Bigger elements in OM606.962 electronic pump - is it possible?
Bigger elements in OM606.962 electronic pump - is it possible?
I know that most people change the electronic M pump for a mechanical version, but in the case of a 1998 W140 S300 Turbodiesel with OM606 engine behemonth that urgently need more horsepower, is it possible to build a superpump from an electronic version?
In this case a change for a mechanical pump would be a nightmare with all on board systems and electronic transmission...
I've been searching for this but found no conclusive answer.
I know that most people change the electronic M pump for a mechanical version, but in the case of a 1998 W140 S300 Turbodiesel with OM606 engine behemonth that urgently need more horsepower, is it possible to build a superpump from an electronic version?
In this case a change for a mechanical pump would be a nightmare with all on board systems and electronic transmission...
Newbie-read this: Cheap Tricks
617.952-220k-Getting built up
larsalan I guess I need to look at this stupid ass drip shit. What you have to like mess with those elements on the pump? What a fucking hassle. then use some wire to hold the throttle open or some shit?
Simpler=Better
07-19-2013, 10:22 AM #2It can be done, I remember reading about someone who did it once but I can't remember where. Dieselmenken is the guy to talk to, he can tell you for sure
Newbie-read this: Cheap Tricks
617.952-220k-Getting built up
larsalan I guess I need to look at this stupid ass drip shit. What you have to like mess with those elements on the pump? What a fucking hassle. then use some wire to hold the throttle open or some shit?
1983 300TD : 4 Speed : SLS Delete : More. Daily Deathcab
1987 190E/16v/OM603 : 5 Speed : SLS Delete : Lots More..W201 Project
There was that ardunio that was doing pwm controlled injection pumps it was running some vw pd engine I believe. That combined with that 722.6 gearbox controller and a built & balanced injection pump with larger elements. I don't see why it wouldn't be possible, but it's defiantly unknown territory. Unless of course you can remap the stock Ecu.
1983 300TD : 4 Speed : SLS Delete : More. Daily Deathcab
1987 190E/16v/OM603 : 5 Speed : SLS Delete : Lots More..W201 Project
Can you put bigger elements in the electric pump? Yes you can, that part of the pump is the same. The bigger question is can you get your ECU remapped/chiped to sort the fueling out?
None of the arduino stuff has ever made it past getting an engine to idle so far and most of the atempts have been dumped. In truth I am not sure if it can actually be done with an arduino as I am not sure its even fast enough to control the pump acurately
Can you put bigger elements in the electric pump? Yes you can, that part of the pump is the same. The bigger question is can you get your ECU remapped/chiped to sort the fueling out?
I'm in a similar situation with a OM606.964 pushing a 6000lb+ (often 7000lbs+) un-aerodynamic G-wagen. There are ECU mods that will push the power up to ~210hp, but the additional fuel comes in at the end of the injection period, where it is the least efficient. I could get a little bit more power with a more open exhaust manifold & bigger turbo. That is quite a bit of money for only a few HP, though fuel efficiency would also be helped.
(07-21-2013, 01:27 AM)AlanMcR(07-20-2013, 10:43 PM)aaa This can and has been done. Unfortunately the stock turbo will be in the way of getting out of the 200s in hp.Links & contacts would be greatly appreciated.
hi,
i had 7.5mm elements in my electric pump, it was a DIY job.
I had rev limit removed from ecu and fitted potiometer but couldn't get over 5500rpm so i changed to mechanical.
i didn't even get to remap stage.
here is dyno, green line is electronic pump.
by the way it was om605, c250turbo diesel
![[Image: utf-8BSU1HMDA1NDUtMjAxMTEwMTUtMTYzNS5qcGc.jpg]](http://s1213.photobucket.com/user/mantahead1/media/utf-8BSU1HMDA1NDUtMjAxMTEwMTUtMTYzNS5qcGc.jpg.html)
(07-21-2013, 01:27 AM)AlanMcR(07-20-2013, 10:43 PM)aaa This can and has been done. Unfortunately the stock turbo will be in the way of getting out of the 200s in hp.Links & contacts would be greatly appreciated.
hi,
i had 7.5mm elements in my electric pump, it was a DIY job.
I had rev limit removed from ecu and fitted potiometer but couldn't get over 5500rpm so i changed to mechanical.
i didn't even get to remap stage.
here is dyno, green line is electronic pump.
by the way it was om605, c250turbo diesel
(07-21-2013, 05:28 AM)INC It`s no problem with electrical superpump. Dieselmeken can help You. I own 3 g-wagens with electrical 7.5mm superpumps. Only thing you need is good chiptuner who can help you with right modifications in ECU.
hi,
where you able to get high rpm?
(07-21-2013, 05:31 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 05:28 AM)INC It`s no problem with electrical superpump. Dieselmeken can help You. I own 3 g-wagens with electrical 7.5mm superpumps. Only thing you need is good chiptuner who can help you with right modifications in ECU.
hi,
where you able to get high rpm?
Only 5500. In offroad we need better low end torque, not hi RPM engine
G300TD(OM606.964) & 250GD(OM605.960)Trophy raid
(07-21-2013, 05:31 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 05:28 AM)INC It`s no problem with electrical superpump. Dieselmeken can help You. I own 3 g-wagens with electrical 7.5mm superpumps. Only thing you need is good chiptuner who can help you with right modifications in ECU.
hi,
where you able to get high rpm?
Only 5500. In offroad we need better low end torque, not hi RPM engine
G300TD(OM606.964) & 250GD(OM605.960)Trophy raid
(07-21-2013, 05:33 AM)INC(07-21-2013, 05:31 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 05:28 AM)INC It`s no problem with electrical superpump. Dieselmeken can help You. I own 3 g-wagens with electrical 7.5mm superpumps. Only thing you need is good chiptuner who can help you with right modifications in ECU.
hi,
where you able to get high rpm?
Only 5500. In offroad we need better low end torque, not hi RPM engine
thanks,
i had a few guys look at it that time and they reckoned 5500rpm was the end of the scale in the ecu, maybe with some work it could all be re scaled?
(07-21-2013, 05:33 AM)INC(07-21-2013, 05:31 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 05:28 AM)INC It`s no problem with electrical superpump. Dieselmeken can help You. I own 3 g-wagens with electrical 7.5mm superpumps. Only thing you need is good chiptuner who can help you with right modifications in ECU.
hi,
where you able to get high rpm?
Only 5500. In offroad we need better low end torque, not hi RPM engine
thanks,
i had a few guys look at it that time and they reckoned 5500rpm was the end of the scale in the ecu, maybe with some work it could all be re scaled?
(07-21-2013, 05:40 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 05:33 AM)INC(07-21-2013, 05:31 AM)mantahead hi,
where you able to get high rpm?
Only 5500. In offroad we need better low end torque, not hi RPM engine
thanks,
i had a few guys look at it that time and they reckoned 5500rpm was the end of the scale in the ecu, maybe with some work it could all be re scaled?
