Timing chain replacement interval
Timing chain replacement interval
11-03-2010, 10:52 AM
#1
Any insight would be appreciated. I've worked on two different camshaft/injection pump drive scenarios in my life - belts or gears...never messed with one that had a chain...or a combination of chain/gears (like the OM606).
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
11-03-2010, 10:52 AM #1I searched around here on the forums and can't find much of anything concerning if/when the timing chain should be replaced on an OM606...
Any insight would be appreciated. I've worked on two different camshaft/injection pump drive scenarios in my life - belts or gears...never messed with one that had a chain...or a combination of chain/gears (like the OM606).
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
11-03-2010, 12:11 PM
#2
The chain will 'last' well beyond this wear, but perhaps it is not accurate enough for MB's taste. Unlike the om61x engines, they do not provide a cam advancement option for chain wear.
With proper care, a chain should definitely go 200k miles. After that, it really depends how the car was driven etc.
There are way too many variables to say xxxxx miles is when to change it. But if you have over 250k.... you should inspect the wear / timing delay.
totaldisaster
11-03-2010, 12:11 PM #2MB wants you to replace it after 4* of chain wear. You must determine this using the valve tappet lift method.
The chain will 'last' well beyond this wear, but perhaps it is not accurate enough for MB's taste. Unlike the om61x engines, they do not provide a cam advancement option for chain wear.
With proper care, a chain should definitely go 200k miles. After that, it really depends how the car was driven etc.
There are way too many variables to say xxxxx miles is when to change it. But if you have over 250k.... you should inspect the wear / timing delay.
11-03-2010, 01:42 PM
#3
I'd be surprised if the timing wasn't off a little on my engine at the mileage she's at. Does the RIV tool work on the OM606.962? They're such a simple tool - it's shame they go for $200-300.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
11-03-2010, 01:42 PM #34° of chain wear...nice. Sounds like something the Germans would say. I can't blame them, though - it's not like every engine wears at the same rate.
I'd be surprised if the timing wasn't off a little on my engine at the mileage she's at. Does the RIV tool work on the OM606.962? They're such a simple tool - it's shame they go for $200-300.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
11-03-2010, 05:22 PM
#4
If you use synthetic oil the chain should nearly not wear at all.
ForcedInduction
11-03-2010, 05:22 PM
#4
There is no set time or mileage interval.
If you use synthetic oil the chain should nearly not wear at all.
11-04-2010, 10:12 AM
#5
The oil is much darker with the Delvac - leading me to believe it keeps soot in suspension better than the Rotella. I'm not a fanatic about oil analysis or scrutinizing the details of oil specs. I use good oil, good filters and change them on a regular basis - done.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
11-04-2010, 10:12 AM #5Most of the year I run 5W-40 full synthetic Rotella T6. Right now I'm on my second fill of Delvac 1300 15W-40 as an experiment to see if the mileage would change. It didn't...but I'm on the highway at 65-70mph for > 95% of my commute.
The oil is much darker with the Delvac - leading me to believe it keeps soot in suspension better than the Rotella. I'm not a fanatic about oil analysis or scrutinizing the details of oil specs. I use good oil, good filters and change them on a regular basis - done.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
11-04-2010, 05:41 PM
#6
(11-04-2010, 10:12 AM)HoleshotHolset Most of the year I run 5W-40 full synthetic Rotella T6. Right now I'm on my second fill of Delvac 1300 15W-40 as an experiment to see if the mileage would change. It didn't.Thats because Rotella isn't synthetic. Its extra-refined dino to remove more of the natural crude oil contaminants. It still has impurities and imperfections that a true synthetic doesn't.
Quote:The oil is much darker with the Delvac - leading me to believe it keeps soot in suspension better than the Rotella.Other way around. Darkness means soot clumping together, light oil means the soot is being better dispersed.
ForcedInduction
11-04-2010, 05:41 PM
#6
(11-04-2010, 10:12 AM)HoleshotHolset Most of the year I run 5W-40 full synthetic Rotella T6. Right now I'm on my second fill of Delvac 1300 15W-40 as an experiment to see if the mileage would change. It didn't.Thats because Rotella isn't synthetic. Its extra-refined dino to remove more of the natural crude oil contaminants. It still has impurities and imperfections that a true synthetic doesn't.
