+- STD (https://www.superturbodiesel.com/std)
+-- Forum: Other (https://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/forumdisplay.php?fid=19)
+--- Forum: FS / WTB / Buying guides (https://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/forumdisplay.php?fid=8)
+--- Thread: 8mm elements (/showthread.php?tid=191)
RE: 8mm elements - garage - 03-19-2011
(03-18-2011, 09:56 PM)stan someone tell me if i am understanding correctly - could these elements be run on a 616 turbo- if i took a spare 616 n/a IP and had it rebuilt with these elements for a turbo 616 build?
Yes you could.
Keep in mind the 616 isnt meant for a turbo internally, no oil squirters and what not.
And especially not built for loads of power.
It would however be bad ass.
RE: 8mm elements - tomnik - 03-19-2011
(03-18-2011, 09:56 PM)stan someone tell me if i am understanding correctly - could these elements be run on a 616 turbo- if i took a spare 616 n/a IP and had it rebuilt with these elements for a turbo 616 build?
these are MW elements! They only fit to your pump if this a is a MW.
Tom
RE: 8mm elements - stan - 03-19-2011
(03-19-2011, 01:03 AM)tomnik(03-18-2011, 09:56 PM)stan someone tell me if i am understanding correctly - could these elements be run on a 616 turbo- if i took a spare 616 n/a IP and had it rebuilt with these elements for a turbo 616 build?
these are MW elements! They only fit to your pump if this a is a MW.
Tom
i'd have to double check but i believe my n/a 616 IPs (i have two) are both MWs...
does the IP have to be machined out to fit these elements or do they just get dropped as part of an IP rebuild / tuning?
RE: 8mm elements - 300D50 - 03-19-2011
Affaik, it's drop-in.
RE: 8mm elements - stan - 03-19-2011
(03-19-2011, 04:08 AM)300D50 Affaik, it's drop-in.
this is how i feel about that.
![[Image: 08a240f0-4c74-4145-a4d2-f769d509828c.jpg]](http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/08a240f0-4c74-4145-a4d2-f769d509828c.jpg)
and god damn, 11.50 each is awesome. i wanna just buy a set because i *might* be able ot use them at some point. who's going to be the first to try a set out?
RE: 8mm elements - 300D50 - 03-19-2011
Depends who can get their pump setup first I'd guess.
Anyone else notice it comes to $69 for the minimum order? Makes "sexy" seem like a good description of the price!
RE: 8mm elements - mike-81-240d - 03-20-2011
Oh im so in... Anyone order yet? Nothing fishy? Group buy would be sweet.
RE: 8mm elements - garage - 03-20-2011
Well if we do a group order im in on this!
RE: 8mm elements - stan - 03-21-2011
read the thread, the vendor posted and said you can order 6 of them for 11.50 each, no group buy needed.
RE: 8mm elements - ForcedInduction - 03-21-2011
$11.50 is too cheap. They are honestly saying its cheaper to make such an extreme precision piece of hardware than the stamped sheetmetal lower oil pan? Even the upper radiator hose is more expensive from most places!
RE: 8mm elements - Savitas - 03-21-2011
1 418 415 058 does it realy fit to om603 pump?
RE: 8mm elements - raderauto - 03-21-2011
We have received two order from KAZ and Lithuania. If group buy , There is sure that lower shipping cost.
Thanks to everybody.
$11.50~$12.00 is just for test, If the quality is OK for you , welcome larger order.
We also manufacture other element,
please PM me, also email me (richard@raderauto.com)
RE: 8mm elements - Savitas - 03-21-2011
How to buy safely from China???
I have experience in trade with China, so a few tips:
*Never use Western Union (Chinese companies do not use Western Union)
*Use only T/T
*Check recipient (The beneficiary must be company, not individual person. If the recipient shall be a private person and states that it is the tax reduction, then it is a deception).
Be careful when buying from China, as far as possible try to get more information, please do not rush to pay money.
RE: 8mm elements - winmutt - 03-21-2011
(03-21-2011, 02:56 AM)ForcedInduction $11.50 is too cheap. They are honestly saying its cheaper to make such an extreme precision piece of hardware than the stamped sheetmetal lower oil pan? Even the upper radiator hose is more expensive from most places!
This is the going price for the chinese elements.
RE: 8mm elements - garage - 03-21-2011
Well shit, now we just need a shop in the states that can install these correctly..
RE: 8mm elements - mike-81-240d - 03-21-2011
(03-21-2011, 02:57 PM)garage Well shit, now we just need a shop in the states that can install these correctly..
Let us know if you find one...