Try to put 5 cilinder flywheel on 6 cil.engine and recalibrate idle speed
G300TD(OM606.964) & 250GD(OM605.960)Trophy raid
(07-21-2013, 05:40 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 05:33 AM)INC(07-21-2013, 05:31 AM)mantahead hi,
where you able to get high rpm?
Only 5500. In offroad we need better low end torque, not hi RPM engine
thanks,
i had a few guys look at it that time and they reckoned 5500rpm was the end of the scale in the ecu, maybe with some work it could all be re scaled?
Try to put 5 cilinder flywheel on 6 cil.engine and recalibrate idle speed
G300TD(OM606.964) & 250GD(OM605.960)Trophy raid
(07-21-2013, 06:01 AM)INCwas wondering how to trick rpm, i was using 5 cylinder at that time, that is great idea, wonder would it work on 6 cylinder?(07-21-2013, 05:40 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 05:33 AM)INC Only 5500. In offroad we need better low end torque, not hi RPM engine
thanks,
i had a few guys look at it that time and they reckoned 5500rpm was the end of the scale in the ecu, maybe with some work it could all be re scaled?
Try to put 5 cilinder flywheel un 6 cil.engine and recalibrate idle speed
(07-21-2013, 06:01 AM)INCwas wondering how to trick rpm, i was using 5 cylinder at that time, that is great idea, wonder would it work on 6 cylinder?(07-21-2013, 05:40 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 05:33 AM)INC Only 5500. In offroad we need better low end torque, not hi RPM engine
thanks,
i had a few guys look at it that time and they reckoned 5500rpm was the end of the scale in the ecu, maybe with some work it could all be re scaled?
Try to put 5 cilinder flywheel un 6 cil.engine and recalibrate idle speed
the tricky part is to control them
(07-21-2013, 05:33 AM)INC(07-21-2013, 05:31 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 05:28 AM)INC It`s no problem with electrical superpump. Dieselmeken can help You. I own 3 g-wagens with electrical 7.5mm superpumps. Only thing you need is good chiptuner who can help you with right modifications in ECU.
hi,
where you able to get high rpm?
Only 5500. In offroad we need better low end torque, not hi RPM engine
Use BMW 535dD turbo and you will have almost instant full boost at 1000rpm and you will have good bottom torque
the tricky part is to control them
(07-21-2013, 05:33 AM)INC(07-21-2013, 05:31 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 05:28 AM)INC It`s no problem with electrical superpump. Dieselmeken can help You. I own 3 g-wagens with electrical 7.5mm superpumps. Only thing you need is good chiptuner who can help you with right modifications in ECU.
hi,
where you able to get high rpm?
Only 5500. In offroad we need better low end torque, not hi RPM engine
(07-21-2013, 06:05 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 06:01 AM)INCwas wondering how to trick rpm, i was using 5 cylinder at that time, that is great idea, wonder would it work on 6 cylinder?(07-21-2013, 05:40 AM)mantahead thanks,
i had a few guys look at it that time and they reckoned 5500rpm was the end of the scale in the ecu, maybe with some work it could all be re scaled?
Try to put 5 cilinder flywheel un 6 cil.engine and recalibrate idle speed
To trick rpm you need flywheel from 1 cil. less engine. This is not CDI engine and RPM sensor is just for RPMs and not for ignition mark, becose injection timing is not conntroled by ECU. Idle speed table is not so hard find and modify in this ECU.
G300TD(OM606.964) & 250GD(OM605.960)Trophy raid
(07-21-2013, 06:05 AM)mantahead(07-21-2013, 06:01 AM)INCwas wondering how to trick rpm, i was using 5 cylinder at that time, that is great idea, wonder would it work on 6 cylinder?(07-21-2013, 05:40 AM)mantahead thanks,
i had a few guys look at it that time and they reckoned 5500rpm was the end of the scale in the ecu, maybe with some work it could all be re scaled?
Try to put 5 cilinder flywheel un 6 cil.engine and recalibrate idle speed
To trick rpm you need flywheel from 1 cil. less engine. This is not CDI engine and RPM sensor is just for RPMs and not for ignition mark, becose injection timing is not conntroled by ECU. Idle speed table is not so hard find and modify in this ECU.
G300TD(OM606.964) & 250GD(OM605.960)Trophy raid
Not a problem though I'm sure we can live with that..
Installed:
OM606/722.6, big IC, W220 brakes.
Planned:
DIY manifold, compound, 722.6 controller, built IP.
[i]Less rust.. [/i]
I have read that it will hunt for idle as the ecu constantly moves the rack to try and maintain low enough fuelling with big elements.
Not a problem though I'm sure we can live with that..
Installed:
OM606/722.6, big IC, W220 brakes.
Planned:
DIY manifold, compound, 722.6 controller, built IP.
[i]Less rust.. [/i]
(09-18-2013, 05:46 PM)Hario I have read that it will hunt for idle as the ecu constantly moves the rack to try and maintain low enough fuelling with big elements.Yes, If you just swap the elements, there is a chance if will hunt for idle, the trick is to adjust the rack position sensor so it matches the low idle as it is original. For example
Not a problem though I'm sure we can live with that..
stock element, 330rpm 7-10cc of fuel @ 2,200mw feedback Power to ecu.
If you change element you get Moore fuel at the whole range, example
7,5mm with stock setting 330rpm 14-18cc of fuel (overfuelling) @2,200mw, then ecu must take down the mw to under 2,000mw to get stabil idle =out of range = hunting.
If you adjust the feedbackpower it works OK.
It would bee nice if someone could do a software that could match the mechanical governored pumps, I Think that the EDC would be much easyer to get completly smokfree and still have 500hp in a OM606.
Wish it, Dream it, Do it.
dieselmeken
09-19-2013, 12:56 AM #18(09-18-2013, 05:46 PM)Hario I have read that it will hunt for idle as the ecu constantly moves the rack to try and maintain low enough fuelling with big elements.Yes, If you just swap the elements, there is a chance if will hunt for idle, the trick is to adjust the rack position sensor so it matches the low idle as it is original. For example
Not a problem though I'm sure we can live with that..
stock element, 330rpm 7-10cc of fuel @ 2,200mw feedback Power to ecu.
If you change element you get Moore fuel at the whole range, example
7,5mm with stock setting 330rpm 14-18cc of fuel (overfuelling) @2,200mw, then ecu must take down the mw to under 2,000mw to get stabil idle =out of range = hunting.
If you adjust the feedbackpower it works OK.
It would bee nice if someone could do a software that could match the mechanical governored pumps, I Think that the EDC would be much easyer to get completly smokfree and still have 500hp in a OM606.
Wish it, Dream it, Do it.
Do we have a resident genius who has figured out the correct VNT/VGT to replace the stock KKK turbo? I believe the EDC is already regulating boost in a tight feedback loop. So I think it would properly control a VNT (or any turbo).