Quote:The oil is much darker with the Delvac - leading me to believe it keeps soot in suspension better than the Rotella.Other way around. Darkness means soot clumping together, light oil means the soot is being better dispersed.
11-08-2010, 07:49 AM
#7
1987 300D Sturmmachine
1991 300D Nearly Perfect
1985 300D Weekend/Camping/Dog car
1974 L508D Motoroam Monarch "NightMare"
OBK #42
The 617 manual specifies only the keys. I would say once you are out of spec after a key its time. Also look for wear on the chain links themselves (plenty of data on this in relation to motorcycles).
1987 300D Sturmmachine
1991 300D Nearly Perfect
1985 300D Weekend/Camping/Dog car
1974 L508D Motoroam Monarch "NightMare"
OBK #42
11-08-2010, 10:54 AM
#8
ForcedInduction Thats because Rotella isn't synthetic. Its extra-refined dino to remove more of the natural crude oil contaminants. It still has impurities and imperfections that a true synthetic doesn't.
How do they get away with advertising it as 'synthetic'? I know that the 10W-30 Rotella is a synthetic blend...they don't try to hide that.
ForcedInduction Other way around. Darkness means soot clumping together, light oil means the soot is being better dispersed.
Interesting...
winmutt The 617 manual specifies only the keys. I would say once you are out of spec after a key its time. Also look for wear on the chain links themselves (plenty of data on this in relation to motorcycles).
OK - good to know. Thanks!
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
11-08-2010, 10:54 AM #8ForcedInduction Thats because Rotella isn't synthetic. Its extra-refined dino to remove more of the natural crude oil contaminants. It still has impurities and imperfections that a true synthetic doesn't.
How do they get away with advertising it as 'synthetic'? I know that the 10W-30 Rotella is a synthetic blend...they don't try to hide that.
ForcedInduction Other way around. Darkness means soot clumping together, light oil means the soot is being better dispersed.
Interesting...
winmutt The 617 manual specifies only the keys. I would say once you are out of spec after a key its time. Also look for wear on the chain links themselves (plenty of data on this in relation to motorcycles).
OK - good to know. Thanks!
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
11-08-2010, 11:02 AM
#9
(11-08-2010, 10:54 AM)HoleshotHolset How do they get away with advertising it as 'synthetic'?
* Group I and II - these are mineral oils derived from crude oil
* Group III - this is a highly refined mineral oil made through a process called hydrocracking. In North America this group is considered a synthetic oil, for marketing purposes.
* Group IV - these are true synthetic oils, known as Polyalphaolefin (PAO).
* Group V - these are synthetic stocks other than PAO's and include esters and other compounds.
http://www.articlesbase.com/automotive-a...51416.html
Quote:In a 1999 law suit brought by Mobil filed against Castrol essentially for false marketing practices, the US Supreme Court ruled in favor Castrol paving the way for them (and any other oil manufacturer) to market this group as "Synthetic Oil". Castrol successfully argued that since group III base stocks were refined further than "conventional" or Group II oils, and the best of them performed somewhat similar to group IV base stocks, that they were essentially synthetic. Group III base oils are rapidly gaining in popularity in the USA.
This post was last modified: 11-08-2010, 11:05 AM by ForcedInduction.
ForcedInduction
11-08-2010, 11:02 AM
#9
(11-08-2010, 10:54 AM)HoleshotHolset How do they get away with advertising it as 'synthetic'?
* Group I and II - these are mineral oils derived from crude oil
* Group III - this is a highly refined mineral oil made through a process called hydrocracking. In North America this group is considered a synthetic oil, for marketing purposes.
* Group IV - these are true synthetic oils, known as Polyalphaolefin (PAO).
* Group V - these are synthetic stocks other than PAO's and include esters and other compounds.
http://www.articlesbase.com/automotive-a...51416.html
Quote:In a 1999 law suit brought by Mobil filed against Castrol essentially for false marketing practices, the US Supreme Court ruled in favor Castrol paving the way for them (and any other oil manufacturer) to market this group as "Synthetic Oil". Castrol successfully argued that since group III base stocks were refined further than "conventional" or Group II oils, and the best of them performed somewhat similar to group IV base stocks, that they were essentially synthetic. Group III base oils are rapidly gaining in popularity in the USA.
