Re: EGT sensor install
Re: EGT sensor install
1) Disconnect negative battery cable. Actually do this I did not, and it caused some excitement later on.
2) Remove air filter and any other stuff that will be in the way
3) Remove turbo oil line EGR, and exhaust downpipe
4) Remove the 6 bolts that hold the manifolds on (one is hidden behind where the EGR was) and the turbo support bracket (you will see it under the turbine housing)
5) Pull the turbo and manifold back off of head
6) Remove turbo snaking it past the oil supply line (it would be much easier if the supply line was removed, but you need to drain the oil for that)
Before you begin make sure you have your thermocouple, a new turbo gasket set, and EGR block off plate (if desired).
1) Disconnect negative battery cable. Actually do this
I did not, and it caused some excitement later on.
2) Remove air filter and any other stuff that will be in the way
3) Remove turbo oil line EGR, and exhaust downpipe
4) Remove the 6 bolts that hold the manifolds on (one is hidden behind where the EGR was) and the turbo support bracket (you will see it under the turbine housing)
5) Pull the turbo and manifold back off of head
6) Remove turbo snaking it past the oil supply line (it would be much easier if the supply line was removed, but you need to drain the oil for that)
8) Remove bolts that hold turbo to exhaust manifold
9) Realize that bolts are stuck, spray with penetrating oil and have a beer
10) Use heat and penetrating oil to remove stuck bolts. Be sure to use a high quality open end wrench to avoid rounding off the nuts. [attachment=3]<!-- ia3 -->10.JPG<!-- ia3 -->[/attachment]
11) Remove Turbo from Manifold [attachment=2]<!-- ia2 -->11.JPG<!-- ia2 -->[/attachment]
12) Drill hole for thermocouple. My thermocouple required a ¼ inch NPT thread, which required a 7/16 inch hole. I had my friend who runs a machine shop drill the hole for me. [attachment=1]<!-- ia1 -->12.JPG<!-- ia1 -->[/attachment]
13) Use the proper tap to thread the hole. The tap requires a lot of down force in addition to twist to get started. Be sure to keep the tap well oiled while cutting the threads. [attachment=0]<!-- ia0 -->13.JPG<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment]
14) Every few turns of the tap remove it and check to see if the pyrometer fitting will start threading into the hole. The threads are tapered to create a seal and because we are dealing with a fairly thin hole you do not want to go too far and cause the hole to be too large. This is also a good time to clean off the tap.
15) When you can thread the thermocouple fitting in a turn or two by hand you are set. Clean the metal filings out of the manifold and use some emery cloth to take the burrs off of the hole.
7) Bring manifold inside and set on some cardboard so your wife wont kill you. [attachment=4]<!-- ia4 -->7.JPG<!-- ia4 -->[/attachment]
8) Remove bolts that hold turbo to exhaust manifold
9) Realize that bolts are stuck, spray with penetrating oil and have a beer
10) Use heat and penetrating oil to remove stuck bolts. Be sure to use a high quality open end wrench to avoid rounding off the nuts. [attachment=3]<!-- ia3 -->10.JPG<!-- ia3 -->[/attachment]
11) Remove Turbo from Manifold [attachment=2]<!-- ia2 -->11.JPG<!-- ia2 -->[/attachment]
12) Drill hole for thermocouple. My thermocouple required a ¼ inch NPT thread, which required a 7/16 inch hole. I had my friend who runs a machine shop drill the hole for me. [attachment=1]<!-- ia1 -->12.JPG<!-- ia1 -->[/attachment]
13) Use the proper tap to thread the hole. The tap requires a lot of down force in addition to twist to get started. Be sure to keep the tap well oiled while cutting the threads. [attachment=0]<!-- ia0 -->13.JPG<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment]
14) Every few turns of the tap remove it and check to see if the pyrometer fitting will start threading into the hole. The threads are tapered to create a seal and because we are dealing with a fairly thin hole you do not want to go too far and cause the hole to be too large. This is also a good time to clean off the tap.
15) When you can thread the thermocouple fitting in a turn or two by hand you are set. Clean the metal filings out of the manifold and use some emery cloth to take the burrs off of the hole.
