the F150 HVAC controls inside the cab. I elected to bypass the F150 vacuum canister since unlike a gasser, there is now a constant source of vacuum from the diesel pump. The HVAC flaps inside the cab are not working. My question is should I retain the large vacuum cannisters used in the oe Ford to get it to work? Maybe the Mercedes pump just doesn't supply enough instant vacuum through the small hard plastic line to operate the doors and it needs a reservoir canister also?
50harleyrider
03-16-2017, 05:38 PM #47The truck is nearing its first road test. Everything appears to be on que. Baldurs' DSL1 appears to be pretty awesome and simple after you get all the wiring put together. Hopefully it will have enough low end torque to move the truck around with a little thrill but the HX35 is on the shelf and ready if not. I just don't want to lose the grunt so the oe kkk for a little while. I'll try to get a Utube video up as soon as I can test the US Shift Quick 4 TCU. It sure doesn't sound like an F150 anymore. Will be lots of fun showing off and hopefully bye bye to 12 MPG.
One issue I haven't figured out is vacuum. I am using the large oe Mercedes vacuum line from the pump to the brake booster as it is about the same size and length as the F150 line. It has a tee in it from which I am using the small oe hard plastic line to the turbo and the F150 HVAC controls inside the cab. I elected to bypass the F150 vacuum canister since unlike a gasser, there is now a constant source of vacuum from the diesel pump. The HVAC flaps inside the cab are not working. My question is should I retain the large vacuum cannisters used in the oe Ford to get it to work? Maybe the Mercedes pump just doesn't supply enough instant vacuum through the small hard plastic line to operate the doors and it needs a reservoir canister also?
Newbie-read this: Cheap Tricks
617.952-220k-Getting built up
larsalan I guess I need to look at this stupid ass drip shit. What you have to like mess with those elements on the pump? What a fucking hassle. then use some wire to hold the throttle open or some shit?
Simpler=Better
03-17-2017, 10:29 AM #48The truck looks great, if you're still looking for a transfer case with all-time 4WD Jeep grand Cherokees (WJ) had them with cable operated shifters. The ones in V8 jeeps should hold up to a 606.
Newbie-read this: Cheap Tricks
617.952-220k-Getting built up
larsalan I guess I need to look at this stupid ass drip shit. What you have to like mess with those elements on the pump? What a fucking hassle. then use some wire to hold the throttle open or some shit?
Keep everything on the left. Keep the vacuum reservoir between the battery tray and rh fender.
raysorenson
03-17-2017, 12:01 PM #49
Keep everything on the left. Keep the vacuum reservoir between the battery tray and rh fender.
X Double Dot
03-26-2017, 08:53 AM #50Great work. Have you been able to test drive it yet? i'm doing a similar swap http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=7651 and use threads like this to keep my motivation up!
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