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+--- Thread: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? (/showthread.php?tid=2483)
Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - civicious - 04-05-2011
Hi everyone, I'm Wil. I'm a tech at a shop that does performance and maintenance on high-end/exotic cars (Ferrari, Lamborghini, Porsche, Mercedes). I know a good bit about gasoline-powered vehicles, but not a whole lot about diesel. I do own a Dodge 3500 diesel, but everything that I've done to it has been essentially bolt-on, and didn't require any special know how (programmer, exhaust, intake).
I've recently purchased an 85 300D as a project car, of sorts. It's got around 304k on it, and with the exception of a leaky oil pan gasket and some clackedy valves, it runs (relatively) excellent. The A/C doesn't work, but other than that everything in the car is fucntional.
I know from reading around on here that there is some power to be made by turning up the injection pump and swapping out the elements. If I put a bigger turbo on, turn up the fuel, and intercool it, I should be able to get a good bit more power out of it, at least in my mind...
Is there any input or advice that someone can chime in with regarding this?
Thanks in advance, guys!
-wil
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - garage - 04-05-2011
More fuel+More air=POWER
Thats basicly the deal with diesels. haha.
Your plan sounds good to me!
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - polarisrmk - 04-05-2011
Get out your pocket book. The pump mods are not cheap.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - civicious - 04-05-2011
Other than the elements, what pump mods are necessary?
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - garage - 04-05-2011
Good question!
As far as i know, none.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - civicious - 04-05-2011
Where's the 'not cheap' part? lol
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - larsalan - 04-05-2011
(04-05-2011, 07:30 PM)civicious Other than the elements, what pump mods are necessary?
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/thread-ip-full-load-adjustment-procedure-for-the-mw-and-m-pumps-pyrometer-install
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - garage - 04-05-2011
The elements, and the installing of the elements(correctly).
Bosch elements cost $2-300 each i belive, the elements that we are buying on that "8mm element" thread are of unknown quality. Were hopeing that they work correctly.
Another $$$factor is finding a shop to install them correctly.
Before Delivery Valve contact this diesel shop in Bakersfield, the only option this site knew of was Myna in finland. And a couple members themselves, but the have stopped showing up here recently.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - civicious - 04-05-2011
I've built twin turbo Gallardos, fabricated 200+mph 911's, and dozens of 500+whp Mercedes's of various models...some injection pump elements shouldn't be a big deal.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - polarisrmk - 04-05-2011
Do some more reading on this forum. Mods can cost up to $2000 for elements and DV's properly installed, pump put on a test bench and adjusted properly. the valves themselves are not cheap either as was mentioned. Its not as simple as putting the elements in.
Once your pump is giving you more fuel then you run into even more expenses. Turbo, Intercooler, gauges, plumbing. Not to mention at 300k your car is probably due for a timing chain, injector rebuild/balance, complete front suspension rebuild, vacuum pump rebuild, the list can go on and on for some people depending on the care the previous owner took of the car.
As many smart people have annoyingly said over and over on this forum. Modifications should only be done if the engine and all of its components are in order. Do some more research before you leap. These cars are German and Germans never do anything simple
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - civicious - 04-05-2011
100% of the suspension is brand new, as is the vacuum system. Also has a brand new gearbox, and is going to get all new internals (as needed) when the motor gets built. Fabbing up an intercooler, manifolds, and piping is no big deal either.
I just want to make sure I'm not missing any essential components.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - polarisrmk - 04-05-2011
(04-05-2011, 08:33 PM)civicious I've built twin turbo Gallardos, fabricated 200+mph 911's, and dozens of 500+whp Mercedes's of various models...some injection pump elements shouldn't be a big deal.
There are only a few select people in this world that can properly tune one of these injection pumps. If it was that simple every person on here would just go to their local diesel shop that has a test bench and "git r dun". From what I gather there are mostly problems with getting the engine to idle properly with the larger elements and the pump adding fuel linearly with boost. If you think you can do it, try it i am sure there will be people here banging down your doors to have you do their pumps.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - aaa - 04-05-2011
polarisrmk covered it all.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - garage - 04-05-2011
(04-05-2011, 08:33 PM)civicious I've built twin turbo Gallardos, fabricated 200+mph 911's, and dozens of 500+whp Mercedes's of various models...some injection pump elements shouldn't be a big deal.
If its not such a big deal, then PLEASE tune up one of these pumps for some serious power and let us know how it goes.