A couple of years back, I instrumented the wastegate actuator and watched what the EDC did with it as I drove. The controller was very actively moving the gate position, even with the slightest change in pedal position. About the only issue (relating to regulating a VNT) that came up was that the wastegate would snap closed when I took my foot off of the throttle. I think that might provide too much braking at high RPM with a VNT. Thoughts?
The more I look at it, I am probably OK (for now) with the amount of fuel the stock pump can produce. The Gwagen will never be a race car. What I really want is more low end torque. Having less restriction at cruise (and thus more efficiency) would be great too. The stock turbo just seems like it is a poor choice.
Do we have a resident genius who has figured out the correct VNT/VGT to replace the stock KKK turbo? I believe the EDC is already regulating boost in a tight feedback loop. So I think it would properly control a VNT (or any turbo).
A couple of years back, I instrumented the wastegate actuator and watched what the EDC did with it as I drove. The controller was very actively moving the gate position, even with the slightest change in pedal position. About the only issue (relating to regulating a VNT) that came up was that the wastegate would snap closed when I took my foot off of the throttle. I think that might provide too much braking at high RPM with a VNT. Thoughts?
On VNT equipped cars there are definitions which limit the maximum closing at certain engine rpm ranges.
Example:
Complete duty cycle range for vnt control is ~20-95% but if engine rpm is higher than amount xxx it wont allow lower duty cycle than 40% if you let off throttle, thus avoiding to high EGP/EGP spikes.
Depending on ECU duty cycle is sometimes reversed, so that not 20% is max. closed and 95% is maximum open but vice versa: 80% is max. closed and 5% is maximum open.
I don't know about older models, but in W210 mercedes TD already have vacuum controlled wastegate, means that a steady vacuum keeps the wastegate closed for spoolup and starts opening (lowering vacuum) to limit boost.
This was done for emergency/limp mode reasons. No vacuum = no boost.
Mercedes Benz W210 E-Class 320CDI, lowered 2.5", 18" AMG wheels, Decat, EGR removed, Tumble flaps removed, C30 AMG injectors, 400kpa MAP, Custom GT2566XTV turbo, SW tweaked to 300+hp/750Nm
EDC15 has some parameters to define actuator position.
On VNT equipped cars there are definitions which limit the maximum closing at certain engine rpm ranges.
Example:
Complete duty cycle range for vnt control is ~20-95% but if engine rpm is higher than amount xxx it wont allow lower duty cycle than 40% if you let off throttle, thus avoiding to high EGP/EGP spikes.
Depending on ECU duty cycle is sometimes reversed, so that not 20% is max. closed and 95% is maximum open but vice versa: 80% is max. closed and 5% is maximum open.
I don't know about older models, but in W210 mercedes TD already have vacuum controlled wastegate, means that a steady vacuum keeps the wastegate closed for spoolup and starts opening (lowering vacuum) to limit boost.
This was done for emergency/limp mode reasons. No vacuum = no boost.
Mercedes Benz W210 E-Class 320CDI, lowered 2.5", 18" AMG wheels, Decat, EGR removed, Tumble flaps removed, C30 AMG injectors, 400kpa MAP, Custom GT2566XTV turbo, SW tweaked to 300+hp/750Nm
If I send my electronic pump to Dieselmeken (I have been talking with him on Facebook) to have the 7.5mm elements installed, will I be fine without a remap?
Don't forget that this is a luxury sedan. I'm not searching for ultimate power and high revs. I just want a big chunk of torque to help with pushing the 2 tons of car.
Also, Idle quality is important, as well as having a silent OM606 (no hammering)
280 to 300 bhp would be great.
Still have to check which turbo fits this purpose, also without needing a remap from the ECU.
Any help is welcome!
So any news on this subject?
If I send my electronic pump to Dieselmeken (I have been talking with him on Facebook) to have the 7.5mm elements installed, will I be fine without a remap?
Don't forget that this is a luxury sedan. I'm not searching for ultimate power and high revs. I just want a big chunk of torque to help with pushing the 2 tons of car.
Also, Idle quality is important, as well as having a silent OM606 (no hammering)
280 to 300 bhp would be great.
Still have to check which turbo fits this purpose, also without needing a remap from the ECU.
Any help is welcome!
So a remap is required, I think mainly just to increase the off boost fuelling. That is my understanding, though maybe the max-rack resistor/potentiometer mod can help here instead of a remap?
Installed:
OM606/722.6, big IC, W220 brakes.
Planned:
DIY manifold, compound, 722.6 controller, built IP.
[i]Less rust.. [/i]
The problem is this: The ecu waits for boost before it increases fuelling, and the turbo won't boost quickly without more fuel, it is a chicken and egg situation.
So a remap is required, I think mainly just to increase the off boost fuelling. That is my understanding, though maybe the max-rack resistor/potentiometer mod can help here instead of a remap?
Installed:
OM606/722.6, big IC, W220 brakes.
Planned:
DIY manifold, compound, 722.6 controller, built IP.
[i]Less rust.. [/i]
(04-09-2015, 02:38 AM)Hario The problem is this: The ecu waits for boost before it increases fuelling, and the turbo won't boost quickly without more fuel, it is a chicken and egg situation.
So a remap is required, I think mainly just to increase the off boost fuelling. That is my understanding, though maybe the max-rack resistor/potentiometer mod can help here instead of a remap?
I'm hoping this might be the case, I can't get hold of a mechanical pump and get the swap done for less than £1000 which is too much for my project. But I have found someone willing to swap the elements into the pump And Set it up, then use the resistor to up offf boost to fuel and remap on boost
(04-09-2015, 02:38 AM)Hario The problem is this: The ecu waits for boost before it increases fuelling, and the turbo won't boost quickly without more fuel, it is a chicken and egg situation.
So a remap is required, I think mainly just to increase the off boost fuelling. That is my understanding, though maybe the max-rack resistor/potentiometer mod can help here instead of a remap?
I'm hoping this might be the case, I can't get hold of a mechanical pump and get the swap done for less than £1000 which is too much for my project. But I have found someone willing to swap the elements into the pump And Set it up, then use the resistor to up offf boost to fuel and remap on boost
(04-09-2015, 02:38 AM)Hario The problem is this: The ecu waits for boost before it increases fuelling, and the turbo won't boost quickly without more fuel, it is a chicken and egg situation.
So a remap is required, I think mainly just to increase the off boost fuelling. That is my understanding, though maybe the max-rack resistor/potentiometer mod can help here instead of a remap?
Ok... but the pump will deliver more fuel off idle because of the bigger elements.
The fuel delivery slope is steeper with the 7,5mm elements than it is with the standard 6mm elements.
I have seen in youtube that Dieselmeken has a trick to avoid hunting at idle with the 8mm elements. For what I understood he adjusts the rack position so that the sensor returns the same voltage at idle as it would normally do with standard elements. Then he adjusts each element delivery to increase fueling just off idle.
