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+--- Thread: New cold air intake modification great spot! (/showthread.php?tid=1558)
New cold air intake modification great spot! - W116Lorinser - 07-31-2010
i just installed euro lights on my 300sd and to my surprise after the install the car accelerated much slower and the power was lacking even worse then stock. the culprit was that on the american circle lights there was a gap between the right passenger light and the tube that connects to were the air is sucked right behind it. The euro lights completely closed everything off not allowing any air in from where they used to go before.
So i went to autozone picked up the specter 3inch flexible air intake hose which is about 28 inches long. I then found an awesome spot for where cold air could be sucked. I removed the right passenger side horn and the assembly that holds it. I then unscrewed the lower grille underneath the front bumper so that i could adjust my air intake hose. I put the hose right in front of the tow hook in the front of the car and extended the rest of the intake directly back up to the air intake housing and i cut and made it flush so it looks like something mercedes installed from the factory
ill get you guys some pictures of the complete setup tommorrow.
now the best part is the car is much noticebly faster and belive it or not my engine temp is staying at a pinch above 80 on the temperature scale and not moving. Before with the complete stock setup before the euro light install the temp would sit slightly lower then the 90 mark.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - ForcedInduction - 08-01-2010
(07-31-2010, 08:28 PM)W116Lorinser i just installed euro lights on my 300sd and to my surprise after the install the car accelerated much slower and the power was lacking even worse then stock. the culprit was that on the american circle lights there was a gap between the right passenger light and the tube that connects to were the air is sucked right behind it. The euro lights completely closed everything off not allowing any air in from where they used to go before.Yep. I've seen that before with a different person, you could actually see the snorkel tube compressing from the vacuum just revving the engine.
Quote:I put the hose right in front of the tow hook in the front of the carWhile thats a cold air location, its also known as a "cold water intake". You need some kind of bypass valve or vent higher up to prevent the engine sucking in splash water.
Have you considered making a vented slot below the headlight like this guy did with his W124?
Quote:Before with the complete stock setup before the euro light install the temp would sit slightly lower then the 90 mark.There are significant cooling system issues if something as minor as a small air inlet temperature change can make such a difference. Have you cleaned out the radiator or done a citric acid flush?
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - Rudolf_Diesel - 08-01-2010
Good to see your making some progress, but water intake is a big concern. They do sell a bypass valve, but I believe they are not recommended for turbo or supercharger appilcations.
Something a little higher up maybe around the grill area with a scoop like on a 126 SD.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - winmutt - 08-01-2010
Does the 126 have a fender pick up like the 123 cali?
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - Rudolf_Diesel - 08-01-2010
(08-01-2010, 09:21 AM)winmutt Does the 126 have a fender pick up like the 123 cali?
I am not sure about the 126 California, I have a 126 Federal...The air intake was between the right headlight and radiator and was like a little scoop.
The fender intake would be a good idea.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - W116Lorinser - 08-01-2010
my intake is not where the guy with the red e class has his below the headlight.
i put my tube below the bumper where the tow hook is. theres a perfect oval shaped slot that hold the 3inch flexible tube perfectly. and its more then 1 feet off the ground so i dont think there any concern for water unless i submerge the whole front end of the car in water in which i dont think i will
ill get you guys some pictures today
Quote:Before with the complete stock setup before the euro light install the temp would sit slightly lower then the 90 mark.There are significant cooling system issues if something as minor as a small air inlet temperature change can make such a difference. Have you cleaned out the radiator or done a citric acid flush?
[/quote]
yea ive flushed the radiator and the car has always been perfect no problems ever with overheating.. i just think im bringing alot more colder air into the engine now it must help with cooling better then the stock setup with the circular lights... and like i said the car is much quicker it has better pickup throughout the entire rpm range.
and guys how would this bypass valve look and whats the purpose? does it close itself when water gets sucked in or something?
