Any 2:47 or 2:47 LSD Actual Experience
Any 2:47 or 2:47 LSD Actual Experience
02-09-2014, 03:44 PM
#51
Is there a stamp on the side like the normal differentials in the W123. For example, on a 1985, it is stamped on the side 2:88.
Would this have it too ? EG, 2:65 LSD ??
Attached Files
Image(s)Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
Here's a picture of the Diff. Is this the LSD ? Just want to make sure.
Is there a stamp on the side like the normal differentials in the W123. For example, on a 1985, it is stamped on the side 2:88.
Would this have it too ? EG, 2:65 LSD ??
Attached Files
Image(s)Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
02-09-2014, 06:25 PM
#53
(02-09-2014, 03:44 PM)Greazzer Here's a picture of the Diff. Is this the LSD ? Just want to make sure.
Is there a stamp on the side like the normal differentials in the W123. For example, on a 1985, it is stamped on the side 2:88.
Would this have it too ? EG, 2:65 LSD ??
Achtung, Spezialol (attention!: Special oil!)
Sperrdifferential (blocking differential, i.e. limited-slip)!
On the lower rear left at 8 o'clock to the cover is a flat flange which will have the differential's serial number followed by ratio ("2.65" you hope) and below that "SP" (SPerrdifferential) stamped.
Yep, that's the housing of an LSD all right. Of course, to be sure you have to look inside and see the clutchpack.
I'd show you a photo of mine, but haven't opened it yet. I'm against opening up a diff except in dry weather, on principle. There's 5 inches of snow on the ground and just above freezing right now.
Gone but not forgotten: two W123 sedans and two W124 wagons.
W124 1987 300TD wagon, for sale, $1000 (some assembly required).
JustPassinThru
02-09-2014, 06:25 PM #53(02-09-2014, 03:44 PM)Greazzer Here's a picture of the Diff. Is this the LSD ? Just want to make sure.
Is there a stamp on the side like the normal differentials in the W123. For example, on a 1985, it is stamped on the side 2:88.
Would this have it too ? EG, 2:65 LSD ??
Achtung, Spezialol (attention!: Special oil!)
Sperrdifferential (blocking differential, i.e. limited-slip)!
On the lower rear left at 8 o'clock to the cover is a flat flange which will have the differential's serial number followed by ratio ("2.65" you hope) and below that "SP" (SPerrdifferential) stamped.
Yep, that's the housing of an LSD all right. Of course, to be sure you have to look inside and see the clutchpack.
I'd show you a photo of mine, but haven't opened it yet. I'm against opening up a diff except in dry weather, on principle. There's 5 inches of snow on the ground and just above freezing right now.
Gone but not forgotten: two W123 sedans and two W124 wagons.
W124 1987 300TD wagon, for sale, $1000 (some assembly required).
02-16-2014, 06:31 AM
#54
(01-20-2014, 12:49 PM)DeliveryValve Hey Mark, a 1st gen w126 2.47 LSD or a 6.9 2.65 LSD find would be really lucky for you. Most likely you come across a 2nd gen w126 2.47 first or maybe a 1st Gen w126 2.24 than any of those.
Other options for yard finds..
If you happen to stike out and only find 2nd gen stuff, and if you are willing, you can remove the LSD carrier from a 2nd gen and install it in a 1st gen w126 open diff case.
Also, if you run across a w124 4matic with ASR or a w201 16v LSD at yards, you can swap the clutched carrier into your 3.07 or 2.88 w123 case.
.
NOW i'm getting excited. So all 201 diffs fit w123 cases? direct fit?
How about 300tdt w124 diffs? can you slam them in a first gen126 or a w123 case or is it just the 4matic?
Holset power!
(01-20-2014, 12:49 PM)DeliveryValve Hey Mark, a 1st gen w126 2.47 LSD or a 6.9 2.65 LSD find would be really lucky for you. Most likely you come across a 2nd gen w126 2.47 first or maybe a 1st Gen w126 2.24 than any of those.
Other options for yard finds..
If you happen to stike out and only find 2nd gen stuff, and if you are willing, you can remove the LSD carrier from a 2nd gen and install it in a 1st gen w126 open diff case.
Also, if you run across a w124 4matic with ASR or a w201 16v LSD at yards, you can swap the clutched carrier into your 3.07 or 2.88 w123 case.
.
NOW i'm getting excited. So all 201 diffs fit w123 cases? direct fit?
How about 300tdt w124 diffs? can you slam them in a first gen126 or a w123 case or is it just the 4matic?
Holset power!
03-11-2014, 08:19 PM
#55
Does anyone have a direct picture of the insides ? I just want to make sure it's the real McCoy. It has the tag as per the pictures, which is pretty close to 100% proof, but I won't "know" until I physically get it in hand.
So, maybe the hunt for the elusive 2:65 LSD will be over in less than 72 hours. LOL
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
OK, I am picking up the differential on Thusday or Friday at the latest, so just a few days away.
Does anyone have a direct picture of the insides ? I just want to make sure it's the real McCoy. It has the tag as per the pictures, which is pretty close to 100% proof, but I won't "know" until I physically get it in hand.
So, maybe the hunt for the elusive 2:65 LSD will be over in less than 72 hours. LOL
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-11-2014, 09:38 PM
#56
Gone but not forgotten: two W123 sedans and two W124 wagons.
W124 1987 300TD wagon, for sale, $1000 (some assembly required).
JustPassinThru
03-11-2014, 09:38 PM #56Heh--been a never-ending cycle of rainstorms here. It'll be dry tomorrow, but I won't have time to open mine up. Starts raining again on Thursday.
Gone but not forgotten: two W123 sedans and two W124 wagons.
W124 1987 300TD wagon, for sale, $1000 (some assembly required).
03-12-2014, 05:26 AM
#57
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
We have weird weather here too ... one day it's 70F and the next day its 40F and cold/windy/rain ...
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-12-2014, 12:27 PM
#58
(03-12-2014, 05:26 AM)Greazzer We have weird weather here too ... one day it's 70F and the next day its 40F and cold/windy/rain ...
In Seattle, between November and May, ...need I say more. Extraordinarily, it'll be sunny all day today, the forecast high is 60. Tonight, local hospital emergency wards will be crammed with people whose gardening instincts got the best of them, who spent all day on their knees weeding and edging their front lawn for the first time since last October, and consequently have excruciating knee stiffness and elbow and wrist sprains.
Gone but not forgotten: two W123 sedans and two W124 wagons.
W124 1987 300TD wagon, for sale, $1000 (some assembly required).
JustPassinThru
03-12-2014, 12:27 PM #58(03-12-2014, 05:26 AM)Greazzer We have weird weather here too ... one day it's 70F and the next day its 40F and cold/windy/rain ...
