722.6 or GM automatic? You decide.
722.6 or GM automatic? You decide.
05-05-2011, 10:29 AM
#1
(03-01-2011, 04:22 PM)Riverstick Apparently the 722.6 auto 'box is also fitted to some models of Porsche and these are being reprogrammed on the aftermarket? Maybe someone could help us on this?
Here in the US, the 722.6 is quite popular and is used in the Chrysler 'LX' chassis - 300C, Charger, Magnum, Challenger, etc. It is also known as the NAG1 or W5A580. There are only a few differences between the high power/torque versions and the low power/torque versions. The planetaries have more sun gears and some of the clutch packs have more friction plates. The torque converter clutch also has multiple friction plates on the high power/torque versions. The good news is that the diesel versions of the 722.6 are already pretty beefy - in the middle of the range in terms of power/torque handling capacity. All we need is to upgrade to the necessary hard parts to allow more friction plates in a few of the clutch packs.
Based on my studying of ATRA and Chrysler rebuild/repair manuals and looking at a few videos, rebuilding these transmissions appears to be VERY easy. I have not torn one apart, but I intend on doing so since the 722.608 in my car is weak and the 3-4 shift is delayed and slipping a bit once it warms up.
If my 722.608 holds up long enough - also in the works is my plans to use a GM 4L80E which I have on the shelf awaiting a rebuild. These can be controlled with an aftermarket TCM or use full manual valvebody. These can be built with relatively low cost to handle anything an OM60x could ever dream of throwing at it.
I have a rudimentary Solidworks sketch of the OM606 bellhousing pattern based on my junk "1.25L" OM606 block that I machined up - I only need help to finish the sketch and then find a machine shop to make and engineer the adapter plate. I *had* unrestricted access to a CNC bed mill (which I used as a makeshift CMM to get the point cloud data down to 0.0001" off the bellhousing...) - but not any longer.
There is a shop in Minnesota that makes an OM617 to Chevy V8 adapter, and I have been in touch with them to make one for the OM606...but I do not have the spare cash these days to send my engine and other parts to them to have the work done.
Here is the link:
http://www.transmissionadapters.com/Merc...diesel.htm
Maybe this could be a bit of a collaborative effort if someone out there has some Solidworks skills and access to a decent size 3-axis CNC bed mill.
I will attach some pictures I took of the "1.25L" OM606 sitting on the mill. The guy I bought it from cut up the engine so I could save on shipping costs. After I milled this face flat and parallel to the bellhousing face, I affixed it to the mill's table on this milled face so that data points could be captured using the mill's control readout to within 0.0001".
Beers,
Matt
Here are some pictures...
This is how the block/crank arrived.
Machining in progress with Sandvik indexable shell mill.
Block machining completed, crankshaft machining not started yet.
Crankshaft machining completed - it was machined so that the journal's surface is below the machined surface on the block by 0.030" or so. You can see the depth of the rod journal heat treat...pretty neat stuff.
This post was last modified: 05-05-2011, 10:40 AM by HoleshotHolset.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
05-05-2011, 10:29 AM #1Instead of hijacking the other thread - I'm posting here.
(03-01-2011, 04:22 PM)Riverstick Apparently the 722.6 auto 'box is also fitted to some models of Porsche and these are being reprogrammed on the aftermarket? Maybe someone could help us on this?
Here in the US, the 722.6 is quite popular and is used in the Chrysler 'LX' chassis - 300C, Charger, Magnum, Challenger, etc. It is also known as the NAG1 or W5A580. There are only a few differences between the high power/torque versions and the low power/torque versions. The planetaries have more sun gears and some of the clutch packs have more friction plates. The torque converter clutch also has multiple friction plates on the high power/torque versions. The good news is that the diesel versions of the 722.6 are already pretty beefy - in the middle of the range in terms of power/torque handling capacity. All we need is to upgrade to the necessary hard parts to allow more friction plates in a few of the clutch packs.
Based on my studying of ATRA and Chrysler rebuild/repair manuals and looking at a few videos, rebuilding these transmissions appears to be VERY easy. I have not torn one apart, but I intend on doing so since the 722.608 in my car is weak and the 3-4 shift is delayed and slipping a bit once it warms up.
If my 722.608 holds up long enough - also in the works is my plans to use a GM 4L80E which I have on the shelf awaiting a rebuild. These can be controlled with an aftermarket TCM or use full manual valvebody. These can be built with relatively low cost to handle anything an OM60x could ever dream of throwing at it.
I have a rudimentary Solidworks sketch of the OM606 bellhousing pattern based on my junk "1.25L" OM606 block that I machined up - I only need help to finish the sketch and then find a machine shop to make and engineer the adapter plate. I *had* unrestricted access to a CNC bed mill (which I used as a makeshift CMM to get the point cloud data down to 0.0001" off the bellhousing...) - but not any longer.
There is a shop in Minnesota that makes an OM617 to Chevy V8 adapter, and I have been in touch with them to make one for the OM606...but I do not have the spare cash these days to send my engine and other parts to them to have the work done.
Here is the link:
http://www.transmissionadapters.com/Merc...diesel.htm
Maybe this could be a bit of a collaborative effort if someone out there has some Solidworks skills and access to a decent size 3-axis CNC bed mill.
I will attach some pictures I took of the "1.25L" OM606 sitting on the mill. The guy I bought it from cut up the engine so I could save on shipping costs. After I milled this face flat and parallel to the bellhousing face, I affixed it to the mill's table on this milled face so that data points could be captured using the mill's control readout to within 0.0001".
Beers,
Matt
Here are some pictures...
This is how the block/crank arrived.
Machining in progress with Sandvik indexable shell mill.
Block machining completed, crankshaft machining not started yet.
Crankshaft machining completed - it was machined so that the journal's surface is below the machined surface on the block by 0.030" or so. You can see the depth of the rod journal heat treat...pretty neat stuff.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
05-08-2011, 03:17 PM
#2
The only thing I like about the Merc auto trans is the size compared to a GM. They are VERY compact. I dunno the size of the 722.6 though...
I drive all my autos manually anyway, so I would go with a Manual valve body
This post was last modified: 05-08-2011, 03:17 PM by Captain America.
