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+--- Thread: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm (/showthread.php?tid=6548)
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - starynovy - 12-27-2015
To sa to sklada, jedna krasa ked je vsetko nove a leskle. Dlho som tu nebol, ale dovod mojho dymenia bol podfukujuci EGR ventil v zatazi, a zadrete vyrive klapky.
![[Image: 23.jpg]](http://entwicklung.wz.cz/merc/23.jpg)
![[Image: 24.jpg]](http://entwicklung.wz.cz/merc/24.jpg)
![[Image: 26.jpg]](http://entwicklung.wz.cz/merc/26.jpg)
A tu niekde bol predtym ten EGR bazmek. Auto uz ide ako drak, neporovnatelne.
For others, I had problems with heavy smoke under load too, especially in higher revs. It seems to be common to CDI engines that EGR valve fails somehow. Mine was blowing by gases even when closed. Also those swirl flaps were so gunked up by soot the could not move at all and port was 1/2 of its original size due to build up. Everything cleaned up, flaps torn out and their holes welded up with AC TIG, same for EGR valve body, removed and replaced with plain aluminium tube. Cars goes like when it left factory.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - tuikku - 12-27-2015
(12-26-2015, 08:16 AM)MartinB I think the best way for you is contact Dieselmeken from your country
Maybe Turbo is interested in this case because of is it really possible inrease fuel flow during injector ~40% using ~11% higher pressure without changing parts in there.
155mm is quite a lot.
In 6 cyl mb engine it meas very close to 1000nm torq and 400hp.
I have made a couple of cars with AMG injectors and they needs here 1800bar to rice that level.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 12-27-2015
I also wondered at, that's too much. So..later i will see. Is there big difference in power with head porting?
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 12-27-2015
Starynovy: Vypadá to hodně dobře, jak tak koukám
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - tuikku - 12-27-2015
(12-27-2015, 12:49 PM)MartinB I also wondered at, that's too much. So..later i will see. Is there big difference in power with head porting?
You don´t need that.
After you get over 400hp from your engine.
Now ~580hp from OM648 and practically no power mods in engine, only stiffer valve springs.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 12-27-2015
But i have OM611 not 613
Stiffer valve springs from where?
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 12-27-2015
580hp??? What type of turbo? And injectors? It´s incredible performance
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - Turbo - 12-28-2015
(12-27-2015, 04:09 PM)tuikku(12-27-2015, 12:49 PM)MartinB I also wondered at, that's too much. So..later i will see. Is there big difference in power with head porting?
You don´t need that.
After you get over 400hp from your engine.
Now ~580hp from OM648 and practically no power mods in engine, only stiffer valve springs.
It would in did be very interesting to know what is needed for that out put since that is exactly what I am looking for
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - tuikku - 12-28-2015
(12-28-2015, 03:49 AM)Turbo(12-27-2015, 04:09 PM)tuikku(12-27-2015, 12:49 PM)MartinB I also wondered at, that's too much. So..later i will see. Is there big difference in power with head porting?
You don´t need that.
After you get over 400hp from your engine.
Now ~580hp from OM648 and practically no power mods in engine, only stiffer valve springs.
It would in did be very interesting to know what is needed for that out put since that is exactly what I am looking for
Very big injectors.
Holset hx40 Super
Very big cooler
Stiffer valve springs
Gridle plate + steel bolts crank/c-rod
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 12-28-2015
Stiffer valve springs are from where?
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - Turbo - 12-28-2015
(12-28-2015, 02:50 PM)Well tuikku can you reveal exactly what injector and who make them since I guess this is the ones BSR is using and and how reliable they areBoost?(12-28-2015, 03:49 AM)Turbo(12-27-2015, 04:09 PM)tuikku You don´t need that.
After you get over 400hp from your engine.
Now ~580hp from OM648 and practically no power mods in engine, only stiffer valve springs.
It would in did be very interesting to know what is needed for that out put since that is exactly what I am looking for
Very big injectors.
Holset hx40 Super
Very big cooler
Stiffer valve springs
Gridle plate + steel bolts crank/c-rod
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - tuikku - 12-29-2015
.