Is this correct?
He also states that without a remap the fuel delivery is increased 30% with 8mm elements
Here is the video:
(04-09-2015, 02:38 AM)Hario The problem is this: The ecu waits for boost before it increases fuelling, and the turbo won't boost quickly without more fuel, it is a chicken and egg situation.
So a remap is required, I think mainly just to increase the off boost fuelling. That is my understanding, though maybe the max-rack resistor/potentiometer mod can help here instead of a remap?
Ok... but the pump will deliver more fuel off idle because of the bigger elements.
The fuel delivery slope is steeper with the 7,5mm elements than it is with the standard 6mm elements.
I have seen in youtube that Dieselmeken has a trick to avoid hunting at idle with the 8mm elements. For what I understood he adjusts the rack position so that the sensor returns the same voltage at idle as it would normally do with standard elements. Then he adjusts each element delivery to increase fueling just off idle.
Is this correct?
He also states that without a remap the fuel delivery is increased 30% with 8mm elements
Here is the video:
(04-09-2015, 04:41 AM)Rallyus(04-09-2015, 02:38 AM)Hario The problem is this: The ecu waits for boost before it increases fuelling, and the turbo won't boost quickly without more fuel, it is a chicken and egg situation.
So a remap is required, I think mainly just to increase the off boost fuelling. That is my understanding, though maybe the max-rack resistor/potentiometer mod can help here instead of a remap?
Ok... but the pump will deliver more fuel off idle because of the bigger elements.
The fuel delivery slope is steeper with the 7,5mm elements than it is with the standard 6mm elements.
I have seen in youtube that Dieselmeken has a trick to avoid hunting at idle with the 8mm elements. For what I understood he adjusts the rack position so that the sensor returns the same voltage at idle as it would normally do with standard elements. Then he adjusts each element delivery to increase fueling just off idle.
Is this correct?
He also states that without a remap the fuel delivery is increased 30% with 8mm elements
Here is the video:
No I have the low idle signal as reference and put low idle fuel after that, If not the selftest 680-4400mw will fall out of range and EDC light will come on with reduced fuel & power.
dieselmeken
04-09-2015, 06:29 AM #25(04-09-2015, 04:41 AM)Rallyus(04-09-2015, 02:38 AM)Hario The problem is this: The ecu waits for boost before it increases fuelling, and the turbo won't boost quickly without more fuel, it is a chicken and egg situation.
So a remap is required, I think mainly just to increase the off boost fuelling. That is my understanding, though maybe the max-rack resistor/potentiometer mod can help here instead of a remap?
Ok... but the pump will deliver more fuel off idle because of the bigger elements.
The fuel delivery slope is steeper with the 7,5mm elements than it is with the standard 6mm elements.
I have seen in youtube that Dieselmeken has a trick to avoid hunting at idle with the 8mm elements. For what I understood he adjusts the rack position so that the sensor returns the same voltage at idle as it would normally do with standard elements. Then he adjusts each element delivery to increase fueling just off idle.
Is this correct?
He also states that without a remap the fuel delivery is increased 30% with 8mm elements
Here is the video:
No I have the low idle signal as reference and put low idle fuel after that, If not the selftest 680-4400mw will fall out of range and EDC light will come on with reduced fuel & power.
The real question is this:
Will the pump deliver more fuel on the original ECU map?
And the second question is this:
Changing the original turbo for one slightly bigger will throw an error code? Will the ECU have problems controling boost with a different Turbo?
So Dieselmeken,
The real question is this:
Will the pump deliver more fuel on the original ECU map?
And the second question is this:
Changing the original turbo for one slightly bigger will throw an error code? Will the ECU have problems controling boost with a different Turbo?
What I want to know is how well this works. Can you install bigger elements with an adequate increase in turbo size and remap for firmer shifts and have a vehicle that drives reasonably well?
raysorenson
04-09-2015, 10:31 AM #27Rack position is the only way the ECU knows how much fuel is being delivered. Generally, bigger elements give more fuel for a given rack position than smaller ones. The answer is yes, more fuel.
What I want to know is how well this works. Can you install bigger elements with an adequate increase in turbo size and remap for firmer shifts and have a vehicle that drives reasonably well?
But the issue is a bigger turbo would have more lag of course, which is exacerbated by the ECU waiting for manifold pressure before giving more fuel, and as more fuel is needed to spool the turbo, you get the extra extra long lag situation I mentioned earlier. I didn't mention this problem occurs with bigger turbos and stock ecu tune and bigger elements in the EDC IP.
Installed:
OM606/722.6, big IC, W220 brakes.
Planned:
DIY manifold, compound, 722.6 controller, built IP.
[i]Less rust.. [/i]
Dieselmekken would reset idle position feedback value on a big element EDC pump bought from him for sure.
But the issue is a bigger turbo would have more lag of course, which is exacerbated by the ECU waiting for manifold pressure before giving more fuel, and as more fuel is needed to spool the turbo, you get the extra extra long lag situation I mentioned earlier. I didn't mention this problem occurs with bigger turbos and stock ecu tune and bigger elements in the EDC IP.
Installed:
OM606/722.6, big IC, W220 brakes.
Planned:
DIY manifold, compound, 722.6 controller, built IP.
[i]Less rust.. [/i]
(04-10-2015, 05:28 AM)Hario Dieselmekken would reset idle position feedback value on a big element EDC pump bought from him for sure.
But the issue is a bigger turbo would have more lag of course, which is exacerbated by the ECU waiting for manifold pressure before giving more fuel, and as more fuel is needed to spool the turbo, you get the extra extra long lag situation I mentioned earlier. I didn't mention this problem occurs with bigger turbos and stock ecu tune and bigger elements in the EDC IP.
I have a 0-10k pot installed on my om605, I have lowered it to around 3k and it idles like crap (not a daily so it doesn't matter) but has a serious amount of fuel low down, My turbo (h1c holset) is never ever going to spool fast on that engine regardless of pump.
But it spools much faster than it ever did before, I get a good amount of smoke off boost. For a smaller turbo it would be great.
Just need much bigger elements to pick up the work later on in the Rev range.....
(04-10-2015, 05:28 AM)Hario Dieselmekken would reset idle position feedback value on a big element EDC pump bought from him for sure.
But the issue is a bigger turbo would have more lag of course, which is exacerbated by the ECU waiting for manifold pressure before giving more fuel, and as more fuel is needed to spool the turbo, you get the extra extra long lag situation I mentioned earlier. I didn't mention this problem occurs with bigger turbos and stock ecu tune and bigger elements in the EDC IP.
I have a 0-10k pot installed on my om605, I have lowered it to around 3k and it idles like crap (not a daily so it doesn't matter) but has a serious amount of fuel low down, My turbo (h1c holset) is never ever going to spool fast on that engine regardless of pump.
But it spools much faster than it ever did before, I get a good amount of smoke off boost. For a smaller turbo it would be great.