I checked with my local diesel shop, and they said no dice.
RE: 8mm elements - ForcedInduction - 03-21-2011
(03-21-2011, 09:02 AM)winmutt This is the going price for the chinese elements.
Good enough reason not to support or encourage overseas spammers (raderauto).
RE: 8mm elements - Savitas - 03-22-2011
(03-21-2011, 11:13 PM)ForcedInduction(03-21-2011, 09:02 AM)winmutt This is the going price for the chinese elements.
Good enough reason not to support or encourage overseas spammers (raderauto).
With my post I just wanted to say Raderauto is spammer.
(03-21-2011, 03:56 AM)Savitas 1 418 415 058 does it realy fit to om603 pump?
Could anyone give me an advice?
Thanks
RE: 8mm elements - winmutt - 03-22-2011
(03-21-2011, 11:13 PM)ForcedInduction(03-21-2011, 09:02 AM)winmutt This is the going price for the chinese elements.
Good enough reason not to support or encourage overseas spammers (raderauto).
Your opinion has been noted Moloch although he is here by my invitation.
RE: 8mm elements - dasboost - 03-22-2011
Hello first post here, but I have been following you guys and this post for a while. I think I could get one of these pumps built. And I want a set or two for myself.
RE: 8mm elements - winmutt - 03-23-2011
Alright who wants to be the guinea pig? I will organize a group by if someone is willing to step up to the plate and make a single order.
RE: 8mm elements - dasboost - 03-23-2011
How much would it be shipped? I'll try it, but no guarantee how fast it will be done.
RE: 8mm elements - mike-81-240d - 03-23-2011
(03-23-2011, 01:51 PM)dasboost How much would it be shipped? I'll try it, but no guarantee how fast it will be done.
What so are you saying you're able to do the pump work?
RE: 8mm elements - dasboost - 03-23-2011
Possibly. I would want to try it on my car first.
RE: 8mm elements - Dieselkraut - 03-23-2011
Ok great news ..... My injection shop here in Northern Ca said he wants to mod the MW pump over the M pump because he said its better to fine tune but the governor is a bitch compared to the M pump governor.
So he is seeing how much he can get the elements for and if its too much he will use the chinese ones we can supply. So at the moment im holding off on the group buy. If his cost is too much then we can all talk about me taking the plunge on ordering a small batch for my self so we know it is safe to do the group buy.
He is going to get back to me with prices and how much time everything will take.
So far it 1k plus elements. I told him others might want more but i want a good 200rwhp. He said not a problem so everyone cross their fingers i should have exact prices next week then after that i will send him my pump and i have the extra cash things should move faster then we have seen else where.
CROSS THOSE FINGERS!
RE: 8mm elements - Captain America - 03-23-2011
Crossed!
RE: 8mm elements - DeliveryValve - 03-28-2011
Diesel Power Systems @ 600 Enterprise Way Bakersfield, CA 93307 is willing to do a mass production install of the 8mm Chinese elements in a Bosch MW pump for around $400-$500. The price will include the labor to take apart and clean the pump, new gaskets and the installation of 8mm Chinese elements. The price does not include additional hard parts (bearings, etc ) replacement if the pump needs it. Chris at DPS told me the pump will be ready to install with the end user only setting the timing and low idle speed.
They have 6 test benches in their facility, of which 4 of them are Bosch. Chris told me they will calibrate the MW using a machine with a graduated glass and will do calculations by hand as to what settings would be right for the 8mm.
The caveat is Chris does not trust the Chinese elements. But he is willing to work with it. He says because of the unknown quality, there could be calibration issues and the metallurgy will most likely not be the same and the elements may wear down faster.
With that said, for this price, he requires that this be a group buy. The pumps along with the elements shipped from the owner to his facility around the same time. His estimate will take 2 weeks to set all the pumps.
If we are going to do this group install. We need to start a list of who is fully committed. Order the elements and get the pumps to Chris at the same time.
You are free to call him and ask questions. Although he is quite busy and took him a week and half to get back to me. Diesel Power System phone number is 661-397-9400 ask for Chris. Tell him Richard told you about this 8mm Chinese Element MW pump install.
Oh one more thing, he is willing to get Genuine Bosch 8mm Elements for about $250-$300 a pop or can get a better price if there is a group buy.
.
RE: 8mm elements - garage - 03-28-2011
How many people are needed for the group buy?
This is super exciting.
I want to be fully committed, i will let you know when i can be.
$400-500 sounds way more than resonable IMO..
However, bosch elements are out of my price range..
