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+--- Thread: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project (/showthread.php?tid=5618)
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 01-29-2015
Yes, the max rpm now is 6000. That sound! 9out10 thinks its an Audi 2.2 turbo until they see it
Remap changed everything. Spool now starts at 2600rpm in 3rd gear and 4000 is full boost. I am so relieved... I was afraid it is gonne be usless piece of sh_t and now it has turned into holy sh_t
Cant wait to make new videos but in this weather, it spins the wheels even at motorway speed
(01-26-2015, 11:39 AM)seanyt Just got an edc 8mm pump. For my compound turbo conversion.
Has your tuner been able to get your ecu limits up to 6k rpm?
My tuner hasn't looked at it yet. But I've socketed my ecu and he has the files dumped
Loving all these edc tuning lately . Mine is in a Lexus is200.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - raidaru - 01-29-2015
visor, what clutch kit are u using? still with the stock 5 speed manual?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 01-29-2015
Stock 5 speed manual and the clutch is what we call cevlar (actually made of the material like truck clutches). My friend makes them mostly for TDI models but can order any size I guess. It is good till 500-800Nm (depending on diameter) and costs around €30.
(01-29-2015, 05:04 PM)raidaru visor, what clutch kit are u using? still with the stock 5 speed manual?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Hario' - 01-29-2015
Do you maybe mean kevlar?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 01-30-2015
Yes kevlar. But it is not actual kevlar, because thar proved to be bad in city traffic. Looks like this (this one is in my Golf)
(01-29-2015, 07:38 PM)Hario Do you maybe mean kevlar?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 01-31-2015
Roads dried up a bit, so I could make a video:
80-220km/h https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iM7K7p57EiI
Not in this vid, but interestingly the tacho stops at 220km/h and the rpm goes up till 6000 and bounces on the revlimiter at around 260km/h. Maybe I need a longer differential. With sper
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - bruno_pinho - 01-31-2015
That boost was used in this video?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 01-31-2015
The boost is 1.8bar with zero smoke, reached the limits of the pump (again) :/
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - raidaru - 01-31-2015
(01-31-2015, 05:58 PM)ViSoR The boost is 1.8bar with zero smoke, reached the limits of the pump (again) :/Do u have full rack travel in the pump? I think at 4.8v PWM is maximum rack travel, at least in om606 EDC pump that is. Dieselmeken has 8mm new design elements that can deliver huge amounts of fuel and that in a short injection time. With that elements u can reach both turbo and engine limits, and even beyond
U have a PM 
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 02-01-2015
ECU gives max now I think. Yes, there are bigger elements from Dieselmeken, I had them in my hand the other day, my mechanic and Gören have a good relationship but (I was not 100% satisfied with their quality to be honest) I think this power is enough for now, I would just like to have more usability, efficiency from this setup. A bit lower spool with another manifold or a bit more rpm.
Does anyone know what is the healthy maximal rpm for the stock OM605? My friend uses the (stock) OM606 engine with HX50+compressor and a modified Meken 8mm pump on 7000rpm. Video: https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=718386821573838&pnref=story
Could I rev my OM605 at 6500 for instance or would it jump in my lap thru the windshield?
(01-31-2015, 06:33 PM)raidaru(01-31-2015, 05:58 PM)ViSoR The boost is 1.8bar with zero smoke, reached the limits of the pump (again) :/Do u have full rack travel in the pump? I think at 4.8v PWM is maximum rack travel, at least in om606 EDC pump that is. Dieselmeken has 8mm new design elements that can deliver huge amounts of fuel and that in a short injection time. With that elements u can reach both turbo and engine limits, and even beyond
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - madmog - 02-04-2015
Out of interest, how does a 300hp OM605 W202 compare to a C36 or C43AMG?
Is the fuel economy (or potential) still better with the extra power?
Do the braking, suspension & wheels need to be upgraded or are they good enough already?
My interest in the OM605 is because it'll fit my W114 but having got a running W202 as a donor, enjoying it as a runaround and then seeing the price of the C36s and C43s (£2500-£5000) I'm tempted to get one of them as a runaround. But I find the big wheels and leather interior of the AMGs a bit OTT.
In short I'm wondering if it's easier to get an AMG, debadge and sell the interior & wheels or to get a C250DT and add power.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 02-05-2015
By measuring with a stopwatch, my C250TDT was faster even at the 260HP stage than the C36 / C43 (data on zeperfs.com). And now it is in a different league... my 100-200km is the same as the C63AMG.