Just need much bigger elements to pick up the work later on in the Rev range.....
PedroFerreira
04-13-2015, 01:53 PM #31com os elementos de origem e outro turbo consegues chegar facilmente aos 250cv,por isso um 2359v e uma reprogramaçao ja ficava bom...
(04-13-2015, 08:51 AM)Rallyus For a test, can anyone point where I can find information in installing a variable resistor to increase fueling a little bit?
This is called the resistor mod, I think.
It can be for a w210...
Search the forum it's been covered, easy to find
Não é assim tão simples.
Sabes quem altere os mapas nesta centralina por cá? Isto não é da nova geração que pode ser reprogramada em tempo real. Aqui tem que se retirar o chip e trocar por outro com outro mapa gravado.
Booster,
Easier said than done. Whith a search i get allot of posts that mention it, but do not explain in detail how to do it.
Pedro Ferreira,
Não é assim tão simples.
Sabes quem altere os mapas nesta centralina por cá? Isto não é da nova geração que pode ser reprogramada em tempo real. Aqui tem que se retirar o chip e trocar por outro com outro mapa gravado.
Booster,
Easier said than done. Whith a search i get allot of posts that mention it, but do not explain in detail how to do it.
PedroFerreira
04-13-2015, 06:07 PM #34qualquer casa de reprogramaçoes faz isso...num om605 ca em portugal fizeram 260cv com os elementos de origem (6mm) por isso no om606 deve fazer mais...
(04-13-2015, 05:14 PM)Rallyus Pedro Ferreira,
Não é assim tão simples.
Sabes quem altere os mapas nesta centralina por cá? Isto não é da nova geração que pode ser reprogramada em tempo real. Aqui tem que se retirar o chip e trocar por outro com outro mapa gravado.
Booster,
Easier said than done. Whith a search i get allot of posts that mention it, but do not explain in detail how to do it.
Yup after saying how easy it was I cant find it now, when I get a chance I'll take pictures of my set up so you can copy.
Won't be for a few days though.
(04-13-2015, 05:14 PM)Rallyus Pedro Ferreira,
Não é assim tão simples.
Sabes quem altere os mapas nesta centralina por cá? Isto não é da nova geração que pode ser reprogramada em tempo real. Aqui tem que se retirar o chip e trocar por outro com outro mapa gravado.
Booster,
Easier said than done. Whith a search i get allot of posts that mention it, but do not explain in detail how to do it.
Yup after saying how easy it was I cant find it now, when I get a chance I'll take pictures of my set up so you can copy.
Won't be for a few days though.
![[Image: 606IPmaxloadfuellingmodSchematic.jpg]](http://s1250.photobucket.com/user/Mercedes_Power/media/606IPmaxloadfuellingmodSchematic.jpg.html)
![[Image: ipfullfuelresistormodecuendofwiringharness.png]](http://s1250.photobucket.com/user/Mercedes_Power/media/ipfullfuelresistormodecuendofwiringharness.png.html)
I got addicted to superpumps, and after building my first w124 300td,(blast to drive , especialy on highways 140km/h and up.) i decided i want om606.
At first i wanted to put the engjne to w124. Than i decided to search for sound unmolested w210 300td, and sell my W210 270cdi.
After my father offered 1500euro for 270cdi, last weekend i looked at 3 300td, and all of them ware crap, but the 4th one had
Xsenon lights, leather, nice inside, 18 inch wheels , new tires, low suspension, great diff and gearbox, a/c climatronic, towing hook, and not too much rust. Cost only 1300 euro. I already found good hx35w turbo for 200 euro
How all i need are some pointers.
Whaat do i do to build a killer daily driver that will be a blast on a highway and economical in the city.
Im very interested in rebuilding om606 pump. If that will not be possible, or to hard i will build om603 pump and this time rev it to 6000rpm and definately more than 105ccm.
What functuality will i loose when installing om603 pump?
Gearbox will work?
Cruise controll will work?
PS.I just finished fixing p0307 error , with a toothpick next to fuse 2 in fuse box on the left side of dashboard. Made stop lights disapear. This car is easy
1999 S210 Edc pump. 7.5mm dieselmeken element.
HX35W turbo, custom map.
Brakes 330mm 4 piston brembo CL500, bolt on fit. Longer brake lines. 3mm spacers.
260km/h
2.1 boost for now.
16 inch steel wheels with 20mm spacers.
Very interesting discussion.
I got addicted to superpumps, and after building my first w124 300td,(blast to drive , especialy on highways 140km/h and up.) i decided i want om606.
At first i wanted to put the engjne to w124. Than i decided to search for sound unmolested w210 300td, and sell my W210 270cdi.
After my father offered 1500euro for 270cdi, last weekend i looked at 3 300td, and all of them ware crap, but the 4th one had
Xsenon lights, leather, nice inside, 18 inch wheels , new tires, low suspension, great diff and gearbox, a/c climatronic, towing hook, and not too much rust. Cost only 1300 euro. I already found good hx35w turbo for 200 euro
How all i need are some pointers.
Whaat do i do to build a killer daily driver that will be a blast on a highway and economical in the city.
Im very interested in rebuilding om606 pump. If that will not be possible, or to hard i will build om603 pump and this time rev it to 6000rpm and definately more than 105ccm.
What functuality will i loose when installing om603 pump?
Gearbox will work?
Cruise controll will work?
PS.I just finished fixing p0307 error , with a toothpick next to fuse 2 in fuse box on the left side of dashboard. Made stop lights disapear. This car is easy
1999 S210 Edc pump. 7.5mm dieselmeken element.
HX35W turbo, custom map.
Brakes 330mm 4 piston brembo CL500, bolt on fit. Longer brake lines. 3mm spacers.
260km/h
2.1 boost for now.
16 inch steel wheels with 20mm spacers.
(07-21-2013, 07:45 AM)Turbo Use BMW 535dD turbo and you will have almost instant full boost at 1000rpm and you will have good bottom torque
the tricky part is to control them
Are you referring to the r2s compound turbo from 2005-2008 535d? Like this one:
http://www.invasionautoproducts.com/05bmwcarkpk22.html
If so, it looks like the bypass and wastegate are completely pressure controlled. So why is it difficult to control them?
Thanks.
atypicalguy
12-26-2015, 04:51 AM #38(07-21-2013, 07:45 AM)Turbo Use BMW 535dD turbo and you will have almost instant full boost at 1000rpm and you will have good bottom torque
the tricky part is to control them
Are you referring to the r2s compound turbo from 2005-2008 535d? Like this one:
http://www.invasionautoproducts.com/05bmwcarkpk22.html
If so, it looks like the bypass and wastegate are completely pressure controlled. So why is it difficult to control them?
Thanks.