1982 300D Turbo ... 3,6xxlbs, No fan, No AC, Hood Stack, No ALDA, No rear bumper and stuffed front, A/W Intercooled, Injectors by Greezer and HUGE Pre-Chambers with help from OM616 & Simpler=Better, Fuel Cranked up, 60 Trim Compressor wheel, EGT, EMP, Boost 50" Rigid Radius bar on roof Aux tank for a total of 48 Gal Of Diesel! Odyssey PC-1750 Battery in trunk, 27"x8.5"/R14 Maxxis BigHorn Mud Terrains, In June '14 issue of Off Road Mag
AX15 Jeep Trans swap in progress....
Captain America
05-08-2011, 03:17 PM #2Oh man! I would stick a GM trans behind that so fast you wouldn't even know what happened!
The only thing I like about the Merc auto trans is the size compared to a GM. They are VERY compact. I dunno the size of the 722.6 though...
I drive all my autos manually anyway, so I would go with a Manual valve body
1982 300D Turbo ... 3,6xxlbs, No fan, No AC, Hood Stack, No ALDA, No rear bumper and stuffed front, A/W Intercooled, Injectors by Greezer and HUGE Pre-Chambers with help from OM616 & Simpler=Better, Fuel Cranked up, 60 Trim Compressor wheel, EGT, EMP, Boost 50" Rigid Radius bar on roof Aux tank for a total of 48 Gal Of Diesel! Odyssey PC-1750 Battery in trunk, 27"x8.5"/R14 Maxxis BigHorn Mud Terrains, In June '14 issue of Off Road Mag
AX15 Jeep Trans swap in progress....
05-09-2011, 09:38 AM
#3
The really good news is that the design for an intermediate plate made for a GM auto could be altered a bit so that you could use a GM manual tranny - like a T56...or maybe a Tremec TKO 600 with a GM V8 pattern.
The 4L80E isn't all that big compared to other automatics, but it's definitely bigger than the 722.6. One concern (among many...) I have is whether the Chevy V8 bellhousing will fit in my W210. Gotta do some measuring...but it's hard to do with the OM606.962/722.608 already installed in the chassis.
Attached is a screenshot of the OM606 bellhousing pattern I sketched in SolidWorks. I'm a complete newbie using this...so take it easy on me.
Attached Files
Image(s)'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
05-09-2011, 09:38 AM #3I hear ya - the benefits of the GM auto are too numerous to count.
The really good news is that the design for an intermediate plate made for a GM auto could be altered a bit so that you could use a GM manual tranny - like a T56...or maybe a Tremec TKO 600 with a GM V8 pattern.
The 4L80E isn't all that big compared to other automatics, but it's definitely bigger than the 722.6. One concern (among many...) I have is whether the Chevy V8 bellhousing will fit in my W210. Gotta do some measuring...but it's hard to do with the OM606.962/722.608 already installed in the chassis.
Attached is a screenshot of the OM606 bellhousing pattern I sketched in SolidWorks. I'm a complete newbie using this...so take it easy on me.
Attached Files
Image(s)'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
05-09-2011, 10:39 AM
#4
(05-09-2011, 09:38 AM)HoleshotHolset I'm a complete newbie using this...so take it easy on me.In that case, always make sure that the sketch is fully defined.
Would a 700R4 fit W123 chassis? What is the difference in weight?
Sorry if I hijacked your thread.
05-09-2011, 10:59 AM
#5
(05-09-2011, 10:39 AM)Imaginos In that case, always make sure that the sketch is fully defined.
What do you mean by 'fully defined'?
The 700R4 or 4L60 is physically smaller than the 4L80E and not built as strong - so it could fit into tighter areas. However, the 4L60 still has that wide Chevy V8 bellhousing which may cause some issues when trying to fit it into a tight engine compartment.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
05-09-2011, 10:59 AM #5(05-09-2011, 10:39 AM)Imaginos In that case, always make sure that the sketch is fully defined.
What do you mean by 'fully defined'?
The 700R4 or 4L60 is physically smaller than the 4L80E and not built as strong - so it could fit into tighter areas. However, the 4L60 still has that wide Chevy V8 bellhousing which may cause some issues when trying to fit it into a tight engine compartment.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
05-09-2011, 01:42 PM
#6
(05-09-2011, 10:59 AM)HoleshotHolset What do you mean by 'fully defined'?
That all the lines of the sketch are black, not blue. That means all the lines are defined by dimension and location. For example, if you draw a rectangle, and define dimensions of a vertical and horizontal edges, you still have to define its location in relation to the centre of coordinate system. Hope that makes sense?
Fully defined sketch is important later on if you move to more advanced stuff in SW, not only will it work faster, but chances of getting weird errors when doing something are significantly decreased.
(05-09-2011, 10:59 AM)HoleshotHolset What do you mean by 'fully defined'?
That all the lines of the sketch are black, not blue. That means all the lines are defined by dimension and location. For example, if you draw a rectangle, and define dimensions of a vertical and horizontal edges, you still have to define its location in relation to the centre of coordinate system. Hope that makes sense?
Fully defined sketch is important later on if you move to more advanced stuff in SW, not only will it work faster, but chances of getting weird errors when doing something are significantly decreased.
05-09-2011, 09:43 PM
#7
(05-09-2011, 01:42 PM)Imaginos For example, if you draw a rectangle, and define dimensions of a vertical and horizontal edges, you still have to define its location in relation to the centre of coordinate system.
OK - that does make sense.
All points were placed on the sketch with relation to the origin. In this case, the origin I used was the imaginary center of the crankshaft main journal...this seemed to be the most logical choice. The lines and arcs that I drew on the sketch were just made between the points. When I had the block on the CNC bed mill, by using a dial indicator or an edge finder, I read and stored the X, Y, Z location from the control to within 0.0001".
Thanks for your help!
This post was last modified: 05-09-2011, 09:49 PM by HoleshotHolset.
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
05-09-2011, 09:43 PM #7(05-09-2011, 01:42 PM)Imaginos For example, if you draw a rectangle, and define dimensions of a vertical and horizontal edges, you still have to define its location in relation to the centre of coordinate system.
OK - that does make sense.
All points were placed on the sketch with relation to the origin. In this case, the origin I used was the imaginary center of the crankshaft main journal...this seemed to be the most logical choice. The lines and arcs that I drew on the sketch were just made between the points. When I had the block on the CNC bed mill, by using a dial indicator or an edge finder, I read and stored the X, Y, Z location from the control to within 0.0001".
Thanks for your help!
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
05-16-2011, 09:07 AM
#9
(05-14-2011, 01:03 AM)fte *snip* I have a 700r4 behind my OM617t installed in a 86 Cherokee 4x4, made the adapter myself *snip*
Want to make another adapter - this time for an OM606?