RE: 8mm elements - DeliveryValve - 03-28-2011
(03-28-2011, 05:54 PM)garage
How many people are needed for the group buy?
This is super exciting.
..
You know I am not clear as to how many. I think in our conversation he said 5 or so.
.
RE: 8mm elements - 300SD81 - 03-28-2011
Damn, this shows the week after I spend $600 on spring break....would have skipped the trip for an 8mm IP.
Whats the time frame here? I'm gonna start saving up again now.
RE: 8mm elements - 300D50 - 03-28-2011
Oh goody! will they touch 10mm?
RE: 8mm elements - garage - 03-28-2011
Im with SD81 on this one, saving for this deal starting today.
RE: 8mm elements - DeliveryValve - 03-29-2011
(03-28-2011, 07:54 PM)300D50 Oh goody! will they touch 10mm?
In my conversation with Chris today, I think his company would touch 10mm elements. He probably could get Bosch 10mm since he can get 8mm, but would also be willing to work with Chinese 10mm if you provide the elements. He did told me that since these are not Bosch elements, he could not offer his standard warranty. We'll have to work with him as to what workmanship guarantee he can offer.
.
RE: 8mm elements - Captain America - 03-29-2011
Is there a price difference in setup/tuning if bosch elements are used?
This sounds awesome and all, But i am SOOOOOOOO skeptical of the china POS elements
RE: 8mm elements - DeliveryValve - 03-29-2011
(03-29-2011, 01:17 AM)Captain America Is there a price difference in setup/tuning if bosch elements are used?
This sounds awesome and all, But i am SOOOOOOOO skeptical of the china POS elements
No price difference. It will be the same $400-$500 setup and gaskets, plus you get their warranty.
Yeah I am skeptical too about the Chinese crap, but I am willing go for it.. $300 vs $11.50..... Of course you can always buy tomnik's 7mm Holly elements at €75 (or current exchange rate $106 a pop). But DPS would probably not give you their standard warranty because it is not a Bosch element.
.
RE: 8mm elements - Captain America - 03-29-2011
Yeah expensive either way I guess. Have a time frame in mind of when this will happen? soon? a ways off?
Another thing. If the elements turn out to be dog poop, what will he charge to go back to the original elements?
RE: 8mm elements - 300SD81 - 03-29-2011
How about used Bosch elements? I'm sure I saw a list of vehicles that used the MW and what size they were floating around here somewhere. Should be relatively cheap if you disassemble the pump at the part yard. Last time I went through the pullapart lady told me to just take them when I tried to buy some small random parts.
RE: 8mm elements - DeliveryValve - 03-29-2011
No time frame right now. But I do as a courtesy have to get back to him to tell him what's up.
I don't know what the cost would be to return it back to stock if it is crappy. I'll have to ask him. But I do suggest that you keep an extra stock pump for the "just in case" scenario.
.
RE: 8mm elements - Captain America - 03-29-2011
I have three pumps
!I shall start saving as well.... Fuk it Right? Hopefully all turns out well
RE: 8mm elements - DeliveryValve - 03-29-2011
(03-29-2011, 01:41 AM)300SD81 How about used Bosch elements? I'm sure I saw a list of vehicles that used the MW and what size they were floating around here somewhere. Should be relatively cheap if you disassemble the pump at the part yard. Last time I went through the pullapart lady told me to just take them when I tried to buy some small random parts.
I have no idea. You'd have to ask him. My understanding is 10mm elements are what's out there.
(03-29-2011, 01:46 AM)Captain America I have three pumps
I shall start saving as well.... Fuk it Right? Hopefully all turns out well
You took the words right out of my mouth!
All for the sake of cheap POWER!
.
RE: 8mm elements - Captain America - 03-29-2011
Haha sounds good buddy
RE: 8mm elements - 300D50 - 03-29-2011
(03-29-2011, 12:22 AM)DeliveryValve In my conversation with Chris today, I think his company would touch 10mm elements. He probably could get Bosch 10mm since he can get 8mm, but would also be willing to work with Chinese 10mm if you provide the elements. He did told me that since these are not Bosch elements, he could not offer his standard warranty. We'll have to work with him as to what workmanship guarantee he can offer.
Nice. I'm tempted to go 10 latter on, but for now 8 sounds like the deal.
As far as warranty goes, a basic "We'll give a cheap look-over if you ship it out, and if it's not the plungers, and turns out to be a workmanship defect, we'll work out the repair cost as needed." style one would work.
But beggars can't be choosers, and for this price, I'd even take a tail-light guarantee.
RE: 8mm elements - garage - 03-29-2011
Beggers cant be choosers is right!