In Seattle, between November and May, ...need I say more. Extraordinarily, it'll be sunny all day today, the forecast high is 60. Tonight, local hospital emergency wards will be crammed with people whose gardening instincts got the best of them, who spent all day on their knees weeding and edging their front lawn for the first time since last October, and consequently have excruciating knee stiffness and elbow and wrist sprains.
Gone but not forgotten: two W123 sedans and two W124 wagons.
W124 1987 300TD wagon, for sale, $1000 (some assembly required).
03-12-2014, 01:06 PM
#59
As for today, 8" of snow in Fort Wayne, IND. Yesterday, Fort Wayne had 50F, nice and sunny weather. We are having 70-75F nice and sunny except for today. Rainey and chilly, 60F ...
, but it was really crappy just a few days prior, with 35F night time temps. I don't get it or what's up with the weather.I already paid for my 2:65 LSD so I am committed no matter what. It has the special metal tag, and it came out of the 1979 450 SEL W116 - 6.9, but I still want to look inside.
I will post pics when I get back !
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
My plane leaves tomorrow early AM out of Charlotte, NC.
As for today, 8" of snow in Fort Wayne, IND. Yesterday, Fort Wayne had 50F, nice and sunny weather. We are having 70-75F nice and sunny except for today. Rainey and chilly, 60F ..., but it was really crappy just a few days prior, with 35F night time temps. I don't get it or what's up with the weather.
I already paid for my 2:65 LSD so I am committed no matter what. It has the special metal tag, and it came out of the 1979 450 SEL W116 - 6.9, but I still want to look inside.
I will post pics when I get back !
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-12-2014, 09:22 PM
#60
I am thinking this is the real McCoy !
Attached Files
Image(s)Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
Ok, got 2 pictures of the inside.
I am thinking this is the real McCoy !
Attached Files
Image(s)Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-13-2014, 04:55 AM
#61
(03-12-2014, 09:22 PM)Greazzer Ok, got 2 pictures of the inside.
I am thinking this is the real McCoy !
looks like you have the LSD in there somewhere beneth that dirty oil
change of flange + clean it out and you should be good to go
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
swampmonkey
03-13-2014, 04:55 AM #61(03-12-2014, 09:22 PM)Greazzer Ok, got 2 pictures of the inside.
I am thinking this is the real McCoy !
looks like you have the LSD in there somewhere beneth that dirty oil
change of flange + clean it out and you should be good to go
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
03-13-2014, 08:03 PM
#62
(03-12-2014, 09:22 PM)Greazzer Ok, got 2 pictures of the inside.
I am thinking this is the real McCoy !
Austincarnut
03-13-2014, 08:03 PM #62what is this out of again '85 300d?
(03-12-2014, 09:22 PM)Greazzer Ok, got 2 pictures of the inside.
I am thinking this is the real McCoy !
03-14-2014, 07:10 AM
#63
What LUCK and TIMING ! To have to go to Fort Wayne, IND and have someone who just got a M-100 (1979 SEL 6.9) all within the same time period... Now, will the airlines accept it ??? LOL
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
I physcially got it ! Picked it up last night. It must weigh 50 pounds. It is definitely heavier than a 2:88 from a 1985.
What LUCK and TIMING ! To have to go to Fort Wayne, IND and have someone who just got a M-100 (1979 SEL 6.9) all within the same time period... Now, will the airlines accept it ??? LOL
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-14-2014, 08:06 AM
#64
(03-14-2014, 07:10 AM)Greazzer I physcially got it ! Picked it up last night. It must weigh 50 pounds. It is definitely heavier than a 2:88 from a 1985.
What LUCK and TIMING ! To have to go to Fort Wayne, IND and have someone who just got a M-100 (1979 SEL 6.9) all within the same time period... Now, will the airlines accept it ??? LOL
50 pounds? id guess more around 125punds
i couldnt send my 2.65 with one shipping due to the wieght, and their limit was around 90pounds my 2.88 weighted 50pounds...
good to hear its the real deal, hopefully the clutchdiscs isnt to worn and it will work great
(03-13-2014, 08:03 PM)Austincarnut what is this out of again '85 300d?
(03-12-2014, 09:22 PM)Greazzer Ok, got 2 pictures of the inside.
I am thinking this is the real McCoy !
naa, that should be a w116 450SE 6.9, it is an 2.65 LSD differential.
the flange will have to be changed + spacerbushing + 30mm nut, tightened, and will fit his current car
This post was last modified: 03-14-2014, 08:12 AM by swampmonkey.
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
swampmonkey
03-14-2014, 08:06 AM #64(03-14-2014, 07:10 AM)Greazzer I physcially got it ! Picked it up last night. It must weigh 50 pounds. It is definitely heavier than a 2:88 from a 1985.
What LUCK and TIMING ! To have to go to Fort Wayne, IND and have someone who just got a M-100 (1979 SEL 6.9) all within the same time period... Now, will the airlines accept it ??? LOL
50 pounds? id guess more around 125punds
i couldnt send my 2.65 with one shipping due to the wieght, and their limit was around 90pounds my 2.88 weighted 50pounds...
good to hear its the real deal, hopefully the clutchdiscs isnt to worn and it will work great
(03-13-2014, 08:03 PM)Austincarnut what is this out of again '85 300d?
(03-12-2014, 09:22 PM)Greazzer Ok, got 2 pictures of the inside.
I am thinking this is the real McCoy !
naa, that should be a w116 450SE 6.9, it is an 2.65 LSD differential.
the flange will have to be changed + spacerbushing + 30mm nut, tightened, and will fit his current car
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
03-16-2014, 08:20 AM
#65
Clutch Pack Worn ? Hmmm, another thing to worry about.
When I picked up the differential, the axles never had any shims.
BTW -- is there an easy way to measure for shims? That is, which ones to use.
While I am waiting for UPS to deliver the differential, I will be ordering new axle seals and new pinion seals, 30mm nut, then off to the machine shop to clean it.
Clutch packs ... I trust they are incredible expensive and/of difficult to rebuild ...lol
The saga continues ....
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
Well, I was wrong by a mile on the weight by ALOT. Weighs 89 pounds according to the airlines. The airlines wanted $250 to ship it, so off to the UPS store. UPS Store and to ship 89.4 pounds ended up being around $138 which is more than what I paid for the differential itself.
Clutch Pack Worn ? Hmmm, another thing to worry about.
When I picked up the differential, the axles never had any shims.
BTW -- is there an easy way to measure for shims? That is, which ones to use.
While I am waiting for UPS to deliver the differential, I will be ordering new axle seals and new pinion seals, 30mm nut, then off to the machine shop to clean it.
Clutch packs ... I trust they are incredible expensive and/of difficult to rebuild ...lol
The saga continues ....