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
05-16-2011, 09:07 AM #9(05-14-2011, 01:03 AM)fte *snip* I have a 700r4 behind my OM617t installed in a 86 Cherokee 4x4, made the adapter myself *snip*
Want to make another adapter - this time for an OM606?
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
05-17-2011, 11:06 AM
#10
It wasn't too difficult, just made a jig and allignment tool to bolt to a GM manual bellhousing and cut an adapter plate from that. As for the torque comverter, I cut up the Benz tq and used half of it to connect the GM conv to the Benz flywheel. It has been my DD for a year now with zero problems.
05-17-2011, 11:14 AM
#11
(05-17-2011, 11:06 AM)fte It wasn't too difficult, just made a jig and allignment tool to bolt to a GM manual bellhousing and cut an adapter plate from that. As for the torque comverter, I cut up the Benz tq and used half of it to connect the GM conv to the Benz flywheel. It has been my DD for a year now with zero problems.
Sounds like you have access to a mill and a lathe and have the experience to use them. I do not have any free access to machine tools at the present time.
Very cool about using half of the Merc converter and welding it to the other half of the GM converter. I was going to investigate whether a custom torque converter shop could do something like that since the Merc flywheel/flexplate is somewhat complicated in that it needs to have the features for the hall effect sensor included.
Thanks for your input!
Beers,
Matt
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
05-17-2011, 11:14 AM #11(05-17-2011, 11:06 AM)fte It wasn't too difficult, just made a jig and allignment tool to bolt to a GM manual bellhousing and cut an adapter plate from that. As for the torque comverter, I cut up the Benz tq and used half of it to connect the GM conv to the Benz flywheel. It has been my DD for a year now with zero problems.
Sounds like you have access to a mill and a lathe and have the experience to use them. I do not have any free access to machine tools at the present time.
Very cool about using half of the Merc converter and welding it to the other half of the GM converter. I was going to investigate whether a custom torque converter shop could do something like that since the Merc flywheel/flexplate is somewhat complicated in that it needs to have the features for the hall effect sensor included.
Thanks for your input!
Beers,
Matt
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
05-19-2011, 09:26 AM
#13
Do you have any pictures of that adapter? I'm interested how you designed it. I envision the adapter needing to be the same thickness of the bellhousing adapter plate.
Beers,
Matt
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
05-19-2011, 09:26 AM #13OK - that sounds like an easier route to take rather than making up a custom converter.
Do you have any pictures of that adapter? I'm interested how you designed it. I envision the adapter needing to be the same thickness of the bellhousing adapter plate.
Beers,
Matt
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
05-19-2011, 10:07 AM
#14
1982 300D Turbo ... 3,6xxlbs, No fan, No AC, Hood Stack, No ALDA, No rear bumper and stuffed front, A/W Intercooled, Injectors by Greezer and HUGE Pre-Chambers with help from OM616 & Simpler=Better, Fuel Cranked up, 60 Trim Compressor wheel, EGT, EMP, Boost 50" Rigid Radius bar on roof Aux tank for a total of 48 Gal Of Diesel! Odyssey PC-1750 Battery in trunk, 27"x8.5"/R14 Maxxis BigHorn Mud Terrains, In June '14 issue of Off Road Mag
AX15 Jeep Trans swap in progress....
Captain America
05-19-2011, 10:07 AM #14Is the Cherokee Green?
1982 300D Turbo ... 3,6xxlbs, No fan, No AC, Hood Stack, No ALDA, No rear bumper and stuffed front, A/W Intercooled, Injectors by Greezer and HUGE Pre-Chambers with help from OM616 & Simpler=Better, Fuel Cranked up, 60 Trim Compressor wheel, EGT, EMP, Boost 50" Rigid Radius bar on roof Aux tank for a total of 48 Gal Of Diesel! Odyssey PC-1750 Battery in trunk, 27"x8.5"/R14 Maxxis BigHorn Mud Terrains, In June '14 issue of Off Road Mag
AX15 Jeep Trans swap in progress....
05-20-2011, 12:55 AM
#15
I tried to load some pix but it wouldn't let me, maybe I'll get my kid to help lol! The spacing worked out nice because the Benz cut up converter fit the contour of the GM converter, and I used a steel plate between the bell and flywheel cover. Foreward of the plate is all Benz, behind GM. The Cherokee is dark blue.
05-20-2011, 01:26 PM
#16
(05-20-2011, 12:55 AM)fte I tried to load some pix but it wouldn't let me, maybe I'll get my kid to help lol! The spacing worked out nice because the Benz cut up converter fit the contour of the GM converter, and I used a steel plate between the bell and flywheel cover. Foreward of the plate is all Benz, behind GM. The Cherokee is dark blue.
I saw some YouTube vids of one a while back... Was it yours?
1982 300D Turbo ... 3,6xxlbs, No fan, No AC, Hood Stack, No ALDA, No rear bumper and stuffed front, A/W Intercooled, Injectors by Greezer and HUGE Pre-Chambers with help from OM616 & Simpler=Better, Fuel Cranked up, 60 Trim Compressor wheel, EGT, EMP, Boost 50" Rigid Radius bar on roof Aux tank for a total of 48 Gal Of Diesel! Odyssey PC-1750 Battery in trunk, 27"x8.5"/R14 Maxxis BigHorn Mud Terrains, In June '14 issue of Off Road Mag
AX15 Jeep Trans swap in progress....
Captain America
05-20-2011, 01:26 PM #16(05-20-2011, 12:55 AM)fte I tried to load some pix but it wouldn't let me, maybe I'll get my kid to help lol! The spacing worked out nice because the Benz cut up converter fit the contour of the GM converter, and I used a steel plate between the bell and flywheel cover. Foreward of the plate is all Benz, behind GM. The Cherokee is dark blue.
I saw some YouTube vids of one a while back... Was it yours?
1982 300D Turbo ... 3,6xxlbs, No fan, No AC, Hood Stack, No ALDA, No rear bumper and stuffed front, A/W Intercooled, Injectors by Greezer and HUGE Pre-Chambers with help from OM616 & Simpler=Better, Fuel Cranked up, 60 Trim Compressor wheel, EGT, EMP, Boost 50" Rigid Radius bar on roof Aux tank for a total of 48 Gal Of Diesel! Odyssey PC-1750 Battery in trunk, 27"x8.5"/R14 Maxxis BigHorn Mud Terrains, In June '14 issue of Off Road Mag
AX15 Jeep Trans swap in progress....
