OM613 OM648 OM628 & 629
OM613 OM648 OM628 & 629
11-03-2010, 01:27 AM
#1
OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?
OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?
Thanks,
Raf
Grand cherokee WK (OM642)
diesel2fast4u
11-03-2010, 01:27 AM #1Hi, I know that this is mayby not the right forum but I cannot find anything about these engines.
OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?
OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?
Thanks,
Raf
Grand cherokee WK (OM642)
11-03-2010, 01:58 AM
#2
(11-03-2010, 01:27 AM)diesel2fast4u OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?The last good diesels Mercedes designed. Basically identical except for an electronic turbo and piezo injectors on the 648
Quote:OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?Not as good as the I6, but not designed around emissions/cost like the V6.
The 629 has piezo injectors.
The Finns are scared of them because they aren't as cheap, they need electronics and they don't revv to insane RPMs like the IDI engines.
ForcedInduction
11-03-2010, 01:58 AM
#2
(11-03-2010, 01:27 AM)diesel2fast4u OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?The last good diesels Mercedes designed. Basically identical except for an electronic turbo and piezo injectors on the 648
Quote:OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?Not as good as the I6, but not designed around emissions/cost like the V6.
The 629 has piezo injectors.
The Finns are scared of them because they aren't as cheap, they need electronics and they don't revv to insane RPMs like the IDI engines.
11-03-2010, 07:00 AM
#3
(11-03-2010, 01:58 AM)ForcedInduction The Finns are scared of them because they aren't as cheap, they need electronics and they don't revv to insane RPMs like the IDI engines.
Are they RPM limited because they're common-rail DI's, or because they're electronically limited (with the OEM ECM/calibration) to x,xxx RPM?
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
11-03-2010, 07:00 AM #3(11-03-2010, 01:58 AM)ForcedInduction The Finns are scared of them because they aren't as cheap, they need electronics and they don't revv to insane RPMs like the IDI engines.
Are they RPM limited because they're common-rail DI's, or because they're electronically limited (with the OEM ECM/calibration) to x,xxx RPM?
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
11-03-2010, 10:31 AM
#5
(11-03-2010, 09:34 AM)ForcedInduction Because they're direct injection.
OK. Why is that a limiting factor? I'm not trying to be a snot, just curious since I've seen plenty of DI's rev to 5-6k RPM.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
11-03-2010, 10:31 AM #5(11-03-2010, 09:34 AM)ForcedInduction Because they're direct injection.
OK. Why is that a limiting factor? I'm not trying to be a snot, just curious since I've seen plenty of DI's rev to 5-6k RPM.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
11-03-2010, 01:26 PM
#6
(11-03-2010, 01:58 AM)ForcedInductionLOL I wouldn't say Finns are scared of anything... I think they are the benz tuners by far untill somebody proves otherwise.(11-03-2010, 01:27 AM)diesel2fast4u OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?The last good diesels Mercedes designed. Basically identical except for an electronic turbo and piezo injectors on the 648
Quote:OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?Not as good as the I6, but not designed around emissions/cost like the V6.
The 629 has piezo injectors.
The Finns are scared of them because they aren't as cheap, they need electronics and they don't revv to insane RPMs like the IDI engines.
I don't see alot of high HP CDI engines.
I can find OM606 here compleet for 2500 usd, OM613, 3500 usd and V8 OM628 for 4500 usd ...
Why is the V8 weaker? just engine design or weaker rods, crank?
It's true that the electronics are harder to figure out but on the other hand it's going to be easy to control smoke, torque & VGT/VNT
Thanks,
Raf
Grand cherokee WK (OM642)
diesel2fast4u
11-03-2010, 01:26 PM #6(11-03-2010, 01:58 AM)ForcedInductionLOL I wouldn't say Finns are scared of anything... I think they are the benz tuners by far untill somebody proves otherwise.(11-03-2010, 01:27 AM)diesel2fast4u OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?The last good diesels Mercedes designed. Basically identical except for an electronic turbo and piezo injectors on the 648
Quote:OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?Not as good as the I6, but not designed around emissions/cost like the V6.
The 629 has piezo injectors.
The Finns are scared of them because they aren't as cheap, they need electronics and they don't revv to insane RPMs like the IDI engines.
I don't see alot of high HP CDI engines.
I can find OM606 here compleet for 2500 usd, OM613, 3500 usd and V8 OM628 for 4500 usd ...