11-08-2010, 11:11 AM
#10
Is Mobil 1 synthetic? That's about the only other thing I can find on a regular basis that I would consider. I have friends that hawk Amsoil, but that stuff is crazy expensive...and I do not like that they're proponents of hugely extended drain intervals.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
11-08-2010, 11:11 AM #10Wow. I did NOT know that...and now suddenly feel like an idiot for buying Rotella-T 5W-40 "synthetic" all these years. Son of a &^%@*.
Is Mobil 1 synthetic? That's about the only other thing I can find on a regular basis that I would consider. I have friends that hawk Amsoil, but that stuff is crazy expensive...and I do not like that they're proponents of hugely extended drain intervals.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
11-08-2010, 11:25 AM
#11
Until I get my leaks fixed I am using Rotella T, then back to Mobil1. I just wish there were more options avail.
1987 300D Sturmmachine
1991 300D Nearly Perfect
1985 300D Weekend/Camping/Dog car
1974 L508D Motoroam Monarch "NightMare"
OBK #42
Lance has been prattling on about that forever
Until I get my leaks fixed I am using Rotella T, then back to Mobil1. I just wish there were more options avail.
1987 300D Sturmmachine
1991 300D Nearly Perfect
1985 300D Weekend/Camping/Dog car
1974 L508D Motoroam Monarch "NightMare"
OBK #42
11-08-2010, 11:33 AM
#12
Doesn't MB recommend a 10W-30 for the OM606? I know I've seen Mobil 1 stickers under the hoods of a lot of OEM performance vehicles...and there's no doubt in my mind that it's good oil, but I've never run it in a diesel.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
11-08-2010, 11:33 AM #12This is the first time I've heard of such a thing. Maybe it's not a big deal, maybe it is a big deal. I know my engine doesn't turn over in the cold WX as easily and the lifters clatter for a second or two with the Delvac. This doesn't happen in the summer, of course...and never happened with the 5W-40 Rotella.
Doesn't MB recommend a 10W-30 for the OM606? I know I've seen Mobil 1 stickers under the hoods of a lot of OEM performance vehicles...and there's no doubt in my mind that it's good oil, but I've never run it in a diesel.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
11-08-2010, 11:43 AM
#13
(11-08-2010, 11:11 AM)HoleshotHolset and I do not like that they're proponents of hugely extended drain intervals.
Me neither. I feel guilty just running it one year or 8k miles.
Way back in my wal-mart TLE days, one guy came through with his Neon for only a filter change and he said he runs his amsoil 30k miles.
Rotella's "synthetic" isn't a bad oil, its better than any dino oil, I just don't like that they're basically lying to their customers.
ForcedInduction
11-08-2010, 11:43 AM
#13
(11-08-2010, 11:11 AM)HoleshotHolset and I do not like that they're proponents of hugely extended drain intervals.
Me neither. I feel guilty just running it one year or 8k miles.
Way back in my wal-mart TLE days, one guy came through with his Neon for only a filter change and he said he runs his amsoil 30k miles.
Rotella's "synthetic" isn't a bad oil, its better than any dino oil, I just don't like that they're basically lying to their customers.
11-10-2010, 01:56 PM
#14
(11-08-2010, 11:25 AM)winmutt Forced has been prattling on about that forever
Until I get my leaks fixed I am using Rotella T, then back to Mobil1. I just wish there were more options avail.
Sorry to repeat myself but I've heard good things about BG Products synthetic oil and Mack Truck synthetic. I'll be switching most likely to one of those and post my impressions as soon as possible.
"Molly" Jan. '84 black/tan 300d 180k miles, two owner car
Silberpfeil
11-10-2010, 01:56 PM #14(11-08-2010, 11:25 AM)winmutt Forced has been prattling on about that forever
Until I get my leaks fixed I am using Rotella T, then back to Mobil1. I just wish there were more options avail.
Sorry to repeat myself but I've heard good things about BG Products synthetic oil and Mack Truck synthetic. I'll be switching most likely to one of those and post my impressions as soon as possible.
"Molly" Jan. '84 black/tan 300d 180k miles, two owner car
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