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-16-2014, 09:19 AM
#66
You've got to spread the case to set backlash. The case spreader I use is expensive. It's nice to have the tool to set pinion depth which is usually expensive. You can do without a pinion depth tool, but you need skills, knowledge, patience, time, gear marking compound and an assortment of backlash snap rings to set pinion depth by trial and error.
raysorenson
03-16-2014, 09:19 AM #66I've found that excessive friction material wear is not typical, regardless of mileage. Definitely take it apart and inspect the clutches. If they've all got friction material and nothing looks burned, the only thing to worry about is stack height. Stack height affects how the teeth of the spider gears contact each other. If it was an insane HP/huge tire build pushing the limits of the rear diff, I'd make sure that's spot on. If it's a mild build, don't worry about it. Your LSD will work fine. I can't remember if the merc clutches have yellow metals or not in the friction material. If brass/bronze, then don't use GL5 oil, use GL4.
You've got to spread the case to set backlash. The case spreader I use is expensive. It's nice to have the tool to set pinion depth which is usually expensive. You can do without a pinion depth tool, but you need skills, knowledge, patience, time, gear marking compound and an assortment of backlash snap rings to set pinion depth by trial and error.
03-16-2014, 10:04 AM
#67
Or will I need to check the tags?
Austincarnut
03-16-2014, 10:04 AM #67Did any other 116's come w/ this set up? I found several 116 euro's in the yard lately and wonder if I should grab the diff's...
Or will I need to check the tags?
03-16-2014, 11:23 AM
#69
Josh -- just the 6.9 from my understanding but I would double check that since I am a total Noob with the differential issue except swapping out a 2:88.... There is tag on the side in German. Check out the pictures in the prior posts.
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
Greyhound would have cost about the same as UPS (with AAA discount). I have shipped a lot of stuff thru Greyhound, e.g., transmissions, hoods, windows, trunk lids, et cet. Never an issue and really happy with Greyhound. Greyound would have been a problem because 1). Insurance is very limited versus the $1,500 I got from UPS, and 2). I had a flight to catch and limited time to drive around and weigh options...
Josh -- just the 6.9 from my understanding but I would double check that since I am a total Noob with the differential issue except swapping out a 2:88.... There is tag on the side in German. Check out the pictures in the prior posts.
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-16-2014, 08:13 PM
#70
(03-16-2014, 11:23 AM)Greazzer Greyhound would have cost about the same as UPS (with AAA discount). I have shipped a lot of stuff thru Greyhound, e.g., transmissions, hoods, windows, trunk lids, et cet. Never an issue and really happy with Greyhound. Greyound would have been a problem because 1). Insurance is very limited versus the $1,500 I got from UPS, and 2). I had a flight to catch and limited time to drive around and weigh options...
Josh -- just the 6.9 from my understanding but I would double check that since I am a total Noob with the differential issue except swapping out a 2:88.... There is tag on the side in German. Check out the pictures in the prior posts.
Austincarnut
03-16-2014, 08:13 PM #70will do, so far no limited slip, all open diffs!
(03-16-2014, 11:23 AM)Greazzer Greyhound would have cost about the same as UPS (with AAA discount). I have shipped a lot of stuff thru Greyhound, e.g., transmissions, hoods, windows, trunk lids, et cet. Never an issue and really happy with Greyhound. Greyound would have been a problem because 1). Insurance is very limited versus the $1,500 I got from UPS, and 2). I had a flight to catch and limited time to drive around and weigh options...
Josh -- just the 6.9 from my understanding but I would double check that since I am a total Noob with the differential issue except swapping out a 2:88.... There is tag on the side in German. Check out the pictures in the prior posts.
03-17-2014, 11:58 AM
#71
(03-16-2014, 08:20 AM)Greazzer BTW -- is there an easy way to measure for shims? That is, which ones to use.
.....
Clutch packs ... I trust they are incredible expensive and/of difficult to rebuild ...lol
The saga continues ....
The easiest way to measure the shims is to insert the axle, install the "c" clip, push the axles into the diff and eye ball the gap between the "c" clip and the spider gear. I like to use my extra spacers as a gauge for the gap of what I will need or use feeler gauges.
The FSM of diff rebuilding with clutches..
http://www.w124performance.com/docs/mb/o...ld_FSM.pdf
Gota love Mercedes Diesels!
.
DeliveryValve
03-17-2014, 11:58 AM #71(03-16-2014, 08:20 AM)Greazzer BTW -- is there an easy way to measure for shims? That is, which ones to use.
.....
Clutch packs ... I trust they are incredible expensive and/of difficult to rebuild ...lol
The saga continues ....
The easiest way to measure the shims is to insert the axle, install the "c" clip, push the axles into the diff and eye ball the gap between the "c" clip and the spider gear. I like to use my extra spacers as a gauge for the gap of what I will need or use feeler gauges.
The FSM of diff rebuilding with clutches..
http://www.w124performance.com/docs/mb/o...ld_FSM.pdf
Gota love Mercedes Diesels!
.
03-17-2014, 12:16 PM
#72
I figured out the relationship between the shim on the outside, on the axle and that shim thickness effecting the clearance or gap from the "C" clip and the amount of space at the end of the axle. Thicker the shim, the more the axle is "pushed" or moved away from the inside where the "C" clip would go.
Do you (or anyone) know the amount of clearance per the specs ? I would assume it should not be really loose or really tight. I am guess a feeler gauge would work to measure that gab. OR, is it something "universal" as .10 (tenth of a mm)???????
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
Thanks DV.
I figured out the relationship between the shim on the outside, on the axle and that shim thickness effecting the clearance or gap from the "C" clip and the amount of space at the end of the axle. Thicker the shim, the more the axle is "pushed" or moved away from the inside where the "C" clip would go.
Do you (or anyone) know the amount of clearance per the specs ? I would assume it should not be really loose or really tight. I am guess a feeler gauge would work to measure that gab. OR, is it something "universal" as .10 (tenth of a mm)???????
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-17-2014, 05:14 PM
#73
(03-17-2014, 12:16 PM)Greazzer Do you (or anyone) know the amount of clearance per the specs ? I would assume it should not be really loose or really tight. ....
I don't know the spec, but your assumption is good enough for me.
.
Gota love Mercedes Diesels!
.
DeliveryValve
03-17-2014, 05:14 PM #73(03-17-2014, 12:16 PM)Greazzer Do you (or anyone) know the amount of clearance per the specs ? I would assume it should not be really loose or really tight. ....
I don't know the spec, but your assumption is good enough for me.
.
Gota love Mercedes Diesels!
.