05-20-2011, 10:56 PM
#17
(05-20-2011, 01:26 PM)Captain America(05-20-2011, 12:55 AM)fte I tried to load some pix but it wouldn't let me, maybe I'll get my kid to help lol! The spacing worked out nice because the Benz cut up converter fit the contour of the GM converter, and I used a steel plate between the bell and flywheel cover. Foreward of the plate is all Benz, behind GM. The Cherokee is dark blue.
I saw some YouTube vids of one a while back... Was it yours?
Nope
(05-20-2011, 01:26 PM)Captain America(05-20-2011, 12:55 AM)fte I tried to load some pix but it wouldn't let me, maybe I'll get my kid to help lol! The spacing worked out nice because the Benz cut up converter fit the contour of the GM converter, and I used a steel plate between the bell and flywheel cover. Foreward of the plate is all Benz, behind GM. The Cherokee is dark blue.
I saw some YouTube vids of one a while back... Was it yours?
Nope
05-26-2011, 06:32 PM
#18
(05-09-2011, 09:38 AM)HoleshotHolset I hear ya - the benefits of the GM auto are too numerous to count.
The really good news is that the design for an intermediate plate made for a GM auto could be altered a bit so that you could use a GM manual tranny - like a T56...or maybe a Tremec TKO 600 with a GM V8 pattern.
The 4L80E isn't all that big compared to other automatics, but it's definitely bigger than the 722.6. One concern (among many...) I have is whether the Chevy V8 bellhousing will fit in my W210. Gotta do some measuring...but it's hard to do with the OM606.962/722.608 already installed in the chassis.
Attached is a screenshot of the OM606 bellhousing pattern I sketched in SolidWorks. I'm a complete newbie using this...so take it easy on me.
Quote:I'm a complete newbie using this...so take it easy on me.
NO!!! Trial by fire is always best!!!
I hate to break it to ya but you could have probably sketched that up without having to sweep anything in on the CNC. That's the beauty of sketching in Solidworks or any other parametric modeling software with strong sketching ability. You could have doweled or put a bolt in every threaded hole and taken multiple measurements across them from one to the other(s) with a caliper or depth mic off the flat surfaces (pan gasket surface). But, to make you feel better, doing what you did was more accurate and easier. All I'm saying is you could have done it with an engine in the car and not had to use the cut up engine. It's especially easier when you start sketching it up and can conclude many of the bolt holes are on a bolt pattern or a nominal distance from the crank centerline for example. In that case sweeping them all in isn't necessarily more accurate. I did a billet bellhousing for a 2-71 Detroit Diesel this way and also the head bolt pattern on a large 4 cylinder block that's too big for our CNC's.
I've got 20+ years experience with CAD/CAM/CNC in the mold building industry. Where are you located in WI? I'm in the Twin Cities suburbs. I might be able to help you if you're interested. I was gonna stay with an auto in my W123 617 but am leaning more towards a 5 speed now so it's something I'm going to tackle sooner or later.
Here's some pics of the Detroit Diesel bellhousing I made:
![[Image: 3108848029_49cd065d66.jpg]](http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3209/3108848029_49cd065d66.jpg)
![[Image: 2465833961_bedc40178b.jpg]](http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3185/2465833961_bedc40178b.jpg)
![[Image: 3108840995_1915bfd1d4.jpg]](http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3160/3108840995_1915bfd1d4.jpg)
This post was last modified: 05-26-2011, 06:34 PM by Blackstack.
Blackstack
05-26-2011, 06:32 PM #18(05-09-2011, 09:38 AM)HoleshotHolset I hear ya - the benefits of the GM auto are too numerous to count.
The really good news is that the design for an intermediate plate made for a GM auto could be altered a bit so that you could use a GM manual tranny - like a T56...or maybe a Tremec TKO 600 with a GM V8 pattern.
The 4L80E isn't all that big compared to other automatics, but it's definitely bigger than the 722.6. One concern (among many...) I have is whether the Chevy V8 bellhousing will fit in my W210. Gotta do some measuring...but it's hard to do with the OM606.962/722.608 already installed in the chassis.
Attached is a screenshot of the OM606 bellhousing pattern I sketched in SolidWorks. I'm a complete newbie using this...so take it easy on me.
Quote:I'm a complete newbie using this...so take it easy on me.
NO!!! Trial by fire is always best!!!
I hate to break it to ya but you could have probably sketched that up without having to sweep anything in on the CNC. That's the beauty of sketching in Solidworks or any other parametric modeling software with strong sketching ability. You could have doweled or put a bolt in every threaded hole and taken multiple measurements across them from one to the other(s) with a caliper or depth mic off the flat surfaces (pan gasket surface). But, to make you feel better, doing what you did was more accurate and easier. All I'm saying is you could have done it with an engine in the car and not had to use the cut up engine. It's especially easier when you start sketching it up and can conclude many of the bolt holes are on a bolt pattern or a nominal distance from the crank centerline for example. In that case sweeping them all in isn't necessarily more accurate. I did a billet bellhousing for a 2-71 Detroit Diesel this way and also the head bolt pattern on a large 4 cylinder block that's too big for our CNC's.
I've got 20+ years experience with CAD/CAM/CNC in the mold building industry. Where are you located in WI? I'm in the Twin Cities suburbs. I might be able to help you if you're interested. I was gonna stay with an auto in my W123 617 but am leaning more towards a 5 speed now so it's something I'm going to tackle sooner or later.
Here's some pics of the Detroit Diesel bellhousing I made:
05-27-2011, 01:11 PM
#19
1981 Mercedes 300TD Lowered 4 speed manual Holset HX30
mike-81-240d
05-27-2011, 01:11 PM #19Hmm my dads '02 seirra denali has a 4L80e. Shifts like sex, even with 365hp and 398 tq stock outta the box.
1981 Mercedes 300TD Lowered 4 speed manual Holset HX30
06-19-2011, 08:41 PM
#20
(05-26-2011, 06:32 PM)Blackstack Where are you located in WI? I'm in the Twin Cities suburbs. I might be able to help you if you're interested.
Wow - I need to login more often!
I'm about 4hrs away from the Twin Cities - near Portage, WI.
I'd happily accept any help you're willing to provide. I *had* unrestricted access to a CNC bed mill so doing a sweep of the bellhousing pattern (using taps in the threaded holes and a dial indicator, edge finder, etc.) with that mill and the cracked block that I milled flat seemed to do the trick pretty well.
