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+--- Thread: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 (/showthread.php?tid=2742)
setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - BRABUS - 06-23-2011
Hi
Its now time to install the 7.5mm M IP, the builder told me to set it at 18-20 degs BTDC.
I heard that the drip method isnt used on the M IP?
Hope some that have done this before can give me some help
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - winmutt - 06-23-2011
Does it have the RIV port?
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - BRABUS - 06-23-2011
How does the riv port look like? i can upload a pic of the pump in 2 sec
this is my 7.5mm M IP
![[Image: 23062011151.jpg]](http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f203/augu/23062011151.jpg)
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - aaa - 06-23-2011
Probably this thing. If that's not it then it doesn't have one.
![[Image: lE0ZV.jpg]](http://i.imgur.com/lE0ZV.jpg)
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - Biohazard - 06-23-2011
I fought mine trying to do a drip timing and could never get the same reading twice. I'm not a big fan of the drip timing method. I finally broke down and got a timing light adapter. I looked inside my RIV plug, but it didn't have the little nub to activate the RIV sensor.
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - aaa - 06-23-2011
What year is the pump?
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - tomnik - 06-23-2011
(06-23-2011, 03:57 PM)BRABUS Hi
Its now time to install the 7.5mm M IP, the builder told me to set it at 18-20 degs BTDC.
I heard that the drip method isnt used on the M IP?
Hope some that have done this before can give me some help
who built the pump (installed elements)?
You have the marks on the front. The toothed part on the cam has one tooth missing (which is the mark) and on the plate behind there is a short line. Open the port that is used for the RIV method on newer pumps and fix the position with a cleaned wheel bolt from your car and install it while cylinder #1 is in compression stroke at 19 deg BTDC.
Tom
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - BRABUS - 06-23-2011
the IP is made by PP DIESEL
I know about the marks on the toothed part on the cam and the plate behind.. should i sett these at the same place? and where should i set the crank?
sorry, but dont understand what you mean i should use the wheel bolt for, install it in the port where the riv method is used?
Thanks
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - tomnik - 06-23-2011
look at post #4.
The port has the same thread as the wheel bolt and you can block the shaft of the IP with this trick while you install the pump to prevent it from snapping, don't tight it too much, just by hand and a little bit more.
Align the marks and put the engine in 19 deg BTDC position then install the pump.
Tom
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - BRABUS - 06-23-2011
aha... So i use the wheel bolt to lock the ip when both marks at the front of the pump is alligned, and then just set the crack to 18-20 btdc and put the pump in?
Thanks for your help.. can i maybe use the port where im installing the wheel bolt, to feed oil to the pump? i guess the pump need som oil feed from the same oil feed line the mw is getting it from?
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - tomnik - 06-24-2011
correct.
For the oil feeding I am not yet there...
There was a post by Forced Induction about that.
Feeding AND return of the oil...
Post what you found regarding the oil as I need this as soon as my M pump for my SD is back from PP D.
Tom
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - BRABUS - 06-24-2011
nice. Then i think i would be able to do this without a problem... Will try to sett it to 20btdc first and se.
Will let you know when i find out about the oil feed/return..
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - BRABUS - 06-24-2011
(06-23-2011, 06:23 PM)Biohazard I fought mine trying to do a drip timing and could never get the same reading twice. I'm not a big fan of the drip timing method. I finally broke down and got a timing light adapter. I looked inside my RIV plug, but it didn't have the little nub to activate the RIV sensor.
Hi
timing light adapter? do you mean a timing flashing gun with a with a "sensor" to clamp around the injector lines?
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - Biohazard - 06-24-2011
Correct. See the info on it in my project thread, it's on the last page still.
It works great, you just have to have a 'base line' to go from. In my dads 82 300D and in another similar year 617.952 300SD the stock timing shows at 13 BTDC with a timing light. I have my 7.5 element M pump set at 14BTDC and it's pretty happy. On the oiling to the pump, I had a custom braided line made with the 8mm banjos; had it done at a local hydraulic shop. The line is actually a brake line, 1/8 inch inner diameter. The banjo bolt threads on the block and the threads on the pump are different. I had to get a new banjo bolt for the pump at the same hydraulic shop. The block end is fine thread (1.0mm pitch?) and the pump end is more coarse (1.25mm pitch?). I didn't run any extra oil drain, it drains from the front of the pump back into the crankcase. For the oil feed, I used the small plug that is just to the upper right of the info plate on the above picture. I just tried several times to upload the pic with it circled, but my computer here at work is a POS. The banjo bolt JUST BARELY clears the trans vacuum part, but it clears.
Hope that helps.
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - BRABUS - 06-24-2011
The car is running with the pump at 20BTDC.. Is it difrent readings on the timing using a electronic device and dooing it the manual way? is think i read something about it.
some friend of mine mounted pp d 7mm pumps on theirs 617. They did just block the oil feed at the engine. They have runned with it for several years?? so the pump must get the oil thru the gear !?!?!
The engine was a bit louder now
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - Biohazard - 06-24-2011
Yeah, using the timing light adapter, mine is set at about 14 BTDC, which should just about equal 25 BTDC using a drip method.
The gear looked like it had an oil feed in the middle, but I didn't want to take any chances on Fubaring a brand new (to me) 7.5 pump!
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - JTY - 07-03-2011
(06-24-2011, 05:34 PM)BRABUS The car is running with the pump at 20BTDC.. Is it difrent readings on the timing using a electronic device and dooing it the manual way? is think i read something about it.
some friend of mine mounted pp d 7mm pumps on theirs 617. They did just block the oil feed at the engine. They have runned with it for several years?? so the pump must get the oil thru the gear !?!?!
The engine was a bit louder now
Yes that's true, there is no need to feed oil. I have PP-Diesel 7mm pump with no oil feed, been working for several years. Also Pasi from PP-diesel said that it's fine to use no oil feed with he's pump.
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - E300TSC - 07-03-2011
Bio,
I have a question about your Ferrett. You said in the other thread to get the 6mm sensor. I measured my injection lines and they're 4.5mm. Do the 617's have larger lines or will the 6mm squeeze down far enough?
Thanks!
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - Biohazard - 07-03-2011
I don't think that they will squeeze down far enough. They do make other sizes though, you may be able to find one that fits closer than a 6mm. It's a piezo sensor, so it has to have pretty good contact with the line. I didn't know the 606 has smaller lines, thats interesting.
Just looked online, found only 6.0mm, 6.5mm and 1/4 inch adapters for the Ferret Timing adapter.
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - E300TSC - 07-03-2011
Thanks. I may have to buy one and figure out how to adapt it (like everything else...). But you're happy with it's operation? I really need to get my pump calibrated and timed properly.
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - Biohazard - 07-03-2011
Very happy. It is super easy to use, even comes with instructions and the 9 volt battery! The only other thing you need is a timing light. I've used it on my car and my brothers car. His 240D has a ton of miles. It takes longer to warm the car up than it does to check the timing. Plus, now I don't have to open fuel lines! Conservative estimate, I had checked timing, adjusted timing, rechecked timing in about 10-15 minutes. If you can make an adaptor, this thing is a huge time saver. Find a stock 606, already correctly timed, to get your baseline from though. My base line and yours are probably way different. Good luck!
RE: setting ip timing with new 7,5mm M IP on 617 - MTUPower - 07-04-2011
(06-23-2011, 05:23 PM)aaa Probably this thing. If that's not it then it doesn't have one.That's the oil line port also.