+- STD (https://www.superturbodiesel.com/std)
+-- Forum: Tuning (https://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/forumdisplay.php?fid=6)
+--- Forum: Engine (https://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/forumdisplay.php?fid=7)
+--- Thread: too low egt (/showthread.php?tid=6213)
too low egt - bjarni97 - 02-08-2015
i recently turboed my om603 and after turning the ip up (full load screw) 2, 3, 4, 5 turns it still doesnt smoke what could be the problem.
i have also tried turning the torque control but then it would take a long time to get to idle.
full throttle full boost egt is about 510°C pre turbo.
im running original fuel pump.
it has new 314 bosch injector nozzles
china t3t4 turbo no intercooler
3 inch mandrel straight pipe.
when the ip was turned 5 turns on the full load the power didnt change after half throttle like there wasnt any more fuel.
what could be the problem.
RE: too low egt - led-panzer - 02-08-2015
Try adjusting the high idle/max rpm. It's the big one with the Allen key in the middle when you have the back cover off. Turn it CW, I've never gone more than 3 turns
You're turning the full load CCW right?
RE: too low egt - bjarni97 - 02-08-2015
yes im turning it ccw (out) but shouldnt it smoke from idle even if the high idle is never touched. btw this was a na engine no alda
it has full power (the little it has) all the way to 5000rpm little to no dropoff in power.
RE: too low egt - Petar - 02-08-2015
Maybe the pump is starved for fuel
When was the last time you changed your fuel filters ?
RE: too low egt - bjarni97 - 02-08-2015
they were changed both about 10 thou km ago and the prefilter has no buildup
can the fuel pump be so worn that it isnt flowing enough.
RE: too low egt - barrote - 02-08-2015
well, u have a problem in your hands, wich is the same we all have till we remove the pump and have it rebuilt to 6mm or more and governor set properly.
original 603 pump is 5.5 mm element wich is very limited for making smoke. to have smoke in a stock configuration your pump must be delivering more than 80cc of fuel. 5.5mm elements wont do that unless u set the rack at 18 to 20 mm , something your governor setting does not allow. and even after that set the injection timing is too long to be of any use.
i´m afraid u cant go further with that setting.
the low EGT has to do with the probe position and the 3 inch exaust system. close the waste gate and watch. it must rise till meltdown
if it does not is probably a probe situation.
BTW 550ºc is not that low.
regards.
RE: too low egt - Petar - 02-08-2015
Actually in my experience everything above 40-45 cc of boost on a 606 makes smoke. He has no ALDA meaning it should smoke a bit until it builds boost if you punch it. At least as much as this. Lack of smoke means that not enough fuel is injected. He also says that he is not making more power which is a certain sign he's not getting enough fuel.
It should smoke at least as much as this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYkA3cfXp5Q
It is possible that the lift pump is worn and doesn't deliver enough fuel to the IP. But the IP itself being worn ?? I doubt it.
Maybe there is something that physically prevents the rack from moving forward ???
We're really grasping at straws here
RE: too low egt - baldur - 02-08-2015
What I have also found of great benefit when the injection pump is out of steam is to fit water+alcohol injection.
RE: too low egt - bjarni97 - 02-08-2015
(02-08-2015, 04:04 PM)Petar Actually in my experience everything above 40-45 cc of boost on a 606 makes smoke. He has no ALDA meaning it should smoke a bit until it builds boost if you punch it. At least as much as this. Lack of smoke means that not enough fuel is injected. He also says that he is not making more power which is a certain sign he's not getting enough fuel.my car doesnt smoke even remotely as much as that.
It should smoke at least as much as this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYkA3cfXp5Q
It is possible that the lift pump is worn and doesn't deliver enough fuel to the IP. But the IP itself being worn ?? I doubt it.
Maybe there is something that physically prevents the rack from moving forward ???