Have you seen this? These folks up in Ham Lake, MN have some neat adapters including one to adapt an OM617 to a Chevy V8 pattern: http://www.transmissionadapters.com/Merc...diesel.htm
What did you put a 2-71 in? I've seen those used on the old Delco 1200RPM, railroad gensets. Those things were designed for the long haul...
I'll shoot you a PM with my contact info. I'm limited with experience with this sort of work, but I'd really like to see a 606 to Chevy V8 pattern adapter come to fruition...and there are a few roadblocks in my way!
Beers,
Matt
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
06-19-2011, 08:41 PM #20(05-26-2011, 06:32 PM)Blackstack Where are you located in WI? I'm in the Twin Cities suburbs. I might be able to help you if you're interested.
Wow - I need to login more often!
I'm about 4hrs away from the Twin Cities - near Portage, WI.
I'd happily accept any help you're willing to provide. I *had* unrestricted access to a CNC bed mill so doing a sweep of the bellhousing pattern (using taps in the threaded holes and a dial indicator, edge finder, etc.) with that mill and the cracked block that I milled flat seemed to do the trick pretty well.
Have you seen this? These folks up in Ham Lake, MN have some neat adapters including one to adapt an OM617 to a Chevy V8 pattern: http://www.transmissionadapters.com/Merc...diesel.htm
What did you put a 2-71 in? I've seen those used on the old Delco 1200RPM, railroad gensets. Those things were designed for the long haul...
I'll shoot you a PM with my contact info. I'm limited with experience with this sort of work, but I'd really like to see a 606 to Chevy V8 pattern adapter come to fruition...and there are a few roadblocks in my way!
Beers,
Matt
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
603fj80
Unregistered
07-19-2011, 05:03 PM
#21
(06-19-2011, 08:41 PM)HoleshotHolset(05-26-2011, 06:32 PM)Blackstack Where are you located in WI? I'm in the Twin Cities suburbs. I might be able to help you if you're interested.
Wow - I need to login more often!
I'm about 4hrs away from the Twin Cities - near Portage, WI.
I'd happily accept any help you're willing to provide. I *had* unrestricted access to a CNC bed mill so doing a sweep of the bellhousing pattern (using taps in the threaded holes and a dial indicator, edge finder, etc.) with that mill and the cracked block that I milled flat seemed to do the trick pretty well.
Have you seen this? These folks up in Ham Lake, MN have some neat adapters including one to adapt an OM617 to a Chevy V8 pattern: http://www.transmissionadapters.com/Merc...diesel.htm
What did you put a 2-71 in? I've seen those used on the old Delco 1200RPM, railroad gensets. Those things were designed for the long haul...
I'll shoot you a PM with my contact info. I'm limited with experience with this sort of work, but I'd really like to see a 606 to Chevy V8 pattern adapter come to fruition...and there are a few roadblocks in my way!
Beers,
Matt
603fj80
07-19-2011, 05:03 PM #21any update on this project by chance, I would really love to get your measurments for the 603 belhousing
(06-19-2011, 08:41 PM)HoleshotHolset(05-26-2011, 06:32 PM)Blackstack Where are you located in WI? I'm in the Twin Cities suburbs. I might be able to help you if you're interested.
Wow - I need to login more often!
I'm about 4hrs away from the Twin Cities - near Portage, WI.
I'd happily accept any help you're willing to provide. I *had* unrestricted access to a CNC bed mill so doing a sweep of the bellhousing pattern (using taps in the threaded holes and a dial indicator, edge finder, etc.) with that mill and the cracked block that I milled flat seemed to do the trick pretty well.
Have you seen this? These folks up in Ham Lake, MN have some neat adapters including one to adapt an OM617 to a Chevy V8 pattern: http://www.transmissionadapters.com/Merc...diesel.htm
What did you put a 2-71 in? I've seen those used on the old Delco 1200RPM, railroad gensets. Those things were designed for the long haul...
I'll shoot you a PM with my contact info. I'm limited with experience with this sort of work, but I'd really like to see a 606 to Chevy V8 pattern adapter come to fruition...and there are a few roadblocks in my way!
Beers,
Matt
07-24-2011, 02:31 PM
#22
(07-19-2011, 05:03 PM)603fj80 any update on this project by chance, I would really love to get your measurments for the 603 belhousing
As I mentioned in my PM to you, there are no substantial updates at all.
Still looking for a shop or individual to help me make an adapter plate.
Beers,
Matt
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
HoleshotHolset
07-24-2011, 02:31 PM #22(07-19-2011, 05:03 PM)603fj80 any update on this project by chance, I would really love to get your measurments for the 603 belhousing
As I mentioned in my PM to you, there are no substantial updates at all.
Still looking for a shop or individual to help me make an adapter plate.
Beers,
Matt
'07 W211 OM642
'95 W124.131/722.435, 211k - daily driver/Superturbo project - OM606.962 with "M" pump...under construction! (build thread here)
'99 W210.025 - gone, but not forgotten
'94 Dodge/Cummins - gone, but not forgotten
09-22-2011, 10:47 AM
#24
Mb 1984 w201 om603 swap.
Mb 1986 w201 190E 2.3-16v
Mb 2004 w203 C230k
George3soccer
09-22-2011, 10:47 AM #24Same, here I am willing to help you guys. Currently finishing up my last year as a ME. Send me some details, and measurements, and I can have a few things made up using Pro-E, SW, and anything from Ansys, acronis, and a shit load of other programs.
Mb 1984 w201 om603 swap.
Mb 1986 w201 190E 2.3-16v
Mb 2004 w203 C230k
10-01-2011, 07:47 AM
#25
(09-22-2011, 10:47 AM)George3soccer Same, here I am willing to help you guys. Currently finishing up my last year as a ME. Send me some details, and measurements, and I can have a few things made up using Pro-E, SW, and anything from Ansys, acronis, and a shit load of other programs.
I graduated NJIT as an ME about 3 years. Where are you going? Also do you have access to a mill or lathe?
(09-22-2011, 10:47 AM)George3soccer Same, here I am willing to help you guys. Currently finishing up my last year as a ME. Send me some details, and measurements, and I can have a few things made up using Pro-E, SW, and anything from Ansys, acronis, and a shit load of other programs.
10-01-2011, 01:38 PM
#26
I wish I did have access to a mill or lathe, but I do know the machine shop down the street very well, charge me at a decent price. Very helpful, and love working with me.
Mb 1984 w201 om603 swap.