Why is the V8 weaker? just engine design or weaker rods, crank?
It's true that the electronics are harder to figure out but on the other hand it's going to be easy to control smoke, torque & VGT/VNT
Thanks,
Raf
Grand cherokee WK (OM642)
11-03-2010, 01:35 PM
#7
Even fire Vee configuration engines often share crankshaft throws - so there's two conrods per throw and fewer main bearings.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
11-03-2010, 01:35 PM #7I6's have 7 main bearings and each conrod has its own crankshaft throw and conrod bearing. This layout is very, very strong...and still smooth as glass with the crank throws (and therefore the combustion events) offset at 120° angles.
Even fire Vee configuration engines often share crankshaft throws - so there's two conrods per throw and fewer main bearings.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
11-03-2010, 03:51 PM
#8
(11-03-2010, 01:27 AM)diesel2fast4u Hi, I know that this is mayby not the right forum but I cannot find anything about these engines.Friend has OM629 on his car. 400hp/900nm pretty fun daily driver.
OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?
OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?
Thanks,
Raf
OM605 600hp diesel drag car build with BMW E30 chassis
(11-03-2010, 01:27 AM)diesel2fast4u Hi, I know that this is mayby not the right forum but I cannot find anything about these engines.Friend has OM629 on his car. 400hp/900nm pretty fun daily driver.
OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?
OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?
Thanks,
Raf
OM605 600hp diesel drag car build with BMW E30 chassis
11-03-2010, 06:50 PM
#9
(11-03-2010, 03:51 PM)jeemu(11-03-2010, 01:27 AM)diesel2fast4u Hi, I know that this is mayby not the right forum but I cannot find anything about these engines.Friend has OM629 on his car. 400hp/900nm pretty fun daily driver.
OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?
OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?
Thanks,
Raf
Pictures pleeeassseee
Video!! pleeeeeaaaassssssseeee!!
1987 300D: EGR Delete, ARV Delete, Cold Air Intake...
(11-03-2010, 03:51 PM)jeemu(11-03-2010, 01:27 AM)diesel2fast4u Hi, I know that this is mayby not the right forum but I cannot find anything about these engines.Friend has OM629 on his car. 400hp/900nm pretty fun daily driver.
OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?
OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?
Thanks,
Raf
Pictures pleeeassseee
Video!! pleeeeeaaaassssssseeee!!
1987 300D: EGR Delete, ARV Delete, Cold Air Intake...
11-06-2010, 06:14 PM
#10
(11-03-2010, 06:50 PM)garageNot photos or vid for now.(11-03-2010, 03:51 PM)jeemu(11-03-2010, 01:27 AM)diesel2fast4u Hi, I know that this is mayby not the right forum but I cannot find anything about these engines.Friend has OM629 on his car. 400hp/900nm pretty fun daily driver.
OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?
OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?
Thanks,
Raf
Pictures pleeeassseee
Video!! pleeeeeaaaassssssseeee!!
But we are scared of those because those cost too much and dont rev high
OM605 600hp diesel drag car build with BMW E30 chassis
(11-03-2010, 06:50 PM)garageNot photos or vid for now.(11-03-2010, 03:51 PM)jeemu(11-03-2010, 01:27 AM)diesel2fast4u Hi, I know that this is mayby not the right forum but I cannot find anything about these engines.Friend has OM629 on his car. 400hp/900nm pretty fun daily driver.
OM613 & 648 I6 CDI's : How are the internals of these engines? Comparable to 606 or weaker?
OM628 & 629 V8 cdi's : Anybody saw what these engines look like inside?
Thanks,
Raf
Pictures pleeeassseee
Video!! pleeeeeaaaassssssseeee!!