(12-26-2015, 04:51 AM)atypicalguy(07-21-2013, 07:45 AM)Turbo Use BMW 535dD turbo and you will have almost instant full boost at 1000rpm and you will have good bottom torque
the tricky part is to control them
Are you referring to the r2s compound turbo from 2005-2008 535d? Like this one:
http://www.invasionautoproducts.com/05bmwcarkpk22.html
If so, it looks like the bypass and wastegate are completely pressure controlled. So why is it difficult to control them?
Thanks.
More likely, it is all vacuum cylinder controlled. Each vacuum cylinder is driven by a computer controlled variable vacuum valve, just like the OM606 system. Behind the scenes, there is lots of software making that work.
(12-26-2015, 04:51 AM)atypicalguy(07-21-2013, 07:45 AM)Turbo Use BMW 535dD turbo and you will have almost instant full boost at 1000rpm and you will have good bottom torque
the tricky part is to control them
Are you referring to the r2s compound turbo from 2005-2008 535d? Like this one:
http://www.invasionautoproducts.com/05bmwcarkpk22.html
If so, it looks like the bypass and wastegate are completely pressure controlled. So why is it difficult to control them?
Thanks.
More likely, it is all vacuum cylinder controlled. Each vacuum cylinder is driven by a computer controlled variable vacuum valve, just like the OM606 system. Behind the scenes, there is lots of software making that work.
(12-26-2015, 04:51 AM)atypicalguy(07-21-2013, 07:45 AM)Turbo Use BMW 535dD turbo and you will have almost instant full boost at 1000rpm and you will have good bottom torque
the tricky part is to control them
Are you referring to the r2s compound turbo from 2005-2008 535d? Like this one:
http://www.invasionautoproducts.com/05bmwcarkpk22.html
If so, it looks like the bypass and wastegate are completely pressure controlled. So why is it difficult to control them?
Thanks.
Simply you need to make a map for how the two turbo shall work together, and by that you need to controll by vacuum, by pass exhaust side HP turbo, bypass compresssor side HP turbo, and waste gate LP turbo, overspeeding the HP turbo and you will bend/brake turbin shaft quite easy
If you have some good knowledge of programming and some basic understanding of turbomachiney you will solve it, but it is alot of work.
Since vacumuum operation is not only defending on RPM of the engine...
exhaust pipe spacing is not the same on BMW and mercedes (om606), and the geometry is not that good on this turbo
I use to have a bunch of these turbos, I sold every one when it come to my knowledge how sensitive HP turbo is, in configuration like it was intended to work at it hold some time, but many tuned machine have the distinct sound of a turbo out of balance... I have spoken to many about how these turbo work because trouble shouting them have puzzle may BMW technician and private persons, many wanted to change turbo since they thinks it is broken but problem was a solenoid or sensor so engine was in limp mode, and then HP turbo get bypass.
Very nice characteristics when it work, pure pain in the as... when not
Generation after 286hp vertion have a VNT controled HP turbo and latest genertion 4 cilinder machine have VNT on both HP and LP turbo, and of course then there is the tri turbo on 550d, trouble shouting that is serious stuff...
(12-26-2015, 04:51 AM)atypicalguy(07-21-2013, 07:45 AM)Turbo Use BMW 535dD turbo and you will have almost instant full boost at 1000rpm and you will have good bottom torque
the tricky part is to control them
Are you referring to the r2s compound turbo from 2005-2008 535d? Like this one:
http://www.invasionautoproducts.com/05bmwcarkpk22.html
If so, it looks like the bypass and wastegate are completely pressure controlled. So why is it difficult to control them?
Thanks.
Simply you need to make a map for how the two turbo shall work together, and by that you need to controll by vacuum, by pass exhaust side HP turbo, bypass compresssor side HP turbo, and waste gate LP turbo, overspeeding the HP turbo and you will bend/brake turbin shaft quite easy
If you have some good knowledge of programming and some basic understanding of turbomachiney you will solve it, but it is alot of work.
Since vacumuum operation is not only defending on RPM of the engine...
exhaust pipe spacing is not the same on BMW and mercedes (om606), and the geometry is not that good on this turbo
I use to have a bunch of these turbos, I sold every one when it come to my knowledge how sensitive HP turbo is, in configuration like it was intended to work at it hold some time, but many tuned machine have the distinct sound of a turbo out of balance... I have spoken to many about how these turbo work because trouble shouting them have puzzle may BMW technician and private persons, many wanted to change turbo since they thinks it is broken but problem was a solenoid or sensor so engine was in limp mode, and then HP turbo get bypass.
Very nice characteristics when it work, pure pain in the as... when not
Generation after 286hp vertion have a VNT controled HP turbo and latest genertion 4 cilinder machine have VNT on both HP and LP turbo, and of course then there is the tri turbo on 550d, trouble shouting that is serious stuff...
Sounds like I am back to designing a custom setup. Sizing the turbine housings and the compressors seems difficult, and even Alcaid had a bit of difficulty sorting it out on that Corolla of Stamsaas with the 605, so I thought these 535d compounds would be well matched. Unfortunately they are not designed for true compound operation with hp bypass on both sides requiring actuation. I prefer one wastegate only. 450-500hp is the target, with good low end response for daily driving eg boost at 150k rpm. What turbos do you think will work?
Thanks arena sorry for off topic post. Perhaps I will put this in a new thread.
atypicalguy
12-28-2015, 10:30 AM #41Thanks very much for your thoughtful reply. It is very useful.
Sounds like I am back to designing a custom setup. Sizing the turbine housings and the compressors seems difficult, and even Alcaid had a bit of difficulty sorting it out on that Corolla of Stamsaas with the 605, so I thought these 535d compounds would be well matched. Unfortunately they are not designed for true compound operation with hp bypass on both sides requiring actuation. I prefer one wastegate only. 450-500hp is the target, with good low end response for daily driving eg boost at 150k rpm. What turbos do you think will work?
Thanks arena sorry for off topic post. Perhaps I will put this in a new thread.
If you want to play around I would highly recommend borg warner match bot it is actually quite fun to see how some things will interact in the set up and with little bit knowledge even two stage is possible to evaluate, but it never becomes more accurate then the inlet conditions. even garrett turbos can quite easy be simulated. Why stamsaas set up did not work out like a really good setup I have a pretty good idea of but Petter knowledge about turbomachineryis very good but even the sun have black spots some time
it also come down to how much money you want to spend on the turbos, there are some amazing turbo out there if they are to used in a good way and I guess you and I are not interested spending half a fortune, ebay is greate sometime and then is the big thing to look for the right stuff when you know what the right stuff is.
It will soon be time to right down a thread in abc basic in thermodynamics and turbomachinery, I think it will be very useful for every boddy
may I ask what are your targets for the engine you are building?
Have in mind that BMW is a sequential setput there they work together only between 1500-2500 if I remember it correct and no intercooler is use (correct will be inter cooler not after cooler in this set up) in the 550d tri turbo there is both intercooler and after cooler. BMW is a reasonable god match for what is was made for, but the technical level on those two turbo is not that new. but is also have is down in some working conditions, new garrett LP and HP VNT will have some better response and some shortcomings will not be there in compare to bmw 535d turbo.