Mb 1986 w201 190E 2.3-16v
Mb 2004 w203 C230k
George3soccer
10-01-2011, 01:38 PM #26It's funny that you graduated from NJIT, I am in my last year in NJIT.
I wish I did have access to a mill or lathe, but I do know the machine shop down the street very well, charge me at a decent price. Very helpful, and love working with me.
Mb 1984 w201 om603 swap.
Mb 1986 w201 190E 2.3-16v
Mb 2004 w203 C230k
11-15-2011, 07:22 PM
#27
I have been lurking on here and trying to learn as much as I can about Mercedes Engines to try and figure out what combination would be the best for my application and requirements.
I am interested in doing a conversion for Off Road use, and have narrowed down my vehicle list to an 80 series Toyota Land Cruiser (1990-1907) or a jeep TJ (1989 was first year. In California, a diesel swap must use the engine from the same year or NEWER vehicle, which eliminates the bulletproof OM617 as an option. So I started looking at the OM606 as an option. I have heard unconfirmed accounts that the engine had to be for sale in California..... meaning the turbo OM 606.962 could possibly be an issue if you had a finicky referee who happened to know Mercedes really well. (the '98/'99 E300 was not sold in California)
For Offroad/Expedition use, there are some issues with this engine and the 722.6 that initially put me off, but after digging around here, I think I have figured out viable options......
Electronic controls are not your friend when you are crossing rivers deep enough that you need a snorkel. I have learned this first hand on overseas expeditions in late model vehicles. On the home front, I was also recently crippled in my E320 because I spilled my drink on the shifter..... which instantly removed the 722.6 option from any expedition build
.Back to the OM606A Turbo....... If what I learned on here was correct, I can run a mechanical IP from an early 603 on this engine and eliminate all electronics........ and if I can get this adapted to a Chevy V8 engine bolt pattern, I could run a plethora of non electronic transmissions, and more importantly, bolt on a selection of transfer cases. I don't know if there is a Mercedes transfer case that will mate to the 722.6. If anyone knows this answer, I would love to hear it.
Over the more traditional OM617 offroad build, I should gain fuel economy from the 24v design, I would also gain horsepower, especially with a built IP (my expedition ready FJZ80 weighs in at 7,000lbs) and just as importantly, better highway speed because if I understand correctly, the 606 is a higher revving engine compared to the 617.
Gear options for Offroad drivetrains using low revving diesels is an issue for some vehicle conversions (vehicles originally geared only for gasoline engines) . Anything lower than a 4.11 for example in a 80 series land cruiser is not common in the USA. A 3.71 is available but hard to find, and taller is almost impossible due to the limited front axle ratios (there was an overseas 3.51 available, but not here because we didn't get the diesel) . An overdrive transmission can help solve these problems in some situations, but the stock FJZ80 already has a .75 overdrive. With a 4.11, and even with 33" tires, rpm is too high for a 617 to run at 70+mph for long stretches of open highway. 35" tires are fine for an 80 series Toyota or Jeep TJ with a 4" lift, but finding spares can be difficult, and not everyone wants a lift that high and tires that big.
If my understandings are correct, the only downside I can see to this swap would be difficulty/cost of finding a longblock 606 turbo...... and a suitable adapter kit! Someone please chime in if my logic seems off.
To get back on track. maybe if a group buy of say ten kits could persuade someone like Bendtsen's Transmission Adapters to Engineer and make the kit? I for sure would be down for one.
BTW, this is my first post, so I guess I should introduce myself
Allen
Here is a pic of me with my Expedition equipped Land Cruiser that I own and keep in Australia..... equipped with the engine I wish my California one had. the 4.2L 1HD. I have covered more than 50,000 kilometers of off road (no pavement) Outback in this rig.
![[Image: n1009217634_30242459_3003.jpg]](http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v1749/105/8/1009217634/n1009217634_30242459_3003.jpg)
This post was last modified: 11-15-2011, 08:25 PM by Lance Carbuncle.
Lance Carbuncle
11-15-2011, 07:22 PM #27Hello Everyone,
I have been lurking on here and trying to learn as much as I can about Mercedes Engines to try and figure out what combination would be the best for my application and requirements.
I am interested in doing a conversion for Off Road use, and have narrowed down my vehicle list to an 80 series Toyota Land Cruiser (1990-1907) or a jeep TJ (1989 was first year. In California, a diesel swap must use the engine from the same year or NEWER vehicle, which eliminates the bulletproof OM617 as an option. So I started looking at the OM606 as an option. I have heard unconfirmed accounts that the engine had to be for sale in California..... meaning the turbo OM 606.962 could possibly be an issue if you had a finicky referee who happened to know Mercedes really well. (the '98/'99 E300 was not sold in California)
For Offroad/Expedition use, there are some issues with this engine and the 722.6 that initially put me off, but after digging around here, I think I have figured out viable options......
Electronic controls are not your friend when you are crossing rivers deep enough that you need a snorkel. I have learned this first hand on overseas expeditions in late model vehicles. On the home front, I was also recently crippled in my E320 because I spilled my drink on the shifter..... which instantly removed the 722.6 option from any expedition build .
Back to the OM606A Turbo....... If what I learned on here was correct, I can run a mechanical IP from an early 603 on this engine and eliminate all electronics........ and if I can get this adapted to a Chevy V8 engine bolt pattern, I could run a plethora of non electronic transmissions, and more importantly, bolt on a selection of transfer cases. I don't know if there is a Mercedes transfer case that will mate to the 722.6. If anyone knows this answer, I would love to hear it.
Over the more traditional OM617 offroad build, I should gain fuel economy from the 24v design, I would also gain horsepower, especially with a built IP (my expedition ready FJZ80 weighs in at 7,000lbs) and just as importantly, better highway speed because if I understand correctly, the 606 is a higher revving engine compared to the 617.
Gear options for Offroad drivetrains using low revving diesels is an issue for some vehicle conversions (vehicles originally geared only for gasoline engines) . Anything lower than a 4.11 for example in a 80 series land cruiser is not common in the USA. A 3.71 is available but hard to find, and taller is almost impossible due to the limited front axle ratios (there was an overseas 3.51 available, but not here because we didn't get the diesel) . An overdrive transmission can help solve these problems in some situations, but the stock FJZ80 already has a .75 overdrive. With a 4.11, and even with 33" tires, rpm is too high for a 617 to run at 70+mph for long stretches of open highway. 35" tires are fine for an 80 series Toyota or Jeep TJ with a 4" lift, but finding spares can be difficult, and not everyone wants a lift that high and tires that big.