03-17-2014, 05:36 PM
#74
the only thing it does is keep the driveshaft somewhat still...
put it in, is there a large play to the C clip, get something thicker in there, is it somewhat tight, go for it...
ive had sizes between 0.3mm to 1.3mm.. (i think)
This post was last modified: 03-17-2014, 05:36 PM by swampmonkey.
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
swampmonkey
03-17-2014, 05:36 PM #74dont go to tight, or to loose, it isnt exactly brainsurgery
the only thing it does is keep the driveshaft somewhat still...
put it in, is there a large play to the C clip, get something thicker in there, is it somewhat tight, go for it...
ive had sizes between 0.3mm to 1.3mm.. (i think)
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
03-17-2014, 05:41 PM
#75
For 'normal' read...not LSD. Don't know about them but it would be well worth checking. Unnecessary endfloat on driveshaft might result in C clip dislodging. I measure endfloat with dialgauge then add/subtract shims till it's right.
Clearance spec for a 'normal' diff is zero. Manual says circlip should be tight to turn in it's groove when adjustment is OK.
For 'normal' read...not LSD. Don't know about them but it would be well worth checking. Unnecessary endfloat on driveshaft might result in C clip dislodging. I measure endfloat with dialgauge then add/subtract shims till it's right.
03-19-2014, 06:20 AM
#76
OK, the ol'e girl is home. Found my new German flex disk (front one is almost new, replaced when I did the drivetrain install). Found a nice, correct yoke, and 2 sets of shims, one set is .90 and .95 and others are 2.60. The reason I need an assortment of shims is that once I start the swap, I am 100% committed and I need to get the car completed while I have access to a car lift.
Off to the machine shop for a complete cleaning and off to the drive shaft place to get my mod'd driveshaft balanced.
I found the part # for the "C" clips and they really do cost about the same as a small bag of chips, i.e., .50 cents a piece.
I should have everything in place so that by next weekend, I will have my 2:65 installed. BTW -- yoke is held in place with the really funky four prong nut versus the 30mm funky nut, so need to grind down a socket for that operation ...lol
I will take a bunch of pictures of the install so I can share my trials and tribulations with the swap for anyone going the same route.
Again, thanks !
Attached Files
Image(s)Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
Thank you Gents for the information and assistance along the way !
OK, the ol'e girl is home. Found my new German flex disk (front one is almost new, replaced when I did the drivetrain install). Found a nice, correct yoke, and 2 sets of shims, one set is .90 and .95 and others are 2.60. The reason I need an assortment of shims is that once I start the swap, I am 100% committed and I need to get the car completed while I have access to a car lift.
Off to the machine shop for a complete cleaning and off to the drive shaft place to get my mod'd driveshaft balanced.
I found the part # for the "C" clips and they really do cost about the same as a small bag of chips, i.e., .50 cents a piece.
I should have everything in place so that by next weekend, I will have my 2:65 installed. BTW -- yoke is held in place with the really funky four prong nut versus the 30mm funky nut, so need to grind down a socket for that operation ...lol
I will take a bunch of pictures of the install so I can share my trials and tribulations with the swap for anyone going the same route.
Again, thanks !
Attached Files
Image(s)Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-19-2014, 07:51 AM
#78
(03-19-2014, 06:20 AM)Greazzer Thank you Gents for the information and assistance along the way !
OK, the ol'e girl is home. Found my new German flex disk (front one is almost new, replaced when I did the drivetrain install). Found a nice, correct yoke, and 2 sets of shims, one set is .90 and .95 and others are 2.60. The reason I need an assortment of shims is that once I start the swap, I am 100% committed and I need to get the car completed while I have access to a car lift.
Off to the machine shop for a complete cleaning and off to the drive shaft place to get my mod'd driveshaft balanced.
I found the part # for the "C" clips and they really do cost about the same as a small bag of chips, i.e., .50 cents a piece.
I should have everything in place so that by next weekend, I will have my 2:65 installed. BTW -- yoke is held in place with the really funky four prong nut versus the 30mm funky nut, so need to grind down a socket for that operation ...lol
I will take a bunch of pictures of the install so I can share my trials and tribulations with the swap for anyone going the same route.
Again, thanks !
hmm, not to be an arsehole, but why not reweld the driveshaft so you can use the larger flexdisc and doesnt need to change the flange/yoke and al the problems that comes from that? since you are going to get the driveshaft balanced anyway?
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
swampmonkey
03-19-2014, 07:51 AM #78(03-19-2014, 06:20 AM)Greazzer Thank you Gents for the information and assistance along the way !
OK, the ol'e girl is home. Found my new German flex disk (front one is almost new, replaced when I did the drivetrain install). Found a nice, correct yoke, and 2 sets of shims, one set is .90 and .95 and others are 2.60. The reason I need an assortment of shims is that once I start the swap, I am 100% committed and I need to get the car completed while I have access to a car lift.
Off to the machine shop for a complete cleaning and off to the drive shaft place to get my mod'd driveshaft balanced.
I found the part # for the "C" clips and they really do cost about the same as a small bag of chips, i.e., .50 cents a piece.
I should have everything in place so that by next weekend, I will have my 2:65 installed. BTW -- yoke is held in place with the really funky four prong nut versus the 30mm funky nut, so need to grind down a socket for that operation ...lol
I will take a bunch of pictures of the install so I can share my trials and tribulations with the swap for anyone going the same route.
Again, thanks !
hmm, not to be an arsehole, but why not reweld the driveshaft so you can use the larger flexdisc and doesnt need to change the flange/yoke and al the problems that comes from that? since you are going to get the driveshaft balanced anyway?
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
03-19-2014, 08:58 AM
#79
Well, a bunch of reasons:
1. I already have the flexdisk. Don't want to buy a different one (or a set).
2. I already have the correct yoke for the swap
3. I already ordered and paid for the correct 30mm funky nut as well as some other odds and ends
4. I already own a mod's driveshaft which has grease fittings which is designed specifically for the W123
5. I have to swap out the front part of the drive shaft anyways (shorter section) since the dipshit prior owner hacksawd off the front of the driveshaft about 2" and jammed it into the center bearing (remember, I have the 5 speed which requires an odd front drive shaft section). Instead of getting the correct driveshaft section for the 5 speed, I got a pretty shitty butcher job from the prior owner.
6. Welding the larger yoke will take a bunch of time finding someone in my area capable -- or shipping the driveshaft off to California or Missouri or someother place which has an good reputation
7. The time to swap out the yoke is probably going to be about 5 minutes or less versus the above which strikes me as a time bandit and will probably cost more than the entire LSD project in its entirety.
And, not sure what "real" benefits I would gain by a larger yoke and a larger flex disk. I highly doubt that the torque created by my mod'd engine will snap that yoke or snap the flex disk.
HOWEVER, if you got a good reason to override the above, PLEASE let me know since this is the time to do it (or not).