The consumption is very variable, depending on your feet. My lowest is rollin' around like a grandpa is 7 liters / 100 km.
My highest is 110 l / 100 km. No, your eyes aren't bad. 110l/100km !!! Achieved by the remapping process. Remap -> full throttle 600m -> remap -> full throttle 600m... after 4 hours the full tank was empty
The brakes are useless at high speed breakings. 2-3 hard breaking and everthing goes to flames. I have C36 breakes at my friend, but that doesn't look much bigger, so I don't think it's worth the uprading... maybe from E-class AMG.
(02-04-2015, 09:54 AM)madmog Out of interest, how does a 300hp OM605 W202 compare to a C36 or C43AMG?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Hario' - 02-05-2015
I've spent months working out best cheap W202 brake upgrade so this is what I found out:
2006 W220 S230cdi 4-pot brembo calipers are direct fit onto your w202 hubs, also need 330 mm discs from 2000-2007 270/320cdi (46.5mm offset). The calipers are £40 each from breakers by me, you will also need to make hydraulic lines about 100mm longer than stock. FYI
(02-05-2015, 02:24 AM)ViSoR By measuring with a stopwatch, my C250TDT was faster even at the 260HP stage than the C36 / C43 (data on zeperfs.com). And now it is in a different league... my 100-200km is the same as the C63AMG.
The consumption is very variable, depending on your feet. My lowest is rollin' around like a grandpa is 7 liters / 100 km.
My highest is 110 l / 100 km. No, your eyes aren't bad. 110l/100km !!! Achieved by the remapping process. Remap -> full throttle 600m -> remap -> full throttle 600m... after 4 hours the full tank was empty
The brakes are useless at high speed breakings. 2-3 hard breaking and everthing goes to flames. I have C36 breakes at my friend, but that doesn't look much bigger, so I don't think it's worth the uprading... maybe from E-class AMG.
[quote='madmog' pid='69920' dateline='1423061695']
Out of interest, how does a 300hp OM605 W202 compare to a C36 or C43AMG?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - raidaru - 02-05-2015
(02-05-2015, 10:27 AM)Hario I've spent months working out best cheap W202 brake upgrade so this is what I found out:
2006 W220 S230cdi 4-pot brembo calipers are direct fit onto your w202 hubs, also need 330 mm discs from 2000-2007 270/320cdi (46.5mm offset). The calipers are £40 each from breakers by me, you will also need to make hydraulic lines about 100mm longer than stock. FYI
W220 was manufactured 2005 last year, at least TecDoc says that........ it's a good upgrade though, 330mm perforated disc and 4-pot caliper. I think u need minimum 17" wheels for that
)) P.S om605 stock discs are 288mm and C36 are 316mm , so best option is 330mm if u have 17" wheels or bigger
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - erx - 02-05-2015
I am also looking for bigger W202 brakes and I bought w211 E320cdi 4-pot calipers, they are 312mm. Standard E320cdi have common 1-pot 295mm and I think only Avantgarde or cars with sport suspension have 4-pot. I found 330mm on e400cdi but they have disk offset 64,5 so they won't fit.
I also found that W210 E50AMG/C36AMG have offset 46,5 and diameter 316mm so I'm going to buy them for my W211 calipers and if needed just machining them to 312mm. I don't know where you'll find 46,5 offset 330mm disks because W211 and W220 have both bigger offset. I looked through many catalogues, please correct me if i'm wrong.
Edit: I have to correct myself, 46,5 offset 330mm comes from W203, so no problem with them also.
(02-05-2015, 10:27 AM)Hario I've spent months working out best cheap W202 brake upgrade so this is what I found out:
2006 W220 S230cdi 4-pot brembo calipers are direct fit onto your w202 hubs, also need 330 mm discs from 2000-2007 270/320cdi (46.5mm offset). The calipers are £40 each from breakers by me, you will also need to make hydraulic lines about 100mm longer than stock. FYI
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Hario' - 02-05-2015
Mmm maybe the advert said 2000-2006 w220, anyway they're big and aluminium and say brembo and flat black colour and real cheap.
W202 forum told me the w220 calipers fit so I've bought one to check as it was only £40, I will report back!
2000-2007 270/320cdi is w203 I think?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - erx - 02-05-2015
(02-05-2015, 04:05 PM)Hario Mmm maybe the advert said 2000-2006 w220, anyway they're big and aluminium and say brembo and flat black colour and real cheap.Yes, disks should be from w203 and they have also many different sizes, 330mm is from avantgarde or sport suspension I think.