No
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - Turbo - 12-29-2015
thanks for that gteat information
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - tuikku - 12-29-2015
.
You think that I do not have the right to decide myself, what to tell and not.
Your trouble is that you don´t want to find answers for yourself, always asking.
And asking many times the very same questions.
And to me it seems that you do not still believe, or understand.
It has not been so easy to me to find solutions to certain things and I am not telling all here just like that.
There is a reason, why I am here.
And it is not economical in any ways.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - Turbo - 12-29-2015
If you think that I have not search for information and put down a lot of fa... work, well I can tell you that you are badly mistaken, but to often I have find out in the end that the one that claim can not or do not know in the end, the question is now it seam like you belong to that group.
If I am not mistaken you have said a lot of claims you have not stud up for, you forgotten out last e mail? I always has the idea of sharing is going to be in the common good of this forum
simply if you do not want to share perhaps you can give light what you are doing here so I and some other people can understand it because I am in the dark there, but do not worry, I promise you I will never ask you again.
I wish you best of luck in your projects
In the end I apologize to MartinB for putting this here I do not like it but Mr tuikku is not that keen to answer pm or e mails, please MartinB continue with your great project looking forward to read more about it
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - Tito - 12-30-2015
I agree man, this forum is for helping each other out. I would never hold back any info/knowledge I have. I learned a lot (everything STD based) from this forum, so I'm would like to help back. What else would you do on here?
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - tuikku - 12-30-2015
(12-30-2015, 02:33 AM)Tito I agree man, this forum is for helping each other out. I would never hold back any info/knowledge I have. I learned a lot (everything STD based) from this forum, so I'm would like to help back. What else would you do on here?
Tito, a personal question: Have you shared anything here according to cdi tech. ?
Turbo has not ...
I have, a lot.
Basically everything here in this Martin topic I wrote 2011 here.
Can you find here new information from cdi, what is true and tested and not me wrote ?
Why don´t you just read my writings here and learn something about cdi working principals ...
Perhaps after that even you have something to share, who knows.
There is something I like to share and something I don´t.
It does not make me better, or worst person, it is my right.
You have that right also, I have never ever blamed you that you have not shared here enough knowledge.
Maybe, after spending enough time and money and time and money to this hobby, you might understand my opinion too.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - barrote - 12-30-2015
hello fine people !!! wish u happy new year to all...
if my opinion matters! sometimes giving too much information on a fórum result in "hold back type" acusations. i have been through that.
these days anyone who wich to know about R/D is better PM otherwise we may end up dispersing "out of knowlegde" info. at least is my way.
there are many persons writing in this fórum that is actions and questions resemble very poor knowlegde on the matter... likewise there are people who opens some light in such matters.
CDI despite i have one in my garage, never messed with it yet, reason simple i dont know how to mod the ECU or even hook it to a PC, wich soft app to read it, and all that very importante thing.... that many tend to be left as a second option.
personally what i would like to see here was a post explaining this basic procedure!!!
thanks , and martinB sorry for the highjacking, wich u good luck with the build.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 12-30-2015
Yes, Tuikku. I have a lot of knowledges from your topics here, mbworld and mersuforum. It is invaluable. And I can understand that some things can be described almost as a patent. I cant remember how many hours i spent for finding and comparing the various parts (engine, brakes, transmission, interior) in EPC. And thats only small part.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - tuikku - 12-30-2015
(12-30-2015, 06:06 AM)MartinB Yes, Tuikku. I have a lot of knowledges from your topics here, mbworld and mersuforum. It is invaluable. And I can understand that some things can be described almost as a patent. I cant remember how many hours i spent for finding and comparing the various parts (engine, brakes, transmission, interior) in EPC. And thats only small part.
Thank you Martin, try Mitsub. Evo springs, they fits
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 12-30-2015
Thank you too. Hopefully, I'll have a complete engine soon. Next i will try 1500bar. But there are too many other things to do. One of them is backlash in gearshift mechanism (solved). In BMW is it simplier and better.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - Riverstick - 01-14-2016
Great thread. Funny enough, In Ireland, twin turbo 4 cylinder CDI Mercs have a habit of turning the main bearings....in Sprinter vans...leading to oil starvation etc.