But we are scared of those because those cost too much and dont rev high
OM605 600hp diesel drag car build with BMW E30 chassis
11-10-2010, 04:39 AM
#11
Few high HP CDI's cooking around, maybe some photos next year
- MB w126 300SD Superturbo (US) -83, Mods: OM617A with custom head work, Master Power Turbo 802332, PP-Diesel custom 7mm IP, China intercooler, KKD-Motorsport exhaust manifold, DIY intake manifold, Coolmist Waterinjection, DIY Supermeter display/datalog with PLX Wideband Lambda, Siekkinen custom 722.3 autotrans, Elbe Performance LSD, Green Filter cold air intake, straight 3" exhaust with two dual 2.5" outputs
- MB r129 500SL AMG (JDM) -94
Full AMG bodykit, full JDM features, modified ECU and exhaust
- MB w123 250E-TT (JDM) -85
Full 1JZ-GTE twinturbo conversion, full aircon, custom china cooler, custom IC-pipes, custom sport recaro interior, custom 3-piece JDM rims
We finnss are not scared of anything
Few high HP CDI's cooking around, maybe some photos next year
- MB w126 300SD Superturbo (US) -83, Mods: OM617A with custom head work, Master Power Turbo 802332, PP-Diesel custom 7mm IP, China intercooler, KKD-Motorsport exhaust manifold, DIY intake manifold, Coolmist Waterinjection, DIY Supermeter display/datalog with PLX Wideband Lambda, Siekkinen custom 722.3 autotrans, Elbe Performance LSD, Green Filter cold air intake, straight 3" exhaust with two dual 2.5" outputs
- MB r129 500SL AMG (JDM) -94
Full AMG bodykit, full JDM features, modified ECU and exhaust
- MB w123 250E-TT (JDM) -85
Full 1JZ-GTE twinturbo conversion, full aircon, custom china cooler, custom IC-pipes, custom sport recaro interior, custom 3-piece JDM rims
09-10-2012, 07:32 AM
#12
A) Rail pressure on OM648 is 1600bar, probably can take even a few hundred more (higher rail pressure probably partially contributes to finer fuel dispersion)
B) 722.90x gearboxes are newer (Generally less mileage), and are running at about the same pricetag
C) The chassis needs some work, so I might use it for something else, and get a totally different chassis for a project
At least I'm very positive about the changes CDI engines have brought to the diesel world.
(I have prior been a "Gasoline junkie", now heavily transforming to "Dieselmania")
blackslide
09-10-2012, 07:32 AM #12Got a spare S210 chassis + OM613 + 722.626, waiting for a tuneup. But I'm beginning to lean on the side of a OM648 + 722.90x.
A) Rail pressure on OM648 is 1600bar, probably can take even a few hundred more (higher rail pressure probably partially contributes to finer fuel dispersion)
B) 722.90x gearboxes are newer (Generally less mileage), and are running at about the same pricetag
C) The chassis needs some work, so I might use it for something else, and get a totally different chassis for a project
At least I'm very positive about the changes CDI engines have brought to the diesel world.
(I have prior been a "Gasoline junkie", now heavily transforming to "Dieselmania")
08-15-2016, 04:05 PM
#14
(08-09-2016, 10:06 PM)gstardiag Some years has gone
What are modern thoughts about om613 /om642 ?
My regards
om642 or om648?
www.blacksmokeracing.com
(08-09-2016, 10:06 PM)gstardiag Some years has gone
What are modern thoughts about om613 /om642 ?
My regards
om642 or om648?
www.blacksmokeracing.com
11-13-2016, 06:43 AM
#15
(08-09-2016, 10:06 PM)gstardiag Some years has gone
What are modern thoughts about om613 /om642 ?
My regards
OM613/OM48 haven't changed. Still the best diesels around. OM642 is a much inferior V-6 design. Partly for the inherent weakness in the layout, partly because it has been designed with cost reductions in mind.
The V8 CDIs have a totally different ECU from the rest. The software is encrypted, etc. thus making it a worse base for tuning. Someone could get into it, for money..
blackslide
11-13-2016, 06:43 AM #15(08-09-2016, 10:06 PM)gstardiag Some years has gone
What are modern thoughts about om613 /om642 ?
My regards
OM613/OM48 haven't changed. Still the best diesels around. OM642 is a much inferior V-6 design. Partly for the inherent weakness in the layout, partly because it has been designed with cost reductions in mind.
The V8 CDIs have a totally different ECU from the rest. The software is encrypted, etc. thus making it a worse base for tuning. Someone could get into it, for money..
11-13-2016, 08:05 AM
#16
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ex: 525tds 130kW, C250TD 160kW, E320CDI 200kW, ML400CDI 230kW, A6 R5TDI 130kW
Now: Q7 V8TDI 240kW, 320d 150kW, 335d 210kW
628 has this TEMIC ECU which is not documented as BOSCH EDC ECUs.. it is definitely hard to tune propertly, stupid shit tune is easy to do on this but..
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ex: 525tds 130kW, C250TD 160kW, E320CDI 200kW, ML400CDI 230kW, A6 R5TDI 130kW
Now: Q7 V8TDI 240kW, 320d 150kW, 335d 210kW
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