fuel temperature
fuel temperature
11-14-2010, 09:34 PM
#1
I have a Nissan 4WD with OM601 and am trying to improve it some. I am getting 34 (US) mpg now.
11-15-2010, 07:51 AM
#2
The only vehicles that can get fuel hot enough to cause problems are extreme pressure injection systems like unit injection and common rail. The hottest yours will get is 230*f of the oil system.
ForcedInduction
11-15-2010, 07:51 AM
#2
It has no effect at the temperatures yours will ever get to.
The only vehicles that can get fuel hot enough to cause problems are extreme pressure injection systems like unit injection and common rail. The hottest yours will get is 230*f of the oil system.
11-15-2010, 06:20 PM
#4
(11-15-2010, 03:00 PM)ben2go At what temp does diesel start to gel,37*F?
There is none. It varies a large amount depending on the mixture of additives and #1. Anywhere from 25* for average summer fuel to -60* or colder for the low-cetane arctic blends.
ForcedInduction
11-15-2010, 06:20 PM
#4
(11-15-2010, 03:00 PM)ben2go At what temp does diesel start to gel,37*F?
There is none. It varies a large amount depending on the mixture of additives and #1. Anywhere from 25* for average summer fuel to -60* or colder for the low-cetane arctic blends.
11-15-2010, 08:46 PM
#6
ForcedInduction
11-15-2010, 08:46 PM
#6
They probably wait until November/December to switch over instead of October like they do around here.
11-17-2010, 12:38 AM
#9
ForcedInduction
11-17-2010, 12:38 AM
#9
Thats the nice thing about using truck stops, the one I use clearly marks which pumps are #2 and which are winterized. That way for extended warm years like this one I can wait longer to switch over when I want.
11-18-2010, 05:56 AM
#11
Must be a fairly high % of summit, to give such an effect....
![[Image: 300TDnoplate.jpg]](http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z128/alastairhcii/300TDnoplate.jpg)
Alastair E
11-18-2010, 05:56 AM #11I wonder just What they add to 'winterised diesel' that obviously reduces its calorific value to the extent that a noticable power-loss occurs....
Must be a fairly high % of summit, to give such an effect....
11-18-2010, 11:43 AM
#12
I thought adding methanol helped keep diesel and WVO/VO from gelling?
1990 Mercury Blue Max Cougar 3.8L with Automatic
Future OM617 Super Turbo Diesel Conversion with T56 6 Speed Manual
11-18-2010, 12:41 PM
#13
Not sure if it mixes with std. diesel, but suspect not....
I think its used sometimes in petrol and for drying out the air brake-circuits of artics...
Alastair E
11-18-2010, 12:41 PM #13Nah, Methanol doesnt actually mix with WVO, unless it has a catalyst present, it settles out on top....
Not sure if it mixes with std. diesel, but suspect not....
I think its used sometimes in petrol and for drying out the air brake-circuits of artics...
11-18-2010, 01:08 PM
#14
I chatted with my friend and he said that the company they get there fuels from don't divulge the mix or ratio of their additives.I was curious,so I ran over and ask him.Their like 2 miles from my house.
This post was last modified: 11-19-2010, 07:18 AM by ben2go.
1990 Mercury Blue Max Cougar 3.8L with Automatic
Future OM617 Super Turbo Diesel Conversion with T56 6 Speed Manual
I knew methanol/ethanol wouldn't mix with VO or diesel.I know it's good injected.
I chatted with my friend and he said that the company they get there fuels from don't divulge the mix or ratio of their additives.I was curious,so I ran over and ask him.Their like 2 miles from my house.
1990 Mercury Blue Max Cougar 3.8L with Automatic
Future OM617 Super Turbo Diesel Conversion with T56 6 Speed Manual
11-18-2010, 10:37 PM
#15
(11-15-2010, 06:20 PM)ForcedInduction There is none. It varies a large amount depending on the mixture of additives and #1. Anywhere from 25* for average summer fuel to -60* or colder for the low-cetane arctic blends.
1. So arctic blends are low cetane??
2. Does cetane then have an effect on gelling???
3. Is it then better to not use a cetane booster in the extreme cold??
BTW, I re-watched the Top Gear North Pole trip and the fuel they used (that Arctic Truck used) was a mix of diesel and AV gas.
"Molly" Jan. '84 black/tan 300d 180k miles, two owner car
Silberpfeil
11-18-2010, 10:37 PM #15(11-15-2010, 06:20 PM)ForcedInduction There is none. It varies a large amount depending on the mixture of additives and #1. Anywhere from 25* for average summer fuel to -60* or colder for the low-cetane arctic blends.
1. So arctic blends are low cetane??
2. Does cetane then have an effect on gelling???
3. Is it then better to not use a cetane booster in the extreme cold??
BTW, I re-watched the Top Gear North Pole trip and the fuel they used (that Arctic Truck used) was a mix of diesel and AV gas.
"Molly" Jan. '84 black/tan 300d 180k miles, two owner car
11-19-2010, 07:27 AM
#16
(11-18-2010, 10:37 PM)Silberpfeil(11-15-2010, 06:20 PM)ForcedInduction There is none. It varies a large amount depending on the mixture of additives and #1. Anywhere from 25* for average summer fuel to -60* or colder for the low-cetane arctic blends.