17) When the fitting is tight it should barely protrude into the manifold. Wipe off any extra anti-seize. [attachment=3]<!-- ia3 -->17.JPG<!-- ia3 -->[/attachment]
18) Install the EGR block off kit as per included instructions and re-install the turbo using new gaskets and anti-seize on the bolts. [attachment=2]<!-- ia2 -->18.JPG<!-- ia2 -->[/attachment]
19) Clean gasket mating surfaces on manifolds using a wire brush, emery paper (if necessary) and a paper towel. [attachment=1]<!-- ia1 -->19.JPG<!-- ia1 -->[/attachment]
20) Clean gasket mating surface on head and install gasket [attachment=0]<!-- ia0 -->20.JPG<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment]
16) Install the pyrometer fitting using high temp anti-seize. [attachment=4]<!-- ia4 -->16.JPG<!-- ia4 -->[/attachment]
17) When the fitting is tight it should barely protrude into the manifold. Wipe off any extra anti-seize. [attachment=3]<!-- ia3 -->17.JPG<!-- ia3 -->[/attachment]
18) Install the EGR block off kit as per included instructions and re-install the turbo using new gaskets and anti-seize on the bolts. [attachment=2]<!-- ia2 -->18.JPG<!-- ia2 -->[/attachment]
19) Clean gasket mating surfaces on manifolds using a wire brush, emery paper (if necessary) and a paper towel. [attachment=1]<!-- ia1 -->19.JPG<!-- ia1 -->[/attachment]
20) Clean gasket mating surface on head and install gasket [attachment=0]<!-- ia0 -->20.JPG<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment]
22) Install manifolds. It may help to loosen the turbo support brace to get the manifold into place.
23) Tighten all bolts and nuts, reinstall oil lines and downpipe.
24) Realize that you forgot to double check that the oil return line was aligned. MAKE SURE YOU CHECK THE OIL RETURN LINE BEFORE YOU INSTALL THE TURBO AND MANIFOLD!!![attachment=2]<!-- ia2 -->24.JPG<!-- ia2 -->[/attachment]
25) Try to remove oil return line to fix mistake
26) Realize that the EGR runner prevents the return line from being installed with the turbo in place.
27) Curse long retired Mercedes engineer and the federal government for requiring stupid EGR equipment.
28) Remove manifold again to fix oil return line.
29) Reinstall manifold again.
30) Install air cleaner check all connections, start car and check for exhaust and oil leaks. [attachment=1]<!-- ia1 -->30.JPG<!-- ia1 -->[/attachment]
31) Go for a test drive and enjoy your new gauge. [attachment=0]<!-- ia0 -->31.JPG<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment]
21) Put turbo and manifolds back in engine bay and connect thermocouple to fitting.
22) Install manifolds. It may help to loosen the turbo support brace to get the manifold into place.
23) Tighten all bolts and nuts, reinstall oil lines and downpipe.
24) Realize that you forgot to double check that the oil return line was aligned. MAKE SURE YOU CHECK THE OIL RETURN LINE BEFORE YOU INSTALL THE TURBO AND MANIFOLD!!![attachment=2]<!-- ia2 -->24.JPG<!-- ia2 -->[/attachment]
25) Try to remove oil return line to fix mistake
26) Realize that the EGR runner prevents the return line from being installed with the turbo in place.
27) Curse long retired Mercedes engineer and the federal government for requiring stupid EGR equipment.
28) Remove manifold again to fix oil return line.
29) Reinstall manifold again.
30) Install air cleaner check all connections, start car and check for exhaust and oil leaks. [attachment=1]<!-- ia1 -->30.JPG<!-- ia1 -->[/attachment]
31) Go for a test drive and enjoy your new gauge. [attachment=0]<!-- ia0 -->31.JPG<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment]
Pre-turbo is the only accurate location to install a probe. Post-turbo installation has too many variables caused by the turbo's turbine. The turbo absorbs and slowly releases heat which causes measurement/display lag and a temperature drop across the turbine.
The probe should look something like this from the inside of the manifold. The soot does not affect accuracy.
[attachment=1]<!-- ia1 -->LMN GT2256V 2 EGT probeS.jpg<!-- ia1 -->[/attachment]
ForcedInduction
02-28-2008, 05:50 AM
#5
The EGR tube cannot be used as a probe location. It is an 8" long tube cast into the manifold separate from the main exhaust flow path.
Pre-turbo is the only accurate location to install a probe. Post-turbo installation has too many variables caused by the turbo's turbine. The turbo absorbs and slowly releases heat which causes measurement/display lag and a temperature drop across the turbine.
The probe should look something like this from the inside of the manifold. The soot does not affect accuracy.