If my understandings are correct, the only downside I can see to this swap would be difficulty/cost of finding a longblock 606 turbo...... and a suitable adapter kit! Someone please chime in if my logic seems off.
To get back on track. maybe if a group buy of say ten kits could persuade someone like Bendtsen's Transmission Adapters to Engineer and make the kit? I for sure would be down for one.
BTW, this is my first post, so I guess I should introduce myself
Allen
Here is a pic of me with my Expedition equipped Land Cruiser that I own and keep in Australia..... equipped with the engine I wish my California one had. the 4.2L 1HD. I have covered more than 50,000 kilometers of off road (no pavement) Outback in this rig.
11-15-2011, 07:55 PM
#28
1998 E300TD 7.5mm pump and hx35 to come!
00 Mustang gt drift car
iheartboost
11-15-2011, 07:55 PM #28WOO! solid works thats my shit.
1998 E300TD 7.5mm pump and hx35 to come!
00 Mustang gt drift car
11-15-2011, 09:54 PM
#29
(11-15-2011, 07:22 PM)Lance Carbuncle Hello Everyone,Nice Rig!
I have been lurking on here and trying to learn as much as I can about Mercedes Engines to try and figure out what combination would be the best for my application and requirements.
I am interested in doing a conversion for Off Road use, and have narrowed down my vehicle list to an 80 series Toyota Land Cruiser (1990-1907) or a jeep TJ (1989 was first year. In California, a diesel swap must use the engine from the same year or NEWER vehicle, which eliminates the bulletproof OM617 as an option. So I started looking at the OM606 as an option. I have heard unconfirmed accounts that the engine had to be for sale in California..... meaning the turbo OM 606.962 could possibly be an issue if you had a finicky referee who happened to know Mercedes really well. (the '98/'99 E300 was not sold in California)
For Offroad/Expedition use, there are some issues with this engine and the 722.6 that initially put me off, but after digging around here, I think I have figured out viable options......
Electronic controls are not your friend when you are crossing rivers deep enough that you need a snorkel. I have learned this first hand on overseas expeditions in late model vehicles. On the home front, I was also recently crippled in my E320 because I spilled my drink on the shifter..... which instantly removed the 722.6 option from any expedition build
Back to the OM606A Turbo....... If what I learned on here was correct, I can run a mechanical IP from an early 603 on this engine and eliminate all electronics........ and if I can get this adapted to a Chevy V8 engine bolt pattern, I could run a plethora of non electronic transmissions, and more importantly, bolt on a selection of transfer cases. I don't know if there is a Mercedes transfer case that will mate to the 722.6. If anyone knows this answer, I would love to hear it.
Over the more traditional OM617 offroad build, I should gain fuel economy from the 24v design, I would also gain horsepower, especially with a built IP (my expedition ready FJZ80 weighs in at 7,000lbs) and just as importantly, better highway speed because if I understand correctly, the 606 is a higher revving engine compared to the 617.
Gear options for Offroad drivetrains using low revving diesels is an issue for some vehicle conversions (vehicles originally geared only for gasoline engines) . Anything lower than a 4.11 for example in a 80 series land cruiser is not common in the USA. A 3.71 is available but hard to find, and taller is almost impossible due to the limited front axle ratios (there was an overseas 3.51 available, but not here because we didn't get the diesel) . An overdrive transmission can help solve these problems in some situations, but the stock FJZ80 already has a .75 overdrive. With a 4.11, and even with 33" tires, rpm is too high for a 617 to run at 70+mph for long stretches of open highway. 35" tires are fine for an 80 series Toyota or Jeep TJ with a 4" lift, but finding spares can be difficult, and not everyone wants a lift that high and tires that big.
If my understandings are correct, the only downside I can see to this swap would be difficulty/cost of finding a longblock 606 turbo...... and a suitable adapter kit! Someone please chime in if my logic seems off.
To get back on track. maybe if a group buy of say ten kits could persuade someone like Bendtsen's Transmission Adapters to Engineer and make the kit? I for sure would be down for one.
BTW, this is my first post, so I guess I should introduce myself
Allen
Here is a pic of me with my Expedition equipped Land Cruiser that I own and keep in Australia..... equipped with the engine I wish my California one had. the 4.2L 1HD. I have covered more than 50,000 kilometers of off road (no pavement) Outback in this rig.
As far as a 617 with 4.11's, 33's and .75 overdrive you would have no problems running 70MPH all day long that is only 2200rpm, even 1:1 in the tranny is 2900rpm still no problem. Redline is around 5000rpm, keep in mind that the N/A 617 in a Gwagen like mine is stock with 28" tires 4.88 gears and no overdrive = nearly 4100RPM @ 70MPH. Keep in mind that the 617 likes to rev and doesn't have tons of low end torque.
(11-15-2011, 07:22 PM)Lance Carbuncle Hello Everyone,Nice Rig!
I have been lurking on here and trying to learn as much as I can about Mercedes Engines to try and figure out what combination would be the best for my application and requirements.
I am interested in doing a conversion for Off Road use, and have narrowed down my vehicle list to an 80 series Toyota Land Cruiser (1990-1907) or a jeep TJ (1989 was first year. In California, a diesel swap must use the engine from the same year or NEWER vehicle, which eliminates the bulletproof OM617 as an option. So I started looking at the OM606 as an option. I have heard unconfirmed accounts that the engine had to be for sale in California..... meaning the turbo OM 606.962 could possibly be an issue if you had a finicky referee who happened to know Mercedes really well. (the '98/'99 E300 was not sold in California)
For Offroad/Expedition use, there are some issues with this engine and the 722.6 that initially put me off, but after digging around here, I think I have figured out viable options......
Electronic controls are not your friend when you are crossing rivers deep enough that you need a snorkel. I have learned this first hand on overseas expeditions in late model vehicles. On the home front, I was also recently crippled in my E320 because I spilled my drink on the shifter..... which instantly removed the 722.6 option from any expedition build
Back to the OM606A Turbo....... If what I learned on here was correct, I can run a mechanical IP from an early 603 on this engine and eliminate all electronics........ and if I can get this adapted to a Chevy V8 engine bolt pattern, I could run a plethora of non electronic transmissions, and more importantly, bolt on a selection of transfer cases. I don't know if there is a Mercedes transfer case that will mate to the 722.6. If anyone knows this answer, I would love to hear it.