So, fire away ...
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
No arsholes ... lol
Well, a bunch of reasons:
1. I already have the flexdisk. Don't want to buy a different one (or a set).
2. I already have the correct yoke for the swap
3. I already ordered and paid for the correct 30mm funky nut as well as some other odds and ends
4. I already own a mod's driveshaft which has grease fittings which is designed specifically for the W123
5. I have to swap out the front part of the drive shaft anyways (shorter section) since the dipshit prior owner hacksawd off the front of the driveshaft about 2" and jammed it into the center bearing (remember, I have the 5 speed which requires an odd front drive shaft section). Instead of getting the correct driveshaft section for the 5 speed, I got a pretty shitty butcher job from the prior owner.
6. Welding the larger yoke will take a bunch of time finding someone in my area capable -- or shipping the driveshaft off to California or Missouri or someother place which has an good reputation
7. The time to swap out the yoke is probably going to be about 5 minutes or less versus the above which strikes me as a time bandit and will probably cost more than the entire LSD project in its entirety.
And, not sure what "real" benefits I would gain by a larger yoke and a larger flex disk. I highly doubt that the torque created by my mod'd engine will snap that yoke or snap the flex disk.
HOWEVER, if you got a good reason to override the above, PLEASE let me know since this is the time to do it (or not).
So, fire away ...
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-19-2014, 09:06 AM
#80
(03-19-2014, 08:58 AM)Greazzer No arsholes ... lol
Well, a bunch of reasons:
1. I already have the flexdisk. Don't want to buy a different one (or a set).
2. I already have the correct yoke for the swap
3. I already ordered and paid for the correct 30mm funky nut as well as some other odds and ends
4. I already own a mod's driveshaft which has grease fittings which is designed specifically for the W123
5. I have to swap out the front part of the drive shaft anyways (shorter section) since the dipshit prior owner hacksawd off the front of the driveshaft about 2" and jammed it into the center bearing (remember, I have the 5 speed which requires an odd front drive shaft section). Instead of getting the correct driveshaft section for the 5 speed, I got a pretty shitty butcher job from the prior owner.
6. Welding the larger yoke will take a bunch of time finding someone in my area capable -- or shipping the driveshaft off to California or Missouri or someother place which has an good reputation
7. The time to swap out the yoke is probably going to be about 5 minutes or less versus the above which strikes me as a time bandit and will probably cost more than the entire LSD project in its entirety.
And, not sure what "real" benefits I would gain by a larger yoke and a larger flex disk. I highly doubt that the torque created by my mod'd engine will snap that yoke or snap the flex disk.
HOWEVER, if you got a good reason to override the above, PLEASE let me know since this is the time to do it (or not).
So, fire away ...
No real point in doing so, just that changing the yoke/flange can be somewhat difficult to get done properly...
and, incase you ever stumble upon another v8 LSD, say a 3.27LSD a 2.82LSD or a 2.24, it will be a direct fit.
my future rebuilds i will get the larger flange on the driveshaft right away, and thus, will be able to switch differential however i want, straight when i get it
+ the tad sturdier flexdisc...not that important thou
go for what you already planed
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
swampmonkey
03-19-2014, 09:06 AM #80(03-19-2014, 08:58 AM)Greazzer No arsholes ... lol
Well, a bunch of reasons:
1. I already have the flexdisk. Don't want to buy a different one (or a set).
2. I already have the correct yoke for the swap
3. I already ordered and paid for the correct 30mm funky nut as well as some other odds and ends
4. I already own a mod's driveshaft which has grease fittings which is designed specifically for the W123
5. I have to swap out the front part of the drive shaft anyways (shorter section) since the dipshit prior owner hacksawd off the front of the driveshaft about 2" and jammed it into the center bearing (remember, I have the 5 speed which requires an odd front drive shaft section). Instead of getting the correct driveshaft section for the 5 speed, I got a pretty shitty butcher job from the prior owner.
6. Welding the larger yoke will take a bunch of time finding someone in my area capable -- or shipping the driveshaft off to California or Missouri or someother place which has an good reputation
7. The time to swap out the yoke is probably going to be about 5 minutes or less versus the above which strikes me as a time bandit and will probably cost more than the entire LSD project in its entirety.
And, not sure what "real" benefits I would gain by a larger yoke and a larger flex disk. I highly doubt that the torque created by my mod'd engine will snap that yoke or snap the flex disk.
HOWEVER, if you got a good reason to override the above, PLEASE let me know since this is the time to do it (or not).
So, fire away ...
No real point in doing so, just that changing the yoke/flange can be somewhat difficult to get done properly...
and, incase you ever stumble upon another v8 LSD, say a 3.27LSD a 2.82LSD or a 2.24, it will be a direct fit.
my future rebuilds i will get the larger flange on the driveshaft right away, and thus, will be able to switch differential however i want, straight when i get it
+ the tad sturdier flexdisc...not that important thou
go for what you already planed
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
03-19-2014, 09:20 AM
#81
Assuming I won't be doing any swaps since LSDs are pretty tough to find and this is probably my first and last swap. DeliveryValve was 100% correct on their scarcity and but for my STD-Luck in finding one and finding one inexpensively, please tell me the benefits of the larger yoke and larger flex disk.
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
OK, dumb question ...
Assuming I won't be doing any swaps since LSDs are pretty tough to find and this is probably my first and last swap. DeliveryValve was 100% correct on their scarcity and but for my STD-Luck in finding one and finding one inexpensively, please tell me the benefits of the larger yoke and larger flex disk.
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-19-2014, 02:49 PM
#82
(03-19-2014, 06:20 AM)Greazzer ....i BTW -- yoke is held in place with the really funky four prong nut versus the 30mm funky nut, so need to grind down a socket for that operation ...lol
....
Get a chisel and a hammer, and tap away.... This according to PP's whunter.
As a tool junky, I have the correct tool, so I have not tried that method.
.
(03-19-2014, 07:18 AM)john maby stupid questions but i am trying to sort this one out for me.
will a asr diff from w124 fit in my w123 housing?
will a lsd 201 fit my w123 housing?
Not a stupid question.... If the LSD and ASR diff has a 185mm ring gear, then the carrier should fit Ina w123 housing. The pinion gear will not fit, ring gear could, but both should be matched up anyways. So most likely you'll be using the w123 gear set.
.
(03-19-2014, 09:20 AM)Greazzer OK, dumb question ...
Assuming I won't be doing any swaps since LSDs are pretty tough to find and this is probably my first and last swap. DeliveryValve was 100% correct on their scarcity and but for my STD-Luck in finding one and finding one inexpensively, please tell me the benefits of the larger yoke and larger flex disk.
There are no dumb questions.