[attachment=1]<!-- ia1 -->LMN GT2256V 2 EGT probeS.jpg<!-- ia1 -->[/attachment]
beautiful job with your pyrometer/intercooler and terrific pics. My question is: I assume you wouldn't need to take off the manifold to put in a pyrometer. I'm acquainted with the arguments about filings in the turbocharger etc but using the usual methods like a vacuum, heavy grease,vacuum etc. I've put them in many diesels auto, truck and marine. Is there something peculiar to MB that would make you nervous? Are you going to comment on performance after your install? Regards
hugho
03-14-2008, 11:57 AM #6BGCAST,
beautiful job with your pyrometer/intercooler and terrific pics. My question is: I assume you wouldn't need to take off the manifold to put in a pyrometer. I'm acquainted with the arguments about filings in the turbocharger etc but using the usual methods like a vacuum, heavy grease,vacuum etc. I've put them in many diesels auto, truck and marine. Is there something peculiar to MB that would make you nervous? Are you going to comment on performance after your install? Regards
I really have not got any performance gains from just the intercooler and the pyrometer because I have not adjusted the fuel that the injection pump delivers yet, however without these modifications it would not be safe to modify the amount of fuel the engine receives.
In these cars I think the only way to install a pyrometer probe is with the manifold off of the car. You could install the pyrometer post turbo in the down pipe, but the temp readings would not accurate.
I really have not got any performance gains from just the intercooler and the pyrometer because I have not adjusted the fuel that the injection pump delivers yet, however without these modifications it would not be safe to modify the amount of fuel the engine receives.
2005 CDI heavily modified 1984 300TD - Myna pump/TMIC/enlarged PC's/HX30Super/W126 II front brakes/Vogtland springs/EGT +Boost gauges/H4 Hella's
I think he's saying the same thing could be done without dropping the manifold- as the filings would be very few with a vacuum sucking most of them out, and they would not do damage as they would be there for about a second. I have to soon install my H2O system and may use the vacuum system to to do so. Like anyone I have about a million other things to do.
2005 CDI heavily modified 1984 300TD - Myna pump/TMIC/enlarged PC's/HX30Super/W126 II front brakes/Vogtland springs/EGT +Boost gauges/H4 Hella's
I have seen some installers that do it with the engine running at a high idle. The idea is to build some exhaust pressure before the turbo so the shavings get blown out instead of dropping in. The same could work in the intake.
Personally, I prefer to pull the manifolds. Avoiding the risk of any shavings getting into the combustion chamber or jamming between the turbine and housing is worth the hour R&R time.
It can also be installed into the turbine mouth instead of the manifold.
ForcedInduction
03-15-2008, 07:29 AM
#9
The probe is most commonly installed on the underside of the manifold. It is easier to remove the turbo and manifold than try to drill/tap it in place, if that is possible in the first place due to the cramped space.
I have seen some installers that do it with the engine running at a high idle. The idea is to build some exhaust pressure before the turbo so the shavings get blown out instead of dropping in. The same could work in the intake.
Personally, I prefer to pull the manifolds. Avoiding the risk of any shavings getting into the combustion chamber or jamming between the turbine and housing is worth the hour R&R time.
It can also be installed into the turbine mouth instead of the manifold.
The only flat place on the stock manifold to install the probe is the bottom of the manifold just before the turbo flange. There is no way you could access this part of the manifold with it still mounted to the engine. It only takes an hour or so to pull manifolds, and you get the side benefit of being able to clean all the EGR junk out.
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=VDO%2D310953&N=700+400267+4294822101+4294905483+4294765781+115&autoview=sku">http://store.summitracing.com/partdetai ... toview=sku</a><!-- m -->
is this the same thermocouple you have?
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=VDO%2D310953&N=700+400267+4294822101+4294905483+4294765781+115&autoview=sku">http://store.summitracing.com/partdetai ... toview=sku</a><!-- m -->
ForcedInduction
05-24-2008, 06:44 PM
#13
EGauges is where I got mine as well but mine is color coded 1100-1250 yellow and 1250+ red.
VDO just shines a light behind the gauge and reflects it onto the face. ISSPRO lights through the numbers and needle.
ForcedInduction
05-25-2008, 02:45 AM
#15
ISSPRO is much better than VDO. Better quality and MUCH better night lighting.
VDO just shines a light behind the gauge and reflects it onto the face. ISSPRO lights through the numbers and needle.
bgkast The aftermarket VDO gauges have MUCH better lighting than the stock VDO gauges.
I dispute that. The VDO gauge I bought is lighted like crap, just as bad as the cluster gauges. It costs $32 but its designed like one half that price.
http://www.egauges.com/vdo_mult.asp?Type...on&Units=E
ForcedInduction
05-25-2008, 05:21 PM
#17
bgkast The aftermarket VDO gauges have MUCH better lighting than the stock VDO gauges.
I dispute that. The VDO gauge I bought is lighted like crap, just as bad as the cluster gauges. It costs $32 but its designed like one half that price.
http://www.egauges.com/vdo_mult.asp?Type...on&Units=E
Anyone have pictures of the probe placement?
THANKS!!