Has anyone figured out why this is happening and what is the cure?
Local guys rebuilding these engines normally cut a deeper groove in the bearing caps to prevent this recurring, and tap the bearing tab deeper into it. Anyone got thoughts on this?
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 01-14-2016
I think the main problem is that there isn´t oil pressure sensor. So, you don´t know anything about oil pressure. Oil pressure can be measured only by external pressure gauge.
In WIS - At normal operating temperature of the engine oil, the oil pressure in the idling speed range must not drop below 0,3 bar. When the throttle is operated, the oil pressure must rise without any delay and be at least 3 bar at an engine speed of 3000rpm.
min. 0,3 bar in the idling speed....for me - it´s bad. Old OM602 in the idling I see 1,5-2 bar.
I am planning install my own oil pressure gauge because I don´t want to rebuild this engine unnecessarily anymore
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - INC - 01-15-2016
(01-14-2016, 05:26 PM)Riverstick Great thread. Funny enough, In Ireland, twin turbo 4 cylinder CDI Mercs have a habit of turning the main bearings....in Sprinter vans...leading to oil starvation etc.
Has anyone figured out why this is happening and what is the cure?
Local guys rebuilding these engines normally cut a deeper groove in the bearing caps to prevent this recurring, and tap the bearing tab deeper into it. Anyone got thoughts on this?
Remove DPF and all is OK.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 01-15-2016
DPF wasn´t as standard in W210. I don´t have it.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - starynovy - 01-15-2016
O.3Bar on hot engine idling? :
If I ever saw value like that I would assume that the engine is scraped and dead.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 01-15-2016
Yes. I don't know why is this in WIS :-) I think the lowest safe oil pressure in the idling is about 1 bar.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - barrote - 01-15-2016
thats not so simple , the engine might well be with 0.5 bar in idle and when under load does not reach 3bar at 3000 rpm wich is considered to be good enough, and have 1.5 bar in idle and does not reach 3 bar @3k in dry . but in the rest i agree with all of u.
i had i 612 giving birth in my hand , and it spit the rod bearings out, and it did rotate the caps as well. my findings were related with the rods, i found them week in the botom end. compared to a 606 rod they look a lot weeker , but this is me ....
something is week in this engines, caps , rod ends , oil pump , something is .... weeker that the 606´s
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - Riverstick - 01-16-2016
Yes, you are right. The bottom end of older Mercedes diesel engines rarely gave trouble. The problem of bearings turning in the block only manifested itself as CDI's got older.
I have seen several 4 cylinder engines turn main bearings(always twin turbo).....the odd 5 cylinder engine, but never a 6 cylinder engine.
I am wondering should the crankshaft damper be changed at a certain mileage to prevent this problem occurring, or is it just a weakness in the securing of the bearings in the bearing caps?
I have seen a good few 150bhp om646 engine blocks replaced with OM611 taken from early production W202 & W210 cars. These engines were fitted with the Sprinter ancillary equipment, although the block has to be drilled and tapped for the oil return for the extra turbo. These engines also had the main bearing securing tab modified to give better 'grip' to the bearing caps. The vans were put back into service and never gave trouble afterwards.
My father tells me in the 1960s a certain model Leyland truck engine had this problem of turning the main bearings. The solution was to 'deepen' the securing tabs in the bearing caps when rebuilding the engines, and he says they never gave any further problems. So, maybe not such a new problem after all?
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - barrote - 01-16-2016
i see , here where i come from in case we suspect caps want to rotate , its easy .... locktite 271 but this has to be done carefully .
the problem is not new and not so uncommon, sometimes may be a cap defect , nevertheless this type of bearing is not supposed to suffer that much twist, thats why i belive some strange thing is happening in there.
just to confirm u spoke abot OM646 main bearings , and what about the rod bearing?
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 02-11-2016
Finally the engine is in the car. Also gearbox with better gearshift (original but remanufactured by me). Now I have to build new bigger downpipe.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - starynovy - 02-12-2016
Tell me more about modified gearshift if not secret.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 02-12-2016
As I wrote. Original, only remanufactured. Nothing new. I thought, that i will use BMW gearshift. Maybe in the future :-)
Mercedes gearshift is really bad. But in our C180 Kompressor - It´s precise shifting - like BMW, exactly same (Reverse left from first gear).