W202 forum told me the w220 calipers fit so I've bought one to check as it was only £40, I will report back!
2000-2007 270/320cdi is w203 I think?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 02-07-2015
Somebody on the maximal RPM? Is 6400 OK with stock internals?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - erx - 02-07-2015
(02-07-2015, 01:44 PM)ViSoR Somebody on the maximal RPM? Is 6400 OK with stock internals?
I think it's ok, my stock 606 goes to 6500, no problems at the moment.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Hario' - 02-09-2015
(01-28-2015, 03:45 PM)erx Does 605 have one or two sensors near starter motor? My 1994 604 has two, upper is for ecu and lower in oil pan is for tacho, it reads starter motor teeth on flywheel. I swapped to 606 and put that tacho sensor back and tacho is working, I use mechanic pump.
\I think my 606 only has one flywheel sensor high up, maybe I missed lower one for tacho?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - erx - 02-09-2015
(02-09-2015, 06:44 AM)Hario(01-28-2015, 03:45 PM)erx Does 605 have one or two sensors near starter motor? My 1994 604 has two, upper is for ecu and lower in oil pan is for tacho, it reads starter motor teeth on flywheel. I swapped to 606 and put that tacho sensor back and tacho is working, I use mechanic pump.
\I think my 606 only has one flywheel sensor high up, maybe I missed lower one for tacho?
Yes, 606 from w210 has only one, if 605 has two sensors then you have to drill and machine hole for second sensor in oil pan like I did(when swapping to 606). Otherwise tacho will not work with 606. Older models like 124 have separate sensor for tacho, newer models' tacho gets it's information from ecu I think.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - sorin_cel - 02-10-2015
my 605 revs close to 6500rpm. 160km/h in 3rd gear, at flat out, with 3.46 diff(from stock om604), only 90cc pump.
your video 80-220km/h, it's absolutely mad.
fantastic pull!you need a higher speedometer!
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 02-13-2015
I had the time today to put the car back on the dyno. Still lack of fuel in the upper rpm region but I am satisfied with the numbers still.
351 HP / 510 Nm
GRAPH: http://postimg.org/image/sqxb38dnv/
VIDEO: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=un1hCjGfvHQ
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - bruno_pinho - 02-13-2015
The maximum boost on the dyno was 1.8bar?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - seanyt - 02-13-2015
Why the fuel drop at 4700rpm
Is there still a torque or fuel limit in the ecu map?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 02-13-2015
(02-13-2015, 01:28 PM)bruno_pinho The maximum boost on the dyno was 1.8bar?
Yes.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 02-13-2015
(02-13-2015, 02:45 PM)seanyt Why the fuel drop at 4700rpm
Is there still a torque or fuel limit in the ecu map?
I think thats the end of the pump. No more fuel. Upgrading from 6mm to 7mm gave +90HP
Is there a stronger OM605 with Kontor 7mm elements?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - seanyt - 02-13-2015
Looks too sudden for pump fuel limit.
Looks like the ecu or maybe lift pump is contributing.
I'm more thinking ecu as it seems to hold the fuelling at a set limit. After that point.
It also coincides with mantaheads limit on his edc at 4700rpm
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - bruno_pinho - 02-14-2015
Why you did not do a dyno with 2 bar of boost? See smoke for that.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - PedroFerreira - 02-15-2015
how big is the exaust turbin from your holset?
nice project
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 03-03-2015
If I remember correctly, the exhaust is 55/65mm.
Bruno: 1.8 bar was the max what we could squeez out, almost closed WG. From 4000 rom there is only a bit of smoke left.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - bruno_pinho - 03-03-2015
I do not understand because it does not more pressure ... with closed wastegate had to do more ...
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Ksteen2 - 03-05-2015
I think you have to small exhaust and need a new manifold, thats why you did'nt get more power.
hansebanger77 did 414hp in 606 with 7mm 120cc ppd pump.
i think you can get close upp too that with yours
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Larotj - 03-05-2015
well he got already more horsepower per cylinder (414/6=69 and 350/5=70) pretty impressive numbers for an 2.5l diesel.
i hope you figure out where is the problem right now, do you monitor backpressur from the exhaust?
Phil
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Ksteen2 - 03-05-2015
yes, I didnt think of that
but steel, I think its the manifold and exhaust..
anyway, its a good 5cyl diesel
badass ride !
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Larotj - 03-07-2015
Booster wrote in the other thread that the mapping sensor of the edc can only handle 1.7bar, what might be the problem why you can't make mor than 1.8bar of boost?