-Jack Miles : Tampa : Florida :
1963 Unimog 404 TLF-8 - OM617.951 Powered / 8-Speed / Doka Hardcab
Mercedes L1116 L1319
Gassers - '63 'Mog, '65 'Mog / '86 190e 2.3-16 / '87 190e 2.3-16 / '90 190e 2.6/5
Back from the dead!
Anyone have pictures of the probe placement?
THANKS!!
-Jack Miles : Tampa : Florida :
1963 Unimog 404 TLF-8 - OM617.951 Powered / 8-Speed / Doka Hardcab
Mercedes L1116 L1319
Gassers - '63 'Mog, '65 'Mog / '86 190e 2.3-16 / '87 190e 2.3-16 / '90 190e 2.6/5
1987 300D Sturmmachine
1991 300D Nearly Perfect
1985 300D Weekend/Camping/Dog car
1974 L508D Motoroam Monarch "NightMare"
OBK #42
Actually I have a post in with MyBB, the attachments are working just not showing in thread : http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/atta...php?aid=20
1987 300D Sturmmachine
1991 300D Nearly Perfect
1985 300D Weekend/Camping/Dog car
1974 L508D Motoroam Monarch "NightMare"
OBK #42
The other option is this. It works, but the wire must be routed carefully to keep it off hot surfaces.
ForcedInduction
05-17-2010, 05:26 PM
#20
This is the most common location. Its out of the way and where it stays cool.
The other option is this. It works, but the wire must be routed carefully to keep it off hot surfaces.
" straighten up that star on the grill, assholes."
lgreeley83
05-03-2012, 08:41 AM #21What probe length are we using? Getting ready to order one
" straighten up that star on the grill, assholes."
if it don’t blow black...take it back.
1982 300TDT 4 Speed 196K Standard Beige “VEGEWGN”. 300GD FW. Walbro FRC-8 Fuel Pump. ZadaTech LCD Boost, EGT, & Fuel Pressure gauge. Non-EGR Exhaust and Intake Manifold. 3/2 Valves gone. Soon to have Elsbett WVO conversion
1981 300D 314K Midnight Blue “The Blue Car”, Lovecrap system, owned 25 years+
1985 300TD White 198K “Betty White” Pure beauty
The VEGEWGN
I’m in the process of installing mine, and the probe is about 3 inches long. Too long for the application. I really should be two inches I would think. I’ll have to have about 3/4” in the exhaust, and the rest doing nothing outside, and in the way unfortunately. I’m unsure if it is possible to grind it down a little bit, or else I would.
if it don’t blow black...take it back.
1982 300TDT 4 Speed 196K Standard Beige “VEGEWGN”. 300GD FW. Walbro FRC-8 Fuel Pump. ZadaTech LCD Boost, EGT, & Fuel Pressure gauge. Non-EGR Exhaust and Intake Manifold. 3/2 Valves gone. Soon to have Elsbett WVO conversion
1981 300D 314K Midnight Blue “The Blue Car”, Lovecrap system, owned 25 years+
1985 300TD White 198K “Betty White” Pure beauty
The VEGEWGN
So...parts list.
Probe
Lead wire
Guage.
Do i need anything else? Amplfier of some sort?
" straighten up that star on the grill, assholes."
lgreeley83
05-03-2012, 02:53 PM #23Im probably ordering all isspro. It seems the options are a 1.5" and 2.5" probe. Seems i should go with 1.5" to be safe.
So...parts list.
Probe
Lead wire
Guage.
Do i need anything else? Amplfier of some sort?
" straighten up that star on the grill, assholes."
if it don’t blow black...take it back.
1982 300TDT 4 Speed 196K Standard Beige “VEGEWGN”. 300GD FW. Walbro FRC-8 Fuel Pump. ZadaTech LCD Boost, EGT, & Fuel Pressure gauge. Non-EGR Exhaust and Intake Manifold. 3/2 Valves gone. Soon to have Elsbett WVO conversion
1981 300D 314K Midnight Blue “The Blue Car”, Lovecrap system, owned 25 years+
1985 300TD White 198K “Betty White” Pure beauty
The VEGEWGN
My set up has its own computer module so I don’t know much about the typical gauges.
if it don’t blow black...take it back.
1982 300TDT 4 Speed 196K Standard Beige “VEGEWGN”. 300GD FW. Walbro FRC-8 Fuel Pump. ZadaTech LCD Boost, EGT, & Fuel Pressure gauge. Non-EGR Exhaust and Intake Manifold. 3/2 Valves gone. Soon to have Elsbett WVO conversion
1981 300D 314K Midnight Blue “The Blue Car”, Lovecrap system, owned 25 years+
1985 300TD White 198K “Betty White” Pure beauty
The VEGEWGN
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