My opinion is you only go to the larger flex disk if you are cutting up the driveshaft to be shortened or lengthened, and your engine is making gobs of torque. With the latter, I don't think the 717.400 will survive and you're better off with a different transmission.
I say swap yokes, not really all that hard once you get the friction torque, and worry less and drive more!
.
This post was last modified: 03-19-2014, 03:03 PM by DeliveryValve.
Gota love Mercedes Diesels!
.
DeliveryValve
03-19-2014, 02:49 PM #82(03-19-2014, 06:20 AM)Greazzer ....i BTW -- yoke is held in place with the really funky four prong nut versus the 30mm funky nut, so need to grind down a socket for that operation ...lol
....
Get a chisel and a hammer, and tap away.... This according to PP's whunter.
As a tool junky, I have the correct tool, so I have not tried that method.
.
(03-19-2014, 07:18 AM)john maby stupid questions but i am trying to sort this one out for me.
will a asr diff from w124 fit in my w123 housing?
will a lsd 201 fit my w123 housing?
Not a stupid question.... If the LSD and ASR diff has a 185mm ring gear, then the carrier should fit Ina w123 housing. The pinion gear will not fit, ring gear could, but both should be matched up anyways. So most likely you'll be using the w123 gear set.
.
(03-19-2014, 09:20 AM)Greazzer OK, dumb question ...
Assuming I won't be doing any swaps since LSDs are pretty tough to find and this is probably my first and last swap. DeliveryValve was 100% correct on their scarcity and but for my STD-Luck in finding one and finding one inexpensively, please tell me the benefits of the larger yoke and larger flex disk.
There are no dumb questions.
My opinion is you only go to the larger flex disk if you are cutting up the driveshaft to be shortened or lengthened, and your engine is making gobs of torque. With the latter, I don't think the 717.400 will survive and you're better off with a different transmission.
I say swap yokes, not really all that hard once you get the friction torque, and worry less and drive more!
.
Gota love Mercedes Diesels!
.
03-19-2014, 04:11 PM
#83
That leads to the new question ... lol.
How does one determine the correct torque when tightening down the 12 pt funky nut ? I checked out a few YouTube videos, and saw a graphic or a cartoon how the crush seal gets "squeezed". The folks over on W116.org claim this whole operation is best left to the Mercedes Dealer.
In any event, my differential is just about surgically clean right now. Hopefully, seals will be in my Monday, and I am off to the races ...
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
Hi Richard,
That leads to the new question ... lol.
How does one determine the correct torque when tightening down the 12 pt funky nut ? I checked out a few YouTube videos, and saw a graphic or a cartoon how the crush seal gets "squeezed". The folks over on W116.org claim this whole operation is best left to the Mercedes Dealer.
In any event, my differential is just about surgically clean right now. Hopefully, seals will be in my Monday, and I am off to the races ...
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-19-2014, 04:42 PM
#84
(03-19-2014, 04:11 PM)Greazzer Hi Richard,
That leads to the new question ... lol.
How does one determine the correct torque when tightening down the 12 pt funky nut ? I checked out a few YouTube videos, and saw a graphic or a cartoon how the crush seal gets "squeezed". The folks over on W116.org claim this whole operation is best left to the Mercedes Dealer.
In any event, my differential is just about surgically clean right now. Hopefully, seals will be in my Monday, and I am off to the races ...
even the Mercedes dealer leaves that part for the pros over here in sweden, ive been next to the specialist here in gothenburg when he did my 2.65...
he have done a 100of those, and didnt use a torquemeter, but by hand and feeling... he got everything out except the input shaft (sorry for my english, tired as hell)
tightened, rotated it a bit, tightened, rotated, and so on... he went past the "no play" and further on, the arm was 1.5meter long, and he pushed quite a bit.
it turned kind of hard when he was done..
but yeah, see if you can get any torque numbers.. (its the same as a wheelbearing at the back, you need quite a lot of torque to get it tight enough
)
This post was last modified: 03-19-2014, 04:44 PM by swampmonkey.
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
swampmonkey
03-19-2014, 04:42 PM #84(03-19-2014, 04:11 PM)Greazzer Hi Richard,
That leads to the new question ... lol.
How does one determine the correct torque when tightening down the 12 pt funky nut ? I checked out a few YouTube videos, and saw a graphic or a cartoon how the crush seal gets "squeezed". The folks over on W116.org claim this whole operation is best left to the Mercedes Dealer.
In any event, my differential is just about surgically clean right now. Hopefully, seals will be in my Monday, and I am off to the races ...
even the Mercedes dealer leaves that part for the pros over here in sweden, ive been next to the specialist here in gothenburg when he did my 2.65...
he have done a 100of those, and didnt use a torquemeter, but by hand and feeling... he got everything out except the input shaft (sorry for my english, tired as hell)
tightened, rotated it a bit, tightened, rotated, and so on... he went past the "no play" and further on, the arm was 1.5meter long, and he pushed quite a bit.
it turned kind of hard when he was done..
but yeah, see if you can get any torque numbers.. (its the same as a wheelbearing at the back, you need quite a lot of torque to get it tight enough
)
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
03-19-2014, 04:53 PM
#85
(03-19-2014, 04:42 PM)swampmonkey ...even the Mercedes dealer leaves that part for the pros over here in sweden, ive been next to the specialist here in gothenburg when he did my 2.65...
he have done a 100of those, and didnt use a torquemeter, but by hand and feeling... he got everything out except the input shaft (sorry for my english, tired as hell)
tightened, rotated it a bit, tightened, rotated, and so on... he went past the "no play" and further on, the arm was 1.5meter long, and he pushed quite a bit.
it turned kind of hard when he was done..
...
I was planning to have my 2.65 LSD diff checked, adjusted, and installed by MBZ of Bellevue, but when I went to ask about the price a couple years ago, the service manager there said they farm their differential renovation work out to the pros at Northwest Differential, in nearby Kirkland. The manager at ND then told me pretty much what swampmonkey says: it's a by-hand, by-eye, by-feel thing, best done by someone who has a lot of experience.
This post was last modified: 03-19-2014, 04:57 PM by JustPassinThru.
Gone but not forgotten: two W123 sedans and two W124 wagons.
W124 1987 300TD wagon, for sale, $1000 (some assembly required).
JustPassinThru
03-19-2014, 04:53 PM #85(03-19-2014, 04:42 PM)swampmonkey ...even the Mercedes dealer leaves that part for the pros over here in sweden, ive been next to the specialist here in gothenburg when he did my 2.65...
he have done a 100of those, and didnt use a torquemeter, but by hand and feeling... he got everything out except the input shaft (sorry for my english, tired as hell)
tightened, rotated it a bit, tightened, rotated, and so on... he went past the "no play" and further on, the arm was 1.5meter long, and he pushed quite a bit.
it turned kind of hard when he was done..