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - Rudolf_Diesel - 08-01-2010
Quote:and guys how would this bypass valve look and whats the purpose? does it close itself when water gets sucked in or something?
Exactly, but it is not recommended by the mfg for turbo or SC.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - W116Lorinser - 08-01-2010
the spot i have is great theres not really that much of a chance for too much water to be sucked in there. and even if a couple little splashes or drips do i dont see whats the big deal.
i know ive seen guys running rear mounted turbos on mercedes and other american muscle cars that have the filter fully exposed to water and other elements in the rear with no problems at all.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - winmutt - 08-01-2010
The problem is that the one day you get stuck in a rush hour frog choker you are going to have problems.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - ForcedInduction - 08-01-2010
This is what we're talking about.
http://www.autoanything.com/air-intakes/65A3167A0A0.aspx
![[Image: air_bypass_valve_pic1.jpg]](http://www.modernparts.com/userdocs/products/AEM/air_bypass_valve_pic1.jpg)
Basically its a foam filter with rubber flaps that seal off flow through the foam. When water hits the inlet the vacuum sucks air past the rubber flaps instead of drawing water up the tube.
I see no reason why it won't work exactly the same for a turbo engine as it does an NA, airflow is airflow.
Even so much as adding a baffle or expansion chamber to the tube will have a huge help at preventing water ingestion.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - Rudolf_Diesel - 08-01-2010
I don't see why it wouldn't work on any motor??? Mfg must have some kind of reason though, I just don't know what it is.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - W116Lorinser - 08-01-2010
what could be the worst thing? could the turbos vacuum someway activate the air bypass and cause it to close and suck air from the foam part??
even if it rains and in traffic.... how could the water be sucked up into my engine? the tube is 30 inches long plus there a filter to stop any water from getting into the engine. Realistcally what could happen even if a little water found its way up the tube?
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - Biohazard - 08-01-2010
(08-01-2010, 09:53 PM)W116Lorinser what could be the worst thing? could the turbos vacuum someway activate the air bypass and cause it to close and suck air from the foam part??
even if it rains and in traffic.... how could the water be sucked up into my engine? the tube is 30 inches long plus there a filter to stop any water from getting into the engine. Realistcally what could happen even if a little water found its way up the tube?
Hydrolock. It's a bitch. I got to replace a complete engine and transmission pump due to hydrolock on a VW Passat V6 when I was a tech in Denver. Bent a couple of rods, some valves, and basicly fubard the everything. That was a non turbo engine. The air filter and intake tube to the engine was soaking wet. The filter doesn't stop the water, just slows it down slightly. Add in the extra vacuum from a turbo sucking air and it's pretty easy to pull water in past the filter. A drop here or there from rain won't do it, but if you catch a solid puddle or ??? it's new engine time.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - W116Lorinser - 08-01-2010
thats what i was talking about exactly a few drops here or there are not gonna do anything even in the pouring rain. cause this is underneath and protected by other pieces of the car.
but a big puddle or if i submerge the front end yes i know about hydrolocking the engine... but i havent seen any 1 foot puddles in ny even with some bad storms here and if i did im not the type of person to drive straight for them lol
but to be on the safe side im gonna order that air bypass and fab it up to the flex pipe
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - ForcedInduction - 08-01-2010
(08-01-2010, 11:13 PM)W116Lorinser cause this is underneath and protected by other pieces of the car.
Except the wheel.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - Biohazard - 08-01-2010
Next time it rains good there and everything is soaking wet, check up under your car where you are planning on putting the air filter. If it is soaking wet too, it's probably not a good place. FI is right about the wheel, it kicks up a lot of mist and water. I've thought about putting mine in the fenderwell, but with a shield blocking everything next to the wheel side to prevent water entrance. Then again, I'm in the greater Puget Sound area, and it rains all the time here so it's staying as is.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - W116Lorinser - 08-01-2010
i didnt put my filter at the bottom of the car... all i did was take a 3" flexible pipe and rerouted it to where the tow hook is to the 'right center' of my lower bumper where the bottom grille is underneath the bumper so it could suck real cold air into the intake.