Im sure we would all appreciate it.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - Motorhead - 04-06-2011
(04-05-2011, 08:33 PM)civicious I've built twin turbo Gallardos, fabricated 200+mph 911's, and dozens of 500+whp Mercedes's of various models...some injection pump elements shouldn't be a big deal.
I build supercar engines and one of them holds the record for the fastest standing mile in the world @ 266 MPH but I know my place when it comes to diesel tunning, if you find somthing out about the I/P elements please share it with us.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - dieselboy - 04-06-2011
I haven't seen another fmic other than my car so far, and mine isn't a w123
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - civicious - 04-06-2011
(04-05-2011, 10:50 PM)garage(04-05-2011, 08:33 PM)civicious I've built twin turbo Gallardos, fabricated 200+mph 911's, and dozens of 500+whp Mercedes's of various models...some injection pump elements shouldn't be a big deal.
If its not such a big deal, then PLEASE tune up one of these pumps for some serious power and let us know how it goes.
Im sure we would all appreciate it.
That's what I'm working on, as soon as this group buy on the 8mm elements comes through.
(04-06-2011, 12:44 AM)Motorhead(04-05-2011, 08:33 PM)civicious I've built twin turbo Gallardos, fabricated 200+mph 911's, and dozens of 500+whp Mercedes's of various models...some injection pump elements shouldn't be a big deal.
I build supercar engines and one of them holds the record for the fastest standing mile in the world @ 266 MPH but I know my place when it comes to diesel tunning, if you find somthing out about the I/P elements please share it with us.
You work for Heffner? I thought he was in Florida?
(04-06-2011, 01:00 AM)dieselboy I haven't seen another fmic other than my car so far, and mine isn't a w123
Really? I figured anyone trying to make power on these would have put on an fmic...it's not like you need a condenser up there anyways, lol. Any particular reason noone runs intercoolers?
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - dieselboy - 04-06-2011
No room.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - civicious - 04-06-2011
(04-06-2011, 09:32 AM)dieselboy No room.
![[Image: 28611d1294831454-heating-pipe-sawzall.jpg]](http://www.diychatroom.com/attachments/f17/28611d1294831454-heating-pipe-sawzall.jpg)
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - 300SD_KY - 04-06-2011
Check out Teemu's page www.blacksmokeracing.com
He is also high po diesel krazy.
Finnish drifting diesel wagon.
Keep posting!
Interested in following your build.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - civicious - 04-06-2011
(04-06-2011, 11:24 AM)300SD_KY Check out Teemu's page www.blacksmokeracing.com
He is also high po diesel krazy.
Finnish drifting diesel wagon.
Keep posting!
Interested in following your build.
Already been all over it...he's running an OM606 though. I do plan on running a VERY similar i/c and turbo setup as him though. I'm also going to (more than likely) retain an automatic transmission.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - Motorhead - 04-06-2011
(04-06-2011, 07:18 AM)civicious(04-05-2011, 10:50 PM)garage(04-05-2011, 08:33 PM)civicious I've built twin turbo Gallardos, fabricated 200+mph 911's, and dozens of 500+whp Mercedes's of various models...some injection pump elements shouldn't be a big deal.
If its not such a big deal, then PLEASE tune up one of these pumps for some serious power and let us know how it goes.
Im sure we would all appreciate it.
That's what I'm working on, as soon as this group buy on the 8mm elements comes through.
(04-06-2011, 12:44 AM)Motorhead(04-05-2011, 08:33 PM)civicious I've built twin turbo Gallardos, fabricated 200+mph 911's, and dozens of 500+whp Mercedes's of various models...some injection pump elements shouldn't be a big deal.
I build supercar engines and one of them holds the record for the fastest standing mile in the world @ 266 MPH but I know my place when it comes to diesel tunning, if you find somthing out about the I/P elements please share it with us.
You work for Heffner? I thought he was in Florida?
(04-06-2011, 01:00 AM)dieselboy I haven't seen another fmic other than my car so far, and mine isn't a w123
Really? I figured anyone trying to make power on these would have put on an fmic...it's not like you need a condenser up there anyways, lol. Any particular reason noone runs intercoolers?
We built the engine on that project for Heffner, Accufab Racing is in California. Heffner built the car.
RE: Bigger turbo, bigger elements, FMIC...what else? - jeemu - 04-07-2011
Have not to be a wisard to build 400hp om606, but what is that? Its just 400hp engine hundreds among