Over the more traditional OM617 offroad build, I should gain fuel economy from the 24v design, I would also gain horsepower, especially with a built IP (my expedition ready FJZ80 weighs in at 7,000lbs) and just as importantly, better highway speed because if I understand correctly, the 606 is a higher revving engine compared to the 617.
Gear options for Offroad drivetrains using low revving diesels is an issue for some vehicle conversions (vehicles originally geared only for gasoline engines) . Anything lower than a 4.11 for example in a 80 series land cruiser is not common in the USA. A 3.71 is available but hard to find, and taller is almost impossible due to the limited front axle ratios (there was an overseas 3.51 available, but not here because we didn't get the diesel) . An overdrive transmission can help solve these problems in some situations, but the stock FJZ80 already has a .75 overdrive. With a 4.11, and even with 33" tires, rpm is too high for a 617 to run at 70+mph for long stretches of open highway. 35" tires are fine for an 80 series Toyota or Jeep TJ with a 4" lift, but finding spares can be difficult, and not everyone wants a lift that high and tires that big.
If my understandings are correct, the only downside I can see to this swap would be difficulty/cost of finding a longblock 606 turbo...... and a suitable adapter kit! Someone please chime in if my logic seems off.
To get back on track. maybe if a group buy of say ten kits could persuade someone like Bendtsen's Transmission Adapters to Engineer and make the kit? I for sure would be down for one.
BTW, this is my first post, so I guess I should introduce myself
Allen
Here is a pic of me with my Expedition equipped Land Cruiser that I own and keep in Australia..... equipped with the engine I wish my California one had. the 4.2L 1HD. I have covered more than 50,000 kilometers of off road (no pavement) Outback in this rig.
As far as a 617 with 4.11's, 33's and .75 overdrive you would have no problems running 70MPH all day long that is only 2200rpm, even 1:1 in the tranny is 2900rpm still no problem. Redline is around 5000rpm, keep in mind that the N/A 617 in a Gwagen like mine is stock with 28" tires 4.88 gears and no overdrive = nearly 4100RPM @ 70MPH. Keep in mind that the 617 likes to rev and doesn't have tons of low end torque.
11-15-2011, 10:03 PM
#30
whipplem104
11-15-2011, 10:03 PM #30There are several options for a t case on the 722.6 though. The gwagens had a small driveshaft to a t case. All the regular 4 matics have t cases bolted right to the back. An ML or suv setup is fairly strong and bolts up. Drive shaft on the left side for front drive. The regular cars t drive shaft is on the right side.
11-15-2011, 10:09 PM
#31
(11-15-2011, 09:54 PM)kmaser Nice Rig!
As far as a 617 with 4.11's, 33's and .75 overdrive you would have no problems running 70MPH all day long that is only 2200rpm, even 1:1 in the tranny is 2900rpm still no problem. Redline is around 5000rpm, keep in mind that the N/A 617 in a Gwagen like mine is stock with 28" tires 4.88 gears and no overdrive = nearly 4100RPM @ 70MPH. Keep in mind that the 617 likes to rev and doesn't have tons of low end torque.
Thanks for the great info. If you have a 617 powered Gwagen, then you definitely know what you are talking about. I never did the math on the ratios and only made an assumption based on reading some other online posts from users who were talking about their conversions. Come to think of it, they might have been talking about Cummins 4BT conversions which don't like to rev compared to a mercedes. I thought the 617 was a low revving diesel like this because I heard it mentioned to have "tractor" origins..... Thanks for the clarification!
Lance Carbuncle
11-15-2011, 10:09 PM #31(11-15-2011, 09:54 PM)kmaser Nice Rig!
As far as a 617 with 4.11's, 33's and .75 overdrive you would have no problems running 70MPH all day long that is only 2200rpm, even 1:1 in the tranny is 2900rpm still no problem. Redline is around 5000rpm, keep in mind that the N/A 617 in a Gwagen like mine is stock with 28" tires 4.88 gears and no overdrive = nearly 4100RPM @ 70MPH. Keep in mind that the 617 likes to rev and doesn't have tons of low end torque.
Thanks for the great info. If you have a 617 powered Gwagen, then you definitely know what you are talking about. I never did the math on the ratios and only made an assumption based on reading some other online posts from users who were talking about their conversions. Come to think of it, they might have been talking about Cummins 4BT conversions which don't like to rev compared to a mercedes. I thought the 617 was a low revving diesel like this because I heard it mentioned to have "tractor" origins..... Thanks for the clarification!
11-20-2011, 09:56 PM
#32
This post was last modified: 11-20-2011, 09:57 PM by Lance Carbuncle.
Lance Carbuncle
11-20-2011, 09:56 PM #32Well, after much more research, considering the swap costs, and the value of my time, I think I just decided that ditching the swap idea and just getting a G-wagen might be the way to go...... and after a couple of rainy days on the computer, I think I found a really nice original California registered, rust free, 300GD SWB that has been converted from N/A to a 617a turbo already. and going to pick it up next week!...... So my focus now will be tuning the motor.... or building a new one, for some more power..... I will post more pics once I close the deal.
08-22-2013, 06:51 PM
#33
(05-14-2011, 01:03 AM)fte I have a 700r4 behind my OM617t installed in a 86 Cherokee 4x4, made the adapter myself and has been my DD for a year now. I'm very happy, the shift points work very well with this motor and lockup is a very nice plus.
How did you set your shift points on a 700r4?
mikes02ls1
08-22-2013, 06:51 PM #33(05-14-2011, 01:03 AM)fte I have a 700r4 behind my OM617t installed in a 86 Cherokee 4x4, made the adapter myself and has been my DD for a year now. I'm very happy, the shift points work very well with this motor and lockup is a very nice plus.
How did you set your shift points on a 700r4?
08-22-2013, 07:20 PM
#34
Newbie-read this: Cheap Tricks
617.952-220k-Getting built up
larsalan I guess I need to look at this stupid ass drip shit. What you have to like mess with those elements on the pump? What a fucking hassle. then use some wire to hold the throttle open or some shit?
Simpler=Better
08-22-2013, 07:20 PM #34Anyone going to post up the 606 pattern? I posted my 617 pattern (and will be posting my chebby pattern once it's confirmed)
Newbie-read this: Cheap Tricks
617.952-220k-Getting built up
larsalan I guess I need to look at this stupid ass drip shit. What you have to like mess with those elements on the pump? What a fucking hassle. then use some wire to hold the throttle open or some shit?
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