So can i install the airbypass at the top of the intake tube where the tube connects to the metal filter housing?
does it matter as long as its on the intake or does it have to be lower down?
heres what i found on the aem site for forced induction turbo and supercharged cars.
http://www.aemintakes.com/instructions/AEM-Bypass_inst.pdf
lower down in the paragraph it says
"The AEM® air bypass valve is NOT TO BE USED ON TURBO or SUPERCHARGED engines. Use of the AEM bypass valve on engines with these modifications, will void any warranty of the valve and reduce the performance of the vehicle"
then i found this after doing research on ebay.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370410657868&crlp=1_263602_263622&ff4=263602_263622&viewitem=&guid=b78f57d51290a0645e950ad5ffcfcd20&rvr_id=118678273726&ua=M*S%3F&itemid=370410657868
but at the bottom of the product description it says
"Highly recommend for all cold air intake and front mount intake also compatible with Turbo or N/A."
so does this mean the aem one will work or is this bypass slightly different??
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - Biohazard - 08-02-2010
[quote='W116Lorinser' pid='15465' dateline='1280725091']
i didnt put my filter at the bottom of the car... all i did was take a 3" flexible pipe and rerouted it to where the tow hook is to the 'right center' of my lower bumper where the bottom grille is underneath the bumper so it could suck real cold air into the intake.
My bad, I miss understood. I did the same thing on a car I used to have. Had a flexible pipe feeding air from the bottom of my grill pointed right at my air filter. I never had any water problems from that even in down pours. Just be sure to check it after a good hard drive in the rain, see if it needs adjusting.
Mine had slight moisture at the air filter, but not enough for me to worry about.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - W116Lorinser - 08-02-2010
heres the aem bypass on a turbo srt4 neon so it must be ok to run this setup on our cars if the higher hp srt4 car can handle it
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/616760
no problem BioHazard
Better safe then hydro-locked haha
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - ConnClark - 08-02-2010
if you go to a junk yard and get an 84-85 (possibly 83) intake snorkel it will sit behind the grill and in front of the radiator where you already have a nice high pressure spot. It has a bug and water deflector as well. It works great.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - W116Lorinser - 08-02-2010
(08-02-2010, 02:30 PM)ConnClark if you go to a junk yard and get an 84-85 (possibly 83) intake snorkel it will sit behind the grill and in front of the radiator where you already have a nice high pressure spot. It has a bug and water deflector as well. It works great.
i found this guy and what he did to his w126 300sd this is an awesome and safe spot
not sure if it can be done for the w116 cause of the battery box which i might have to modify and move... but ill see tommorrow
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - SurfRodder - 08-05-2010
(08-01-2010, 11:58 PM)W116Lorinser so does this mean the aem one will work or is this bypass slightly different??
it'll probably work, but it's not designed to pass the airflow that a forced air application of the same cross-sectional area (of intake hose) would produce. If you get one that is big enough to pass the airflow of a non-forced induction engine large enough to have the same airflow numbers then it'll definitely work. AEM is just trying to avoid warranty issues for people using an undersized vacuum breaker on their cars.
RE: New cold air intake modification great spot! - sentiplum - 12-02-2010
(08-01-2010, 07:37 PM)ForcedInduction This is what we're talking about.
http://www.autoanything.com/air-intakes/65A3167A0A0.aspx
Basically its a foam filter with rubber flaps that seal off flow through the foam. When water hits the inlet the vacuum sucks air past the rubber flaps instead of drawing water up the tube.
I see no reason why it won't work exactly the same for a turbo engine as it does an NA, airflow is airflow.
Even so much as adding a baffle or expansion chamber to the tube will have a huge help at preventing water ingestion.
wait, I thought that the foam filter is something like a air filter. anyways. is this part readily available to any dealers and online stores?