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 02-28-2016
Today was a first ride after rebuild. I drove rather max 2500rpm.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - starynovy - 03-01-2016
V tom katalizatore pod autom bolo co? Dalsi normalny kat? Ten za turbom som uz prirodzene kuchol ale pod autom sa mi este nechcelo.
Ten EGR ventil by som uplne odstranil, zbytocna prekazka v toku vzduchu. Soft si ides robit sam?
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 03-01-2016
Jojo, další kat. EGR je znefunkčněn a časem bude nahrazen
Soft- Zatim si jen tak projíždím origo mapy stažené z internetu. Takže možná časem. Ale jednu úpravu softu už mi dělali a půjdu na další, až to lehce zajedu. Po opravě a seřízení vstřiků na ještě o něco větší dávku to trochu černě kouří . Ale i na ty nízké otáčky to jede dost dobře
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - starynovy - 03-01-2016
No ja uz len cakam na flasher a idem do tej mojej herky, mapy som si uz nasiel v hexdumpe.
Akurat montujem 550x230 FMIC miesto toho OE vtipu. Stage 1 remap by mal aspon u mna hodit 230PS a 550Nm. V tych vstrekoch ti menili aj spicky? Viem ze tam pasuju z C30CDI.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 03-02-2016
Já mám originál AMG vstřiky
Budu potřebovat určitě přidat hodně vzduchu. A co budeš mít za flasher ?
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - starynovy - 03-02-2016
No najlacnejsie tam bude hodit turbo z 270CDI alebo 320 a doladit to.. Zobral som MPPS.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 03-02-2016
Projdi si celý topic. Mam turbo gt2359v :-)
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 03-02-2016
Today on wet asphalt. Driving with 2nd gear and than full throttle from 1500 to 3000 without using clutch - always wheels spinning. Acceleration with 5th/6th gear from low rpm is really good. But now i need more air because of black smoke - remap. Driving with this car giving me a big smile
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - starynovy - 03-03-2016
Hod potom nejake video
. Pozeram ze cockove DEPO svetla.. tiez som ich kupil ale tu shitnu cinsku optiku nahradil Hella Evox-R projektormi, radost jazdit v noci.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 03-03-2016
V noci jsem zatím neměl problém, svítí to pěkně.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - starynovy - 03-03-2016
![[Image: 10.jpg]](http://entwicklung.wz.cz/merc/10.jpg)
Left DEPO, right Hella projector.. almost the same.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 03-03-2016
Woow. With xenon or normal H7?
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - starynovy - 03-03-2016
Both with D2S Osram Xenarc Classic.
This is how it looks at night, lights up as any other brand new car with xenon.. LED lights are another story.
![[Image: 43.jpg]](http://entwicklung.wz.cz/merc/43.jpg)
Low-Beam
![[Image: 44.jpg]](http://entwicklung.wz.cz/merc/44.jpg)
High-beam (Bi-xenon)
![[Image: 45.jpg]](http://entwicklung.wz.cz/merc/45.jpg)
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 03-03-2016
Hmm really nice, but there is problem- originaly i don´t have xenons. In CZ is this big problem.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - starynovy - 03-03-2016
Here too, patrols will stop you if it looks suspicious. Like if you mount xenon on skoda fabia, 6500K blue as shit and blind everyone.
I had xenon in BMW E34, A6 C4, both never mounted xenon from factory but I had 4300K OE like bulbs and good projectors. Patrols never gave me trouble, never asked about it (had it for 4 years). I gladly took the risk, since I almost hit two pedestrians in rain at night. So how you do it is the key.
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 03-05-2016
Sorry for the quality and radio. Not full rpm.
https://goo.gl/photos/EnW3pu5vV724YUCp7
RE: W210 200 CDI, 200-250 HP/ 450-500 Nm - MartinB - 03-06-2016
Little measuring:
Max Boost: 1,4 bar
Max Fueling rate: 80 ml
I think the power is like 320CDI or better. After change the oil, I will go to remap