...
I was planning to have my 2.65 LSD diff checked, adjusted, and installed by MBZ of Bellevue, but when I went to ask about the price a couple years ago, the service manager there said they farm their differential renovation work out to the pros at Northwest Differential, in nearby Kirkland. The manager at ND then told me pretty much what swampmonkey says: it's a by-hand, by-eye, by-feel thing, best done by someone who has a lot of experience.
Gone but not forgotten: two W123 sedans and two W124 wagons.
W124 1987 300TD wagon, for sale, $1000 (some assembly required).
03-19-2014, 06:53 PM
#86
(03-19-2014, 04:11 PM)Greazzer Hi Richard,
That leads to the new question ... lol.
How does one determine the correct torque when tightening down the 12 pt funky nut ? I checked out a few YouTube videos, and saw a graphic or a cartoon how the crush seal gets "squeezed". The folks over on W116.org claim this whole operation is best left to the Mercedes Dealer.
In any event, my differential is just about surgically clean right now. Hopefully, seals will be in my Monday, and I am off to the races ...
First you need to get that interior of the diff all oiled up since you did a major cleaning. Make sure you turn it over several times to circulate the oil and that it turns nicely.
Then you need to take note of the rotational friction torque down.
A similar procedure is shown starting at 2:00 (two minutes) into this video of a guy setting a Ford diff.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8APYO2sZyJU
When you install the new flange the FSM states.
Quote:Plug-on propeller flange and carefully tighten by means of a new slot nut until measured or recorded friction torque has been attained. Tightening torque of slot nut should amount to at least 180Nm. If this minimum tightening torque is not attained, replace elastic spacing sleeve.
My interpretation is that after getting the rotational torque figure, the FSM states to tighten down the nut until you get to that rotational torque. If you achieve the noted rotational torque before the torque on the nut is 180 newton meters or 132 pound feet, then you’ll need a new crush sleeve (aka - elastic spacing sleeve). The concept is that sleeve has to achieve a “crush” to get full contact to the bearing. Too much pre-load will overheat and destroy the bearings. Too little preload will make the bearing and gear alignment off and cause issues.
Of course the only way to put a new crush washer is to pull the pinion out. So with a new flange some were successful by tightening the nut until a couple of rotational torque inches past the noted reading and called it done. It didn't matter how much torque was needed to tighten down the nut as long as the desired rotational torque was achieved and then strike the nut to clamp it in place.
.
This post was last modified: 03-19-2014, 07:01 PM by DeliveryValve.
Gota love Mercedes Diesels!
.
DeliveryValve
03-19-2014, 06:53 PM #86(03-19-2014, 04:11 PM)Greazzer Hi Richard,
That leads to the new question ... lol.
How does one determine the correct torque when tightening down the 12 pt funky nut ? I checked out a few YouTube videos, and saw a graphic or a cartoon how the crush seal gets "squeezed". The folks over on W116.org claim this whole operation is best left to the Mercedes Dealer.
In any event, my differential is just about surgically clean right now. Hopefully, seals will be in my Monday, and I am off to the races ...
First you need to get that interior of the diff all oiled up since you did a major cleaning. Make sure you turn it over several times to circulate the oil and that it turns nicely.
Then you need to take note of the rotational friction torque down.
A similar procedure is shown starting at 2:00 (two minutes) into this video of a guy setting a Ford diff.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8APYO2sZyJU
When you install the new flange the FSM states.
Quote:Plug-on propeller flange and carefully tighten by means of a new slot nut until measured or recorded friction torque has been attained. Tightening torque of slot nut should amount to at least 180Nm. If this minimum tightening torque is not attained, replace elastic spacing sleeve.
My interpretation is that after getting the rotational torque figure, the FSM states to tighten down the nut until you get to that rotational torque. If you achieve the noted rotational torque before the torque on the nut is 180 newton meters or 132 pound feet, then you’ll need a new crush sleeve (aka - elastic spacing sleeve). The concept is that sleeve has to achieve a “crush” to get full contact to the bearing. Too much pre-load will overheat and destroy the bearings. Too little preload will make the bearing and gear alignment off and cause issues.
Of course the only way to put a new crush washer is to pull the pinion out. So with a new flange some were successful by tightening the nut until a couple of rotational torque inches past the noted reading and called it done. It didn't matter how much torque was needed to tighten down the nut as long as the desired rotational torque was achieved and then strike the nut to clamp it in place.
.
Gota love Mercedes Diesels!
.
03-19-2014, 07:28 PM
#87
I think I will be paying the machinist a few bucks to install. He's been around 30 years, and regarded as Columbia's best, although incredibly backed up and slow getting any project done lately.
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
What a can of worms did I open ... lol
I think I will be paying the machinist a few bucks to install. He's been around 30 years, and regarded as Columbia's best, although incredibly backed up and slow getting any project done lately.
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-20-2014, 11:46 AM
#88
I will try to chisel out the seals this evening. Machinist indicated they started tearing apart while trying to remove, so I will tinker with it tonight.
Attached Files
Image(s)Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
The "rebuild" begins. Got it back, and it's surgically clean right now.
I will try to chisel out the seals this evening. Machinist indicated they started tearing apart while trying to remove, so I will tinker with it tonight.
Attached Files
Image(s)Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-21-2014, 06:39 AM
#89
1. It's as clean as it's going to get;
2. The axle seals are out. Not a biggie once I tapped on them with a screw driver and collasped them, rather easy;
3. No dice on chiseling out the 4 prong nut that holds the yoke, plus Delivery Valve got me on the rotational torque bandwagon now. I got my torque wrench which goes down to 5 foot pounds, and there's no way it's even close. So, looking for an accurate INCH pounds torque wrench;
4. Getting loaner 4-pin wrench socket;
5. All seals and parts to be delivered on Monday; and
6. Differential Manual in hand compliments of W116.org
What was thought to be a simple swap / project has turned into a decent sized project. Now, contemplating re-doing my axles since I am taking the car's rear end apart and swaping out the driveshaft. So, maybe this weekend I will score some of those 2-part axles ... hmmm
Attached Files
Image(s)Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
Made it to this point:
1. It's as clean as it's going to get;
2. The axle seals are out. Not a biggie once I tapped on them with a screw driver and collasped them, rather easy;
3. No dice on chiseling out the 4 prong nut that holds the yoke, plus Delivery Valve got me on the rotational torque bandwagon now. I got my torque wrench which goes down to 5 foot pounds, and there's no way it's even close. So, looking for an accurate INCH pounds torque wrench;
4. Getting loaner 4-pin wrench socket;
5. All seals and parts to be delivered on Monday; and
6. Differential Manual in hand compliments of W116.org
What was thought to be a simple swap / project has turned into a decent sized project. Now, contemplating re-doing my axles since I am taking the car's rear end apart and swaping out the driveshaft. So, maybe this weekend I will score some of those 2-part axles ... hmmm
Attached Files
Image(s)Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-21-2014, 06:55 AM
#90
Personally think you're opening a whole can of worms changing the input spider. That crush washer referred to sets the interference distance between the pinion and crownwheel and is critical for quiet operation (never mind wear). Messing with it might just ruin an expensive diff. Safer option would be to mod the shaft to suit the existing spider as has been suggested.