1. So arctic blends are low cetane??
2. Does cetane then have an effect on gelling???
3. Is it then better to not use a cetane booster in the extreme cold??
BTW, I re-watched the Top Gear North Pole trip and the fuel they used (that Arctic Truck used) was a mix of diesel and AV gas.
I am surprised they used AV gas.Was it 100LL?Seems like they would have run jet A,because it's formulated to stay a liquid at 50,000 feet and -70*F.AV gas is nothing but a highly refined gasoline, with lead added in to protect aircraft valves, when we lean them out to conserve fuel.
I've checked around and can not find anything about the winter additives.Seems like everybody has a secret.
1990 Mercury Blue Max Cougar 3.8L with Automatic
Future OM617 Super Turbo Diesel Conversion with T56 6 Speed Manual
(11-18-2010, 10:37 PM)Silberpfeil(11-15-2010, 06:20 PM)ForcedInduction There is none. It varies a large amount depending on the mixture of additives and #1. Anywhere from 25* for average summer fuel to -60* or colder for the low-cetane arctic blends.
1. So arctic blends are low cetane??
2. Does cetane then have an effect on gelling???
3. Is it then better to not use a cetane booster in the extreme cold??
BTW, I re-watched the Top Gear North Pole trip and the fuel they used (that Arctic Truck used) was a mix of diesel and AV gas.
I am surprised they used AV gas.Was it 100LL?Seems like they would have run jet A,because it's formulated to stay a liquid at 50,000 feet and -70*F.AV gas is nothing but a highly refined gasoline, with lead added in to protect aircraft valves, when we lean them out to conserve fuel.
I've checked around and can not find anything about the winter additives.Seems like everybody has a secret.
1990 Mercury Blue Max Cougar 3.8L with Automatic
Future OM617 Super Turbo Diesel Conversion with T56 6 Speed Manual
11-19-2010, 08:56 AM
#17
(11-18-2010, 10:37 PM)Silberpfeil [b]1. So arctic blends are low cetane??Low cetane is a result of the kerosene and anti-gelling additives. Cetane boosters, like octane boosters, are mostly placebo effect boosters.
2. Does cetane then have an effect on gelling???
3. Is it then better to not use a cetane booster in the extreme cold??
Quote:BTW, I re-watched the Top Gear North Pole trip and the fuel they used (that Arctic Truck used) was a mix of diesel and AV gas.Thats likely because vehicles in such extreme cold need a more volatile fuel just to run.
Quote:Seems like they would have run jet A,because it's formulated to stay a liquid at 50,000 feet and -70*F.Jet A is very high sulfur, if the pickup still had any emissions equipment that would have plugged them very quickly. It also has poor lubricity and viscosity.
An old inline pump might handle it, maybe a rotary pump too, but a common rail system would be eaten alive by Jet A.
ForcedInduction
11-19-2010, 08:56 AM
#17
(11-18-2010, 10:37 PM)Silberpfeil [b]1. So arctic blends are low cetane??Low cetane is a result of the kerosene and anti-gelling additives. Cetane boosters, like octane boosters, are mostly placebo effect boosters.
2. Does cetane then have an effect on gelling???
3. Is it then better to not use a cetane booster in the extreme cold??
Quote:BTW, I re-watched the Top Gear North Pole trip and the fuel they used (that Arctic Truck used) was a mix of diesel and AV gas.Thats likely because vehicles in such extreme cold need a more volatile fuel just to run.
Quote:Seems like they would have run jet A,because it's formulated to stay a liquid at 50,000 feet and -70*F.Jet A is very high sulfur, if the pickup still had any emissions equipment that would have plugged them very quickly. It also has poor lubricity and viscosity.
An old inline pump might handle it, maybe a rotary pump too, but a common rail system would be eaten alive by Jet A.
12-03-2010, 04:36 AM
#18
(11-18-2010, 10:37 PM)Silberpfeil 1. So arctic blends are low cetane??
2. Does cetane then have an effect on gelling???
3. Is it then better to not use a cetane booster in the extreme cold??
(11-19-2010, 08:56 AM)ForcedInduction Low cetane is a result of the kerosene and anti-gelling additives. Cetane boosters, like octane boosters, are mostly placebo effect boosters.
So cetane boosters should not affect gelling/anti-gelling characteristics??
"Molly" Jan. '84 black/tan 300d 180k miles, two owner car
Silberpfeil
12-03-2010, 04:36 AM #18(11-18-2010, 10:37 PM)Silberpfeil 1. So arctic blends are low cetane??
2. Does cetane then have an effect on gelling???
3. Is it then better to not use a cetane booster in the extreme cold??
(11-19-2010, 08:56 AM)ForcedInduction Low cetane is a result of the kerosene and anti-gelling additives. Cetane boosters, like octane boosters, are mostly placebo effect boosters.
So cetane boosters should not affect gelling/anti-gelling characteristics??
"Molly" Jan. '84 black/tan 300d 180k miles, two owner car
12-03-2010, 07:32 AM
#19
ForcedInduction
12-03-2010, 07:32 AM
#19
Right. However there are few straight cetane boosters on the market. FPPF 8+ and Diesel Kleen being the only two common additives I can think of at the moment.
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