Right now this seems like a viable option.
We should get a small group order for the chinese elements, get them installed and see how they work out...its better than not knowing at all.
RE: 8mm elements - 300SD81 - 03-29-2011
Heres that list I was referring to...
http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=0AhziZiPJhcdbcFpNTVNxcDN1U1pkeXF5QUowWHFSQ0E&gid=0
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/thread-list-of-bosch-ip-elements-and-camshafts
Didn't have as much info as I was hoping for.. but it looks like the 10mm is VERY common, just have to figure out what cars those pumps were used in.
RE: 8mm elements - DeliveryValve - 03-29-2011
(03-29-2011, 11:56 AM)300SD81 Heres that list I was referring to...
http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=0AhziZiPJhcdbcFpNTVNxcDN1U1pkeXF5QUowWHFSQ0E&gid=0
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/thread-list-of-bosch-ip-elements-and-camshafts
Didn't have as much info as I was hoping for.. but it looks like the 10mm is VERY common, just have to figure out what cars those pumps were used in.
I feel 10mm elements are way too big. Your planned install of the GT2256 will not keep up with it. 8mm is at threshold of being too big. I think Tomnik's 7mm Holly elements are perfect, but not in my price range for my application.
.
RE: 8mm elements - Dieselkraut - 03-29-2011
(03-29-2011, 02:15 PM)DeliveryValve(03-29-2011, 11:56 AM)300SD81 Heres that list I was referring to...
http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=0AhziZiPJhcdbcFpNTVNxcDN1U1pkeXF5QUowWHFSQ0E&gid=0
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/thread-list-of-bosch-ip-elements-and-camshafts
Didn't have as much info as I was hoping for.. but it looks like the 10mm is VERY common, just have to figure out what cars those pumps were used in.
I feel 10mm elements are way too big. Your planned install of the GT2256 will not keep up with it. 8mm is at threshold of being too big. I think Tomnik's 7mm Holly elements are perfect, but not in my price range for my application.
.
First off where do i find the w123s with the chick in the picture?? Second.....what will he do just drop them in and make sure its runs right? or will he tweak it too?
The guy in nor cal said he can tweak it too. But im all for cheaper and for the people worried about the chinese elements dont forget bosch makes our injectors in india now so im sure it wont be long til they have them make the other metal parts too!
RE: 8mm elements - DeliveryValve - 03-29-2011
(03-29-2011, 04:32 PM)Dieselkraut First off where do i find the w123s with the chick in the picture?? Second.....what will he do just drop them in and make sure its runs right? or will he tweak it too?
The guy in nor cal said he can tweak it too. But im all for cheaper and for the people worried about the chinese elements dont forget bosch makes our injectors in india now so im sure it wont be long til they have them make the other metal parts too!
The w123 pic is a one off fabrication signature. No other pics are available.
Chris understands we are trying to get more fuel out of the pump for more horsepower. My conversation with Chris is basically their calculations are their "tweaks" to make the pump run right on the engine. He stated the pump would be ready to install with only timing and slow idle adjustment made by the end user, so my assumption is for the price he will calibrate it once. That price might be different if we ask him to make several adjustments after testing it in the car. Of course I am only speculating, so you'd have to talk to him yourself to get clarification. In the meantime, I did shoot him an e-mail with some questions and hopefully he is not too busy so I can hear from him shortly.
.
RE: 8mm elements - dieselmeken - 03-30-2011
Have anyone made the conversion from 5,5 to 8 mm in the 617 MW pump? I dont think so, As told previous in this topic, it doesent fit with the numbers you have.
The only way to do this is with custom maked plungers in the old element, or the 10 mm from RS5 pump, but the 10 mm is to big ( my own reflection, been there done that.)
One more question, Why bulid on the old 617 engine if you look for power?
RE: 8mm elements - 300D50 - 03-30-2011
I can't speak for everyone, but I personally like the 617, it's rugged, over-engineered, revs good, and will take a lot of abuse before it fails.
Also, most of us have one already, and it's much easier to get a 617 than a 60x stateside, so that could be part of it.
RE: 8mm elements - DeliveryValve - 03-30-2011
^^^ Exactly for me. Parts are easy to get. My local pick and pull yards have 617s all the time. I've must of seen three 60x in my local yards in the past 5 years, where I've come across probably 100 or more 617s during the same time frame.
Regarding the 8mm elements. I don't recall hearing anybody using them on the MW. tomnik seems to think we can use these even though the lift on our pumps are shorter. As of now, the only way to find out is to try them.
As Capt'n says "*** ** ***** Hopefully all turns out well"
.