Phil
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Turbo - 03-07-2015
(01-24-2015, 04:32 PM)ViSoR visor, can you please confirm that you have been able to change the rev limit succesfully
Thanks
Update:
We have remapped the ECU, the vehicle is a beast!
Unfortunately I was right about the exhaust. Upgrading from 60mm to 76mm, didn't do anything! No boost pressure change, no power gain, no faster spool, no nothing. A bit quieter I guess... I give you my word, an open 60mm exhaust is far enough till ~350HP!
Next week I will make you new a video, I couldn't get the car from the mechanic yet because it starts badly. The fuel flows back from the pump to the tank, because some fuelvalve fault since the element change. Fix that, and than I will go to dyno again.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 03-13-2015
(03-05-2015, 03:05 PM)Larotj well he got already more horsepower per cylinder (414/6=69 and 350/5=70) pretty impressive numbers for an 2.5l diesel.
i hope you figure out where is the problem right now, do you monitor backpressur from the exhaust?
Phil
Oh no, we did not monitor anything. But with these sizes I dont think too large emap is the problem. You ccould shout thru this turbine thats how big it is
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 03-13-2015
(03-07-2015, 03:09 AM)Larotj Booster wrote in the other thread that the mapping sensor of the edc can only handle 1.7bar, what might be the problem why you can't make mor than 1.8bar of boost?
Phil
Do you think the ecu limits the fuel because of the overpressure of the sensor? I could try to cheat it with a resistor or something... but to be onest I trust my chiptuner, if there is a limitation for that, he must have disabled it.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 03-13-2015
(03-07-2015, 06:30 AM)Turbo(01-24-2015, 04:32 PM)ViSoR visor, can you please confirm that you have been able to change the rev limit succesfully
Thanks
Yes, no problems, we can rev it as high we want.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Turbo - 03-16-2015
the dyno graf show maximum 5500 and not 6000, why is that?
what MAP-sensor are you using, Manifold Absolute Pressure,?
what is the fuel pressure before the injectionpump?
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Hario' - 03-19-2015
The 605 auto is exactly the same as the 606 auto, with only one flywheel sensor. But the flywheels are different, so you have to keep the flywheel with the car if you change engines.
So I have W202 C250TD, i fitted 606 and used 605 flywheel and everything works, clocks and ECU (EDC pump and 722.6).
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - Hario' - 03-19-2015
Oh awesome vid! I didn't realise it was a WAGON! Badass ride.
Could you elaborate on the 'kolar'? chip you have please?
Beers, H.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 03-19-2015
(03-16-2015, 07:41 AM)Turbo the dyno graf show maximum 5500 and not 6000, why is that?
what MAP-sensor are you using, Manifold Absolute Pressure,?
what is the fuel pressure before the injectionpump?
We measured the car 4 times. Maybe the dyno guy didn't rev it on this graph till revlimit, because there was no more power gain over 5000rpm. We even measured without the €10 sport air filter, the powergain was 0,5HP
Everything is OEM. Sensors, manifold, cooler, piping etc.I dont know anything about the fuel pressure, maybe that is way the power drops at high rpms.
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 03-19-2015
(03-19-2015, 08:00 AM)Hario
Oh awesome vid! I didn't realise it was a WAGON! Badass ride.
Could you elaborate on the 'kolar'? chip you have please?
Beers, H.
Thanks, just another old booringblue diesel Mercedes wagon - what the EVOs think, when I flash them on the motorway
The remap is done by Szabolcs Kollár. http://www.kollarchiptuning.hu/
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 03-29-2015
Hey,
does anyone know how to disable the neutral rpm limiter? (Manual tranny). Is there a cluch pedal sensor? Impossible to launch at 3800 rpm with a HX35
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - bruno_pinho - 03-29-2015
My does not have none of that
Can accelerate 5500rpm stopped ..
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - ViSoR - 03-29-2015
(03-29-2015, 08:11 AM)bruno_pinho My does not have none of that
Can accelerate 5500rpm stopped ..
Interesting, but you are lucky
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - mantahead - 03-30-2015
hi,
i think your hitting the same limiter that i hit, it cuts fuel about 4800rpm.
i was told, it was the end of the scale in the ecu, and that the whole ecu map would need rescaled to get more rpm.
mine would rev to 6000rpm but fuel cut from 4800rpm
RE: C250TD OM605 300HP+ Street Project - bruno_pinho - 03-30-2015
I still say that my electronic does not cut ace 4900 makes power up to 5500 ...
I hope to get clean soon ... I still can not go to the dyno