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+--- Thread: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning (/showthread.php?tid=3226)
Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - antonmies - 01-04-2012
I just got representative for Ecotronic ALM high tech wb lambda measurement system back here in Finland.
It features Bosch's own and latest CJ125 chip for sensor reading and control as well as latest LSU 4.9 sensor. Bosch uses CJ125 with both LSU 4.2 and LSU 4.9 sensors and recommends LSU 4.9 as the CJ125 is designed for it. Bosch also recommends LSU 4.9 for any OEM. ALM can be compared to 'de facto' laboratory grade units made by ETAS and ECM.
The reason I'm writing this, is that it's cost effective for the features. It has two 0-5V analog inputs and RPM input so that you fellas with mechanical pumps with no idea what so ever about the real AFR would be able to log the basic parameters such as MAP and EGT in conjunction with lambda.
This is needed to get the best out of the engine, old rear view mirror tech isn't really how you should do it.
US customers can purchase it from Ecotrons and European customers can turn to my webshop.
You can find a comparison measurements from their site made between ALM, Innovate LC-1 and LM-2.
If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to ask!
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - JustPassinThru - 01-05-2012
This is very good to know. A few months from now I am definitely going to want one of these. Thanks!
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - Captain America - 01-05-2012
So the LSU 4.9 is for diesels right? It is a larger sensor overall with a larger heater? I have not used one but have plenty of experience with the 4.2 on gas engines.
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - antonmies - 01-05-2012
(01-05-2012, 01:35 AM)Captain America So the LSU 4.9 is for diesels right? It is a larger sensor overall with a larger heater? I have not used one but have plenty of experience with the 4.2 on gas engines.
The LSU 4.9 sensor is the newest sensor that suits gasoline, diesel and e85 use according to the datasheet. There is a variant of this, the LSU 4.9D, which differs only with the sensor head. Otherwise it's identical according to datasheet.
Now that I got to know ALM and re-educated, I noticed that there is a legend of LSU4.9 being for diesel sensor only. It seems to be FUD that's been spread by the aftermarket manufacturers such as Innovate who use the OLDER TECH LSU 4.2, which of course is a working and fine piece of engineering, but being superseedeed by 4.9 for the new applications. I think that, as they say "LSU 4.2 is better", is the cornerstone for the amounts of blow through carburettors and distributors in the States: old tech is better than new...
About the 4.9 and 4.9D. I think the difference is the longevity issues due to carbon clogging if you drive a lot in the "smoke area". It reduces the sensor life just like running rich with gasoline engine. So if you are able to tune it well enough, I don't see any issues.
The size of the heater element has nothing to do with anything with the diesel or non diesel as the heater element isn't the same as the design is different. If I understood it correctly, the LSU 4.2 has the heating element around the sensing unit whereas LSU 4.9 has it inside the sensing unit making the essential heating faster and more efficient. The heater control is one essential key to sensor life and accuracy: the faster and more accurately you can do it, the longer the sensor lasts and the more accurate it is.
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - antonmies - 01-06-2012
The best (or atleast good
) part in this, in diesel wise, is that it's possible to measure accurately up to lambda 3 (43AFR/Diesel) with ALM!
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - drumbreda - 01-06-2012
http://forum.diyefi.org/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1033&sid=414717411a6afd6286ea0a9eadcb1e18&start=10
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - antonmies - 01-06-2012
Yeah, there is an interesting battle going on. Subject is that why old tech is better than new...
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - Captain America - 01-07-2012
Without reading that article.... From my reading, I saw that the 4.9 heater is larger to help work with cold diesel exhaust (Compared to gas engine). Also, I read that the 4.2 was faster to respond as compared to the 4.9 From this thread http://www.apexspeedtech.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=27#wrap
Regardless All reading states that the 4.9 is better for diesel so cool!
And I am not here to argue or anything, I am merely inquiring 
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - antonmies - 01-07-2012
![[Image: C3C4-side.jpg]](http://wbo2.com/lsu/cases/C3C4-side.jpg)
Source here
Smaller is the LSU 4.9 and larger is LSU 4.2.
"You can see the newer LSU-4.9 sensor (top of both images) has a smaller structure and also there's less ceramic (about 60% the thickness - which may explain why it heats up in a shorter time)."
I'd change the "may explain" to "explains". The smaller the mass, the faster it can be heated and controlled hence more accuracy in control and measuring.
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - Captain America - 01-09-2012
Tech Edge is an awesome site! I think I have read almost every page!
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - antonmies - 01-09-2012
Yes, they are a rare manufacturer with all the info published on their site.
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - antonmies - 01-23-2012
The common claim is that the holes in the LSU 4.9 are smaller. That's true, but the amount is double, 6pcs vs 12pcs. The hole is bigger in the head of LSU 4.9 than the 4.2.
![[Image: lsu4_9.JPG]](http://www.hevosvoima.com/foorumi/files/ALM/lsu4_9.JPG)
![[Image: lsu4_2.JPG]](http://www.hevosvoima.com/foorumi/files/ALM/lsu4_2.JPG)
RE: Basic datalogging and accurate WB02 measurement for proper tuning - gaiex - 08-14-2013
For what I've been told the bosch LSU 4.9d can read with more accuracy after the 20 AFR values and support more temperature than the 4.9, is this valid?
So, also for the little I've read so far, the Ecotrons ALM-S Wideband AFR uses the same CJ125 chip as Bosch lambda meter - LT4, but does the Ecotrons controler have the same read out accuracy as the bosch LT4 expensive controler for a fraction of the price?
PS: I'm new to this AFR and lambda things, so don't be to harsh with me
I'm starting to look for a wideband AFR gauge/controler for my CDI