By '2 part axles' do you mean like this?
![[Image: 11.jpg]](http://s62.photobucket.com/user/a10ruk/media/300TD/11.jpg.html)
Instead of this...
![[Image: 107diff005.jpg]](http://s62.photobucket.com/user/a10ruk/media/300TD/107diff005.jpg.html)
If so you will need to do this...
![[Image: 24-5001.jpg]](http://s62.photobucket.com/user/a10ruk/media/300TD/24-5001.jpg.html)
![[Image: 10.jpg]](http://s62.photobucket.com/user/a10ruk/media/300TD/10.jpg.html)
to make them fit because the bolt heads foul the flanges.
.
This post was last modified: 03-21-2014, 07:10 AM by Druk.
.
Personally think you're opening a whole can of worms changing the input spider. That crush washer referred to sets the interference distance between the pinion and crownwheel and is critical for quiet operation (never mind wear). Messing with it might just ruin an expensive diff. Safer option would be to mod the shaft to suit the existing spider as has been suggested.
By '2 part axles' do you mean like this?
Instead of this...
If so you will need to do this...
to make them fit because the bolt heads foul the flanges.
.
03-21-2014, 08:14 AM
#91
(03-21-2014, 06:55 AM)Druk .
Personally think you're opening a whole can of worms changing the input spider. That crush washer referred to sets the interference distance between the pinion and crownwheel and is critical for quiet operation (never mind wear). Messing with it might just ruin an expensive diff. Safer option would be to mod the shaft to suit the existing spider as has been suggested.
.
it is possible to do, but yeah, many people fails.
hence why i thought especially a possible superturbodiesel to be, might benefit from having a larger flange, if the 2.65 gets to low when racing and you want a 3.27LSD instead. + you have a larger flexdisc, logic says they will survive longer.
since you are going to get the diff balanced anyway...
but yeah, dont be to discouraged to change the flange, it IS doable, and can work, but yeah, the margins inst that large
get a new spacerwasher straight away, dont reuse your old atleast
and when being there, change the sealring, if it starts to leak you have to remove the entire inards of the differential to change it.
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
swampmonkey
03-21-2014, 08:14 AM #91(03-21-2014, 06:55 AM)Druk .
Personally think you're opening a whole can of worms changing the input spider. That crush washer referred to sets the interference distance between the pinion and crownwheel and is critical for quiet operation (never mind wear). Messing with it might just ruin an expensive diff. Safer option would be to mod the shaft to suit the existing spider as has been suggested.
.
it is possible to do, but yeah, many people fails.
hence why i thought especially a possible superturbodiesel to be, might benefit from having a larger flange, if the 2.65 gets to low when racing and you want a 3.27LSD instead. + you have a larger flexdisc, logic says they will survive longer.
since you are going to get the diff balanced anyway...
but yeah, dont be to discouraged to change the flange, it IS doable, and can work, but yeah, the margins inst that large
get a new spacerwasher straight away, dont reuse your old atleast
and when being there, change the sealring, if it starts to leak you have to remove the entire inards of the differential to change it.
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
03-21-2014, 08:45 AM
#92
As for the yoke and the funky 4 pin nut, I cannot tell if that leaks or not. I know the half axle seals leaked a decent amount, which is normal. The half axles seals seem simple enough.
I guess I could track down a yoke from a W116 driveshaft and get that welded and buy a new flex disk to accomodate the large yoke OR go with the original plan.
I am bidding on Ebay for an INCH pound torque wrench to determine the rotational torque.
I can balance fuel injectors within 15 PSI which most folks claim is impossible, but I do it all the time now. So, I am thinking I will give the yoke swap a whirl. I got all weekend to do my research and figure out in my mind how this component works. Worst case, I have to rebuild the differential which might be in the cards no matter what.
Poop ...
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
OK, scrap the idea of getting the 2-piece half axles ... I will stick with the can-type I currently have.
As for the yoke and the funky 4 pin nut, I cannot tell if that leaks or not. I know the half axle seals leaked a decent amount, which is normal. The half axles seals seem simple enough.
I guess I could track down a yoke from a W116 driveshaft and get that welded and buy a new flex disk to accomodate the large yoke OR go with the original plan.
I am bidding on Ebay for an INCH pound torque wrench to determine the rotational torque.
I can balance fuel injectors within 15 PSI which most folks claim is impossible, but I do it all the time now. So, I am thinking I will give the yoke swap a whirl. I got all weekend to do my research and figure out in my mind how this component works. Worst case, I have to rebuild the differential which might be in the cards no matter what.
Poop ...
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
03-21-2014, 02:17 PM
#93
if you change the yoke, change the seal, imagine finding out that it leaks when you have put it up, and you have to do the yoke-change/removal al over again, not that funny, especially since the seals isnt that expensive
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
swampmonkey
03-21-2014, 02:17 PM #93go for it
if you change the yoke, change the seal, imagine finding out that it leaks when you have put it up, and you have to do the yoke-change/removal al over again, not that funny, especially since the seals isnt that expensive
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
03-21-2014, 04:05 PM
#94
raysorenson
03-21-2014, 04:05 PM #94Park tool tw-1 torque wrench is the only reasonably priced option that I've found. There's no reason a torque wrench used for preload should cost more than $50.
03-21-2014, 08:55 PM
#95
(03-21-2014, 04:05 PM)raysorenson Park tool tw-1 torque wrench is the only reasonably priced option that I've found. There's no reason a torque wrench used for preload should cost more than $50.
Austincarnut
03-21-2014, 08:55 PM #95wander into the local garage and borrow one, most guys in the business are ok with loaning out tools, especially w/ collateral, I do it all the time
(03-21-2014, 04:05 PM)raysorenson Park tool tw-1 torque wrench is the only reasonably priced option that I've found. There's no reason a torque wrench used for preload should cost more than $50.
03-29-2014, 04:14 PM
#96
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/Thre...6#pid62426
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
Ta-Da ... Done !
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/Thre...6#pid62426
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
Users browsing this thread:
44 Guest(s)
44 Guest(s)
Users browsing this thread:
44 Guest(s)
44 Guest(s)