If you want to play around I would highly recommend borg warner match bot it is actually quite fun to see how some things will interact in the set up and with little bit knowledge even two stage is possible to evaluate, but it never becomes more accurate then the inlet conditions. even garrett turbos can quite easy be simulated. Why stamsaas set up did not work out like a really good setup I have a pretty good idea of but Petter knowledge about turbomachineryis very good but even the sun have black spots some time
it also come down to how much money you want to spend on the turbos, there are some amazing turbo out there if they are to used in a good way and I guess you and I are not interested spending half a fortune, ebay is greate sometime and then is the big thing to look for the right stuff when you know what the right stuff is.
It will soon be time to right down a thread in abc basic in thermodynamics and turbomachinery, I think it will be very useful for every boddy
may I ask what are your targets for the engine you are building?
I drive now W210 stock.
HX35W is ready in garage.
I have a friend computer geek, and we have a question.
As far as i know after i put turbo, after i put in 7,5mm from Dieselmeken, I will have to remap bosch MSA coputer, to give more fuel.
Every time new map will be needed, I will have to solder out and solder in the chip.
QUESTION:
What is we added a unit just before the IP that modifies its behaviour.
The way I see it in the pump the rack travels based on the voltage, or impulses that comes thru the plug.
The pump does not have a computer?
How is the pump driven. does anyone have a pump on the table ?
can you mesure the voltage on the pump when full fuel, and when idle, ?
Lets plug a unit between IP and the plug. and program it using usb, or bluetooth.
After that, it would be easy to max out original pump. After you add intercooler, add fuel, after you modify exhaust add fuel. After you change elements less fuel on idle,
There would me a map what voltage to give to the pump on what rpm.
Im not even sure we would have to add boost to the equation to the translator.
Would we need to connect it to some data going back to computer so it does not read errors ? or reprogram original Bosch MSA to ignore this errors ??
Ernest
PS. I want to buy exhaust manifold from om 603, to fill my hx35 to my om606 in w210
1999 S210 Edc pump. 7.5mm dieselmeken element.
HX35W turbo, custom map.
Brakes 330mm 4 piston brembo CL500, bolt on fit. Longer brake lines. 3mm spacers.
260km/h
2.1 boost for now.
16 inch steel wheels with 20mm spacers.
ok.
I drive now W210 stock.
HX35W is ready in garage.
I have a friend computer geek, and we have a question.
As far as i know after i put turbo, after i put in 7,5mm from Dieselmeken, I will have to remap bosch MSA coputer, to give more fuel.
Every time new map will be needed, I will have to solder out and solder in the chip.
QUESTION:
What is we added a unit just before the IP that modifies its behaviour.
The way I see it in the pump the rack travels based on the voltage, or impulses that comes thru the plug.
The pump does not have a computer?
How is the pump driven. does anyone have a pump on the table ?
can you mesure the voltage on the pump when full fuel, and when idle, ?
Lets plug a unit between IP and the plug. and program it using usb, or bluetooth.
After that, it would be easy to max out original pump. After you add intercooler, add fuel, after you modify exhaust add fuel. After you change elements less fuel on idle,
There would me a map what voltage to give to the pump on what rpm.
Im not even sure we would have to add boost to the equation to the translator.
Would we need to connect it to some data going back to computer so it does not read errors ? or reprogram original Bosch MSA to ignore this errors ??
Ernest
PS. I want to buy exhaust manifold from om 603, to fill my hx35 to my om606 in w210
1999 S210 Edc pump. 7.5mm dieselmeken element.
HX35W turbo, custom map.
Brakes 330mm 4 piston brembo CL500, bolt on fit. Longer brake lines. 3mm spacers.
260km/h
2.1 boost for now.
16 inch steel wheels with 20mm spacers.
To share some light about the Electronic Diesel Control. EDC thats the name of that governor apart from that is a M pump.
This governor is composed of a electroactuator (solenoid Type) wich moves the rack against a Spring. This will in no power,give shut off condition, 0 output. When feed 2.5 volt(PWM DC) will move the rack X mm, this X mm is meant to give Y output.
The other device in the governor is rack feedback, rack position sensor wich is made by a LPVR/I linear position resistor /inductance type, wich will be used by the computer (ECU ) for predetermined positions and therefore run the engine smooth. The output to the ECU from that device is , miliwats.
Two problems come to mind, one being the max voltage the ECU can generate, the other, the phisical limits of the rack position sensor compared to the range set out in the ECU.
The second is secondary cause without the right range the engine will not run smoth , nothing to do with power.
When we test this pump in bench, aplying 3.75 volt to the electroactuator, pump at 1000 RPM should flow 60 to 65cc. and the position sensor is 2000mw at 325rpm and 8 to 10cc. if not tuning is needed.
The rack can travell a lot more , till the 110cc injection position with stock element. but for that to happen about 6volt is needed, since the system is a 0 to 4.5 the ECU will not be able to provide 6volt (i belive!!! not sure).
This being said , when we change the elements to 7.5 (as exemple) the idle position (2000mw) need to be set/tuned otherwise the engine will hunt for idle. and the deceleration is of poor quality, and many other things less important like fuel consuption, emissions daddaad.
When at WOT ECU will deliver 3.75volt (if ECU stock) and this will match an increase to 110cc, more less the double of a stock element, and the RPS will deliver the right position.
Basically 1 thing have to be done after the element swap, besides the sincronization/balance and timing, RPS to 2000mw at 8 / 10cc,
and we stay with a electronic pump with all the figures of a stock one.
A 7.5mm element is able of a min of 150cc, for this to happen a means of moving the rack to max/top position need to be achieved, weather by chip , rewrite the mapps what ever is necessary.
I dont know of any by now, i simply overhaul pumps for others , i´m not messing with electronics at the moment, in a near future a complete solution will be made to happen.... till then we write and guess....
regards
FD,
Powered by tractor fuel
Mr erio...
To share some light about the Electronic Diesel Control. EDC thats the name of that governor apart from that is a M pump.
This governor is composed of a electroactuator (solenoid Type) wich moves the rack against a Spring. This will in no power,give shut off condition, 0 output. When feed 2.5 volt(PWM DC) will move the rack X mm, this X mm is meant to give Y output.
The other device in the governor is rack feedback, rack position sensor wich is made by a LPVR/I linear position resistor /inductance type, wich will be used by the computer (ECU ) for predetermined positions and therefore run the engine smooth. The output to the ECU from that device is , miliwats.
Two problems come to mind, one being the max voltage the ECU can generate, the other, the phisical limits of the rack position sensor compared to the range set out in the ECU.
The second is secondary cause without the right range the engine will not run smoth , nothing to do with power.
When we test this pump in bench, aplying 3.75 volt to the electroactuator, pump at 1000 RPM should flow 60 to 65cc. and the position sensor is 2000mw at 325rpm and 8 to 10cc. if not tuning is needed.
