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+--- Thread: Intercooler made with air conditioning? (/showthread.php?tid=3397)
Intercooler made with air conditioning? - jkoch10 - 02-28-2012
i've been looking into different intercoolers and was wondering why people havent used an air to air conditioning unit instead of an air to air or air to water. Is it possible to use the air conditioner to cool the air? wouldn't that be bettter because you could get below ambient temperature?
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - Simpler=Better - 02-28-2012
The energy is would take to cool the incoming air would negate any horsepower gains you saw.
For example, lets say the air conditioner takes 10hp to cool the inlet charge-and having cold air only gives you +8hp. Or something like that.
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - jkoch10 - 02-28-2012
not to sound doubtful but does an ac unit really suck that much power? also i have read that every 10 degrees dropped will give you a 1% increase in hp wouldnt that outweigh what the ac takes? 200hp engine drops an extra 70 degrees would get you 14hp
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - SurfRodder - 02-28-2012
(02-28-2012, 11:46 AM)jkoch10 also i have read that every 10 degrees dropped will give you a 1% increase in hp wouldnt that outweigh what the ac takes? 200hp engine drops an extra 70 degrees would get you 14hp
only one way to know for sure...keep us posted!
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - Simpler=Better - 02-28-2012
I don't think it will work, but if you feel like trying I'd love to know how it turns out
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - jkoch10 - 02-28-2012
well i intend to try it eventually and i'll be sure to post about how it works but thats very far down the list of things to do. i need to replace the engine i have in first thanks for the input though
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - Graminal95 - 02-28-2012
I have read that the GM compressor that MB uses in the W123's consumes 8hp at higher RPM.
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - HoleshotHolset - 02-29-2012
Back in my GM turbo gasser days, there were a few guys with GMC Syclone/Typhoon trucks on the email list/forums running what were called intracoolers. I'm not sure if this was their officially accepted name, but that's what we referred to them as.
They worked like an air:water IC, except they ran refrigerant through the core instead of water.
With the intracoolers, IAT's were indeed below ambient temp...but I don't remember this setup providing a huge advantage over more traditional air:air or air:water intercoolers.
That said, I'm not convinced that any of these setups properly sized the compressor + evaporator core(s) + receiver dryer + condensor to work with both the vehicle HVAC and the intracooler. Perhaps properly sizing the rest of the system would have yielded better results, but a dense, cool air charge at the intake is only one piece of the puzzle. They're complex, no doubt.
With diesels being a compression ignition engine requiring a certain amount of heat in the intake air charge for complete combustion...there is probably a crossover point where you see diminishing returns. I could be wrong, it does happen. Good thought, though. I'd love to see someone bring back these setups!
Beers,
Matt
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - bryant.cw - 02-29-2012
The laws of thermodynamics prohibit this. Not smart enough to elaborate, but I'm 99% this wouldn't work, otherwise someone would have done it.
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - NapaBavarian - 03-01-2012
Probably more usefull in a high boost engine, there are logical arguements either way. If your inlet charge is 100*c it probably would be a loss over air/air or air/water, but if you had crazy boost and 300*c to cool off perhaps it could offer an advantage over air/water, the theory being the bigger the temperature differential the more quickly heat will transfer, on a warm day your water in air/water could be over ambiant temperature, while the core could be the same temp as your refrigerator or perhaps even your deep freeze.
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - majesty78 - 03-01-2012
I know of an MB E55 AMG Compressor which uses A/C for intercooling.
The lower IAT gave him a gain of about 45bhp from 600 up to 645bhp.....
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - sjwbond - 03-07-2012
I think the laws of thermodynamics are being misapplied in some responses, you cant get more energy out of the same amount of fuel, thats for sure, so your efficiency would decrease. However surely cooler air would increase peak power by allowing more fuel to be burnt, but sap a little from the top end, kind of in the same way that a supercharger does.. the question is is the cost of the refrigerant process greater than than the gain in power by being able to burn more fuel.
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - aaa - 03-07-2012
The disadvantage I see is if you're willing to fabricate a custom ac system to do this properly, then you're probably capable of fabricating a different intercooler system that doesn't sap hp.
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - HoleshotHolset - 03-07-2012
^^^bingo.
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - willbhere4u - 03-08-2012
You could use the condenser as a radiator for an water to air setup
RE: Intercooler made with air conditioning? - yankneck696 - 03-08-2012
Best bet is to use the AC to cool a resivior of water. Then water to air. Use a Chrysler minivan "dual AC" compressor. Been there, done that on a Shelby 2.2 powered Bradley GT kitcar... Ran stupid power on camel piss....
Ed