We're really grasping at straws here
should i try fitting a gauge to measure pressur at the pump or should i try anything else first.
i have 7.5mm elements from dieselmeken but i wanted to get more out of the stock pump before i put them in and have them balanced.
(02-08-2015, 03:47 PM)barrote well, u have a problem in your hands, wich is the same we all have till we remove the pump and have it rebuilt to 6mm or more and governor set properly.the wastegate is closed its not connected to pressure. and i only get 14-17psi spiking to 21psi at 5000rpm.
original 603 pump is 5.5 mm element wich is very limited for making smoke. to have smoke in a stock configuration your pump must be delivering more than 80cc of fuel. 5.5mm elements wont do that unless u set the rack at 18 to 20 mm , something your governor setting does not allow. and even after that set the injection timing is too long to be of any use.
i´m afraid u cant go further with that setting.
the low EGT has to do with the probe position and the 3 inch exaust system. close the waste gate and watch. it must rise till meltdown
if it does not is probably a probe situation.
BTW 550ºc is not that low.
regards.
the probe is in the left hole
![[Image: 20150104_130723_zpsekxdbycf.jpg]](http://s1080.photobucket.com/user/bjarni97/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150104_130723_zpsekxdbycf.jpg.html)
i thought that was where it should be.
i will post a video tomorrow of the smoke and maybe a accel vid.
RE: too low egt - [486] - 02-09-2015
the probe well out into the exhaust stream?
if it's just barely in the fitting it could be reading very low
RE: too low egt - bjarni97 - 02-09-2015
Its a little more than halfway in. pipe is 42mm in diameter and the probe sits about 24mm in.
RE: too low egt - bjarni97 - 02-09-2015
http://www.w124performance.com/images/OM603_misc/OM603.970_crate_engine/603.970_IP4.jpg
on this picture you see what should be the alda but it isnt an alda. can that limit racktravel.
RE: too low egt - bjarni97 - 02-09-2015
here is an accel video aas you can see it takes 14 sec to 100kmh and i think thats way too slow considering it has a 3:27 asd diff. i think it should be way faster like 10 sec or close to that. also its a wagon.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZ6Lu7bFSwM
RE: too low egt - barrote - 02-09-2015
u have a Altitude compensation capsule "ADA" in your pump, it does the same job as the "ALDA" u can have it removed and install a ALDA.
plug and play, but it has to be set . the top srew all in cuts any job, top screw all out, increases fuel to max. it does not play direct at the rack.
maybe u have turning the GOV screw´s and nothing is happening. normal, i did twisted my brain in books and in the bench test to understand wich screw to turn. and some of the governors dont behave like we want. do u have ELR magnet in your pump? that being energised also cuts fuel.
install the 7.5 elements and set the gov properly, thats my recomendation. have a good luck.
my 605 does not smoke that much with 70cc mr PETAR , real black smoke comes with 90cc and no boost. MB engines dont smoke that easy
RE: too low egt - bjarni97 - 02-09-2015
i will try turning the "ada" all the way out or remove it.
RE: too low egt - barrote - 02-09-2015
remove it wont do any good. u can use it as alda, provide a means to have vac or boost , what maters is that it just allow a bit more fuel, but one u start playing with the GOV screws u can just fuck it up
turn the ADA crew all way out is the same as remove it.
regards.
RE: too low egt - bjarni97 - 02-09-2015
i tried screwing the ada all the way out. it made no difference. i think it just needs more fuel to the injection pump. i will try to measure pressure at ip inlet next weekend. if not i will just have to put the 7.5mm elements in.
RE: too low egt - bjarni97 - 02-14-2015
it is fixed. i took the sideplate off and measured rack movement and it was sticking on something. and on further investigation it turned out that the vacum shutoff actuator had been replaced and the pin on it missed the slot its supposed to be in and went under it and limiting rack travel. now the egts max at 650°c from 0 to 160 kmh. and takes 9.8 seconds to 100 kmh. it pulls so much harder than before. im very happy with 4 turns on the full load and quarter turn on the torque control.