The rack can travell a lot more , till the 110cc injection position with stock element. but for that to happen about 6volt is needed, since the system is a 0 to 4.5 the ECU will not be able to provide 6volt (i belive!!! not sure).
This being said , when we change the elements to 7.5 (as exemple) the idle position (2000mw) need to be set/tuned otherwise the engine will hunt for idle. and the deceleration is of poor quality, and many other things less important like fuel consuption, emissions daddaad.
When at WOT ECU will deliver 3.75volt (if ECU stock) and this will match an increase to 110cc, more less the double of a stock element, and the RPS will deliver the right position.
Basically 1 thing have to be done after the element swap, besides the sincronization/balance and timing, RPS to 2000mw at 8 / 10cc,
and we stay with a electronic pump with all the figures of a stock one.
A 7.5mm element is able of a min of 150cc, for this to happen a means of moving the rack to max/top position need to be achieved, weather by chip , rewrite the mapps what ever is necessary.
I dont know of any by now, i simply overhaul pumps for others , i´m not messing with electronics at the moment, in a near future a complete solution will be made to happen.... till then we write and guess....
regards
FD,
Powered by tractor fuel
(12-31-2015, 04:24 AM)erio ok.
I drive now W210 stock.
HX35W is ready in garage.
I have a friend computer geek, and we have a question.
As far as i know after i put turbo, after i put in 7,5mm from Dieselmeken, I will have to remap bosch MSA coputer, to give more fuel.
Every time new map will be needed, I will have to solder out and solder in the chip.
QUESTION:
What is we added a unit just before the IP that modifies its behaviour.
The way I see it in the pump the rack travels based on the voltage, or impulses that comes thru the plug.
The pump does not have a computer?
How is the pump driven. does anyone have a pump on the table ?
can you mesure the voltage on the pump when full fuel, and when idle, ?
Lets plug a unit between IP and the plug. and program it using usb, or bluetooth.
After that, it would be easy to max out original pump. After you add intercooler, add fuel, after you modify exhaust add fuel. After you change elements less fuel on idle,
There would me a map what voltage to give to the pump on what rpm.
Im not even sure we would have to add boost to the equation to the translator.
Would we need to connect it to some data going back to computer so it does not read errors ? or reprogram original Bosch MSA to ignore this errors ??
Ernest
PS. I want to buy exhaust manifold from om 603, to fill my hx35 to my om606 in w210
You need is a good remap...
My W202 om605 with 7.5mm elements (EDC pump) and hx35
353cv 566nm at this video,now I have 375cv 611nm...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QX0sG30bdG0
bruno_pinho
12-31-2015, 11:54 AM #46(12-31-2015, 04:24 AM)erio ok.
I drive now W210 stock.
HX35W is ready in garage.
I have a friend computer geek, and we have a question.
As far as i know after i put turbo, after i put in 7,5mm from Dieselmeken, I will have to remap bosch MSA coputer, to give more fuel.
Every time new map will be needed, I will have to solder out and solder in the chip.
QUESTION:
What is we added a unit just before the IP that modifies its behaviour.
The way I see it in the pump the rack travels based on the voltage, or impulses that comes thru the plug.
The pump does not have a computer?
How is the pump driven. does anyone have a pump on the table ?
can you mesure the voltage on the pump when full fuel, and when idle, ?
Lets plug a unit between IP and the plug. and program it using usb, or bluetooth.
After that, it would be easy to max out original pump. After you add intercooler, add fuel, after you modify exhaust add fuel. After you change elements less fuel on idle,
There would me a map what voltage to give to the pump on what rpm.
Im not even sure we would have to add boost to the equation to the translator.
Would we need to connect it to some data going back to computer so it does not read errors ? or reprogram original Bosch MSA to ignore this errors ??
Ernest
PS. I want to buy exhaust manifold from om 603, to fill my hx35 to my om606 in w210
You need is a good remap...
My W202 om605 with 7.5mm elements (EDC pump) and hx35
353cv 566nm at this video,now I have 375cv 611nm...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QX0sG30bdG0
(12-31-2015, 12:14 PM)97e300 bruno, how did you get yours to rev so high?
Electronically only...
I have good remapper,if not the best...lool
bruno_pinho
12-31-2015, 12:53 PM #48(12-31-2015, 12:14 PM)97e300 bruno, how did you get yours to rev so high?
Electronically only...
I have good remapper,if not the best...lool
Thank you for giving me something to think about.
Dear hooblah
Are you sure om603 exh manifolf does not bolt on om606 engine? Hx35 is 4 bolts and fits on om603 manifold perfect.
I imagined om603 would do the trick.
So is there any way to easy bolt on hx35w to om606? Or custom exh manifold?
Dear Bruno.
I have guys that will modify map in my om606 hx35w in Alwernia PL.
When i mentioned that Dieselmeken mentioned guys from Portugal that already have a map, they said that they would go down 100 euro to 250 euro for remap if i bring them good starting point.
Please share contact to your guy.
Is it possible to solder socket for chip for easy removal 2nd and each next time when modifing map?
Your om605. How much ccm fuel and boost.
Or rathret how much do you recoment for a daily driver om606 hx35w 7.5 mm. With stock exhaust, intercooler, gearbox ? No burnouts. Slow driving in city and rocket full power on highway. 5500rpm high top speed accelerations only on top gears.
1999 S210 Edc pump. 7.5mm dieselmeken element.
HX35W turbo, custom map.
Brakes 330mm 4 piston brembo CL500, bolt on fit. Longer brake lines. 3mm spacers.
260km/h
2.1 boost for now.
16 inch steel wheels with 20mm spacers.
Dear barrote.
Thank you for giving me something to think about.
Dear hooblah
Are you sure om603 exh manifolf does not bolt on om606 engine? Hx35 is 4 bolts and fits on om603 manifold perfect.
I imagined om603 would do the trick.
So is there any way to easy bolt on hx35w to om606? Or custom exh manifold?
Dear Bruno.
I have guys that will modify map in my om606 hx35w in Alwernia PL.
When i mentioned that Dieselmeken mentioned guys from Portugal that already have a map, they said that they would go down 100 euro to 250 euro for remap if i bring them good starting point.
Please share contact to your guy.
Is it possible to solder socket for chip for easy removal 2nd and each next time when modifing map?
Your om605. How much ccm fuel and boost.
Or rathret how much do you recoment for a daily driver om606 hx35w 7.5 mm. With stock exhaust, intercooler, gearbox ? No burnouts. Slow driving in city and rocket full power on highway. 5500rpm high top speed accelerations only on top gears.
1999 S210 Edc pump. 7.5mm dieselmeken element.
HX35W turbo, custom map.
Brakes 330mm 4 piston brembo CL500, bolt on fit. Longer brake lines. 3mm spacers.
260km/h
2.1 boost for now.
16 inch steel wheels with 20mm spacers.
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39 Guest(s)