Engine mounts... talk to me
Engine mounts... talk to me
The Merc mounts are massive and can only be used in one way, i.e. with the engine sat on top of them.
Rubber mounts are a lot smaller and can be mounted in different positions and different places.
Do you guys reckon its possible to get away with using solid mounts such as these mounted to the chassis rails?
![[Image: 02-1998-honda-civic-type-r-hasport-ekk2-...-mount.jpg]](http://image.hondatuningmagazine.com/f/features/1305_1998_honda_civic_type_r/48674020/02-1998-honda-civic-type-r-hasport-ekk2-engine-mount.jpg)
Or would it be better to go for something like this mounted to the crossmember?
![[Image: EngineMount.jpg]](http://the-mite.com/images/Engine%20Fit/EngineMount.jpg)
Or just keep the oil filled mounts?
The car will be a daily driver so I dont want untold amounts of vibration.
I was wondering, just how much difference do the Mercedes oil filled mounts make compared to a solid rubber mount in terms of NVH?
The Merc mounts are massive and can only be used in one way, i.e. with the engine sat on top of them.
Rubber mounts are a lot smaller and can be mounted in different positions and different places.
Do you guys reckon its possible to get away with using solid mounts such as these mounted to the chassis rails?
Or would it be better to go for something like this mounted to the crossmember?
Or just keep the oil filled mounts?
The car will be a daily driver so I dont want untold amounts of vibration.
(07-16-2014, 02:04 PM)hooblah I was wondering, just how much difference do the Mercedes oil filled mounts make compared to a solid rubber mount in terms of NVH?
The Merc mounts are massive and can only be used in one way, i.e. with the engine sat on top of them.
Rubber mounts are a lot smaller and can be mounted in different positions and different places.
Do you guys reckon its possible to get away with using solid mounts such as these mounted to the chassis rails?
Or would it be better to go for something like this mounted to the crossmember?
Or just keep the oil filled mounts?
The car will be a daily driver so I dont want untold amounts of vibration.
You will gain a fair bit of vibration but it's doable if it's a sacrifice you are willing to make. If you do it then it might be an idea to beef up the chassis mount a little in case the extra vibes cause extra stress.
(07-16-2014, 02:04 PM)hooblah I was wondering, just how much difference do the Mercedes oil filled mounts make compared to a solid rubber mount in terms of NVH?
The Merc mounts are massive and can only be used in one way, i.e. with the engine sat on top of them.
Rubber mounts are a lot smaller and can be mounted in different positions and different places.
Do you guys reckon its possible to get away with using solid mounts such as these mounted to the chassis rails?
Or would it be better to go for something like this mounted to the crossmember?
Or just keep the oil filled mounts?
The car will be a daily driver so I dont want untold amounts of vibration.
You will gain a fair bit of vibration but it's doable if it's a sacrifice you are willing to make. If you do it then it might be an idea to beef up the chassis mount a little in case the extra vibes cause extra stress.
![[Image: turbo002.jpg]](http://s62.photobucket.com/user/a10ruk/media/300TD/turbo002.jpg.html)
![[Image: Cplate.jpg]](http://s62.photobucket.com/user/a10ruk/media/300TD/Cplate.jpg.html)
The engine weight compressed them by 6mm versus unloaded hence the ally spacer plate.
Remembering that an R107 SL has short hydraulic shockies above each mounting.
![[Image: feet003.jpg]](http://s62.photobucket.com/user/a10ruk/media/300TD/feet003.jpg.html)
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Mine sits on standard 500SL solid rubbers and imho there is no more NVH than if they were hydraulic.
The engine weight compressed them by 6mm versus unloaded hence the ally spacer plate.
Remembering that an R107 SL has short hydraulic shockies above each mounting.
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Not all rubber mounts are the same. The durometer of the rubber is only one factor. The thickness of the rubber and the supporting surface area come into play. I'm sure there are other things too. It's sort of a crapshoot.
What chassis/engine are you dealing with?
raysorenson
07-16-2014, 06:13 PM #4I installed one full rubber B5 VAG mount on my 124 and measured vibration with the sensor placed at the top of the B pillar as I recall. I posted some data about it somewhere on this site. The difference was slight but noticeable.
Not all rubber mounts are the same. The durometer of the rubber is only one factor. The thickness of the rubber and the supporting surface area come into play. I'm sure there are other things too. It's sort of a crapshoot.
What chassis/engine are you dealing with?
The 250 W123 has got two of them, one each side. I think the beauty of th hydraulic mounts is that they combine both supporting & dampening in one unit. On the other hand they are not very stiff and tend to allow the engine to move a bit. If you'r dealing with tight clarances, a solid rubber might be better suited.But as raysorenson allready mentioned, the properties of rubber can vary widely! Getting some of a engine with similar weight and mount spacing is probably a good call.
And a good solid rubber mount is better than a cheap hydro-mount... IIRC there are some very cheap non-hydraulic mounts about for W124s.
DiseaselWeasel
07-17-2014, 03:50 AM #5A lot of older MB engines have additional dampers on the engine mounts The 250 W123 has got two of them, one each side. I think the beauty of th hydraulic mounts is that they combine both supporting & dampening in one unit. On the other hand they are not very stiff and tend to allow the engine to move a bit. If you'r dealing with tight clarances, a solid rubber might be better suited.
But as raysorenson allready mentioned, the properties of rubber can vary widely! Getting some of a engine with similar weight and mount spacing is probably a good call.
And a good solid rubber mount is better than a cheap hydro-mount... IIRC there are some very cheap non-hydraulic mounts about for W124s.
putting a v12 m275 in a w123, so i to am looking into this, thought about the option to add two or perhaps three softer mounts per side, and getting it smooth and silent that way, the engine has quite a lot of torque, 800nm from 1800rpm and 1000nm from 2300rpm in stock, so need something that keeps the engine in the car.
any input from you guys with superturbos is higly appreciated, especially if you are aiming for a smooth ride
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
swampmonkey
07-20-2014, 06:50 PM #7highjacking thread, sorry!
putting a v12 m275 in a w123, so i to am looking into this, thought about the option to add two or perhaps three softer mounts per side, and getting it smooth and silent that way, the engine has quite a lot of torque, 800nm from 1800rpm and 1000nm from 2300rpm in stock, so need something that keeps the engine in the car.
any input from you guys with superturbos is higly appreciated, especially if you are aiming for a smooth ride
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
An example on a V8
![[Image: Engine-tie.jpg]](http://www.mgbv8.co.uk/images/tie-bar/Engine-tie.jpg)
Doesn't have to be very strong if you fit it in tension rather than compression.
Basically you brace the head or some other high part of the engine onto the body of the car via some kind of rubber mount. A few make a bracket off the bellhousing top bolts as well. Idea being it allows you to have proper engine (softer) mounts but when the power is down it stops the engine rotating. Very useful if you are tight on space.
An example on a V8
Doesn't have to be very strong if you fit it in tension rather than compression.
DiseaselWeasel
07-23-2014, 01:58 AM #12These need to be STRONG! Vibration kills the mounting brackets. Ask me how I know - I've been driving a Mini for over a decade now
dont have the rubbermounts from the v12, and the arms/mounts wont fit, to wide (btw, they were probably made for two mounts per side stock
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
swampmonkey
07-26-2014, 07:26 PM #13a head steady was already under disgussion, but two enginemounts per side, perhaps older w123 style, and then head-steady thingy is the way to go.
dont have the rubbermounts from the v12, and the arms/mounts wont fit, to wide (btw, they were probably made for two mounts per side stock
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
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