M75 Floyd elements
M75 Floyd elements
09-21-2009, 08:36 AM
#2
(09-21-2009, 08:27 AM)tomnik Hi,
a little progress in this project.
The prototype sample barrel just arrived for acceptance.
Tom
Are these 7.5 mm elements for M pumps?
I've asked around here and the 5 cyl M pumps can be found for about 37.5 Euros ...
Money, money, money ...
1992 Mercedes 190D 2.5 turbo 5sp manual. EGT+boost gauges. Boost controller set to ~14.5 psi. 1 1/4 turns on full load adjustment. LPG injection.
![[Image: 3803751914_8fdca63138_o.jpg]](http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3543/3803751914_8fdca63138_o.jpg)
(09-21-2009, 08:27 AM)tomnik Hi,
a little progress in this project.
The prototype sample barrel just arrived for acceptance.
Tom
Are these 7.5 mm elements for M pumps?
I've asked around here and the 5 cyl M pumps can be found for about 37.5 Euros ...
Money, money, money ...
1992 Mercedes 190D 2.5 turbo 5sp manual. EGT+boost gauges. Boost controller set to ~14.5 psi. 1 1/4 turns on full load adjustment. LPG injection.
09-23-2009, 11:37 AM
#6
1987 300D Sturmmachine
1991 300D Nearly Perfect
1985 300D Weekend/Camping/Dog car
1974 L508D Motoroam Monarch "NightMare"
OBK #42
Deni, why don't you find out how much shipping to the states would be, say zipcode 30316. I might be interested in facilitating some purchases.
1987 300D Sturmmachine
1991 300D Nearly Perfect
1985 300D Weekend/Camping/Dog car
1974 L508D Motoroam Monarch "NightMare"
OBK #42
09-23-2009, 09:00 PM
#8
(09-23-2009, 01:00 PM)brynton Would these fit an M pump from an OM605, and how about shipping to the UK, Newcastle??
Hi Bryn,
Yes these fit all the Ms. Do you have s.o. who can do the swap and adjustment? Otherwise send me the complete IP after I have discussed the cost with my bench guy over here. Shipping UK-Germany is not a big thing but the Pound is weak compared to the EUR.
Tom
(09-23-2009, 01:00 PM)brynton Would these fit an M pump from an OM605, and how about shipping to the UK, Newcastle??
Hi Bryn,
Yes these fit all the Ms. Do you have s.o. who can do the swap and adjustment? Otherwise send me the complete IP after I have discussed the cost with my bench guy over here. Shipping UK-Germany is not a big thing but the Pound is weak compared to the EUR.
Tom
11-13-2009, 04:59 PM
#11
7,5 is sweet..Why are you going for this instead of the "regular" 7mm? Have you experienced 7mm being insufficient?
If you have a thread or external link about this subject, it is greatly appreaciated.
I am also thinking of 7, but if 7,5 is better..
looking forward to see how this develops..
7,5 is sweet..
Why are you going for this instead of the "regular" 7mm? Have you experienced 7mm being insufficient?
If you have a thread or external link about this subject, it is greatly appreaciated.
I am also thinking of 7, but if 7,5 is better..
looking forward to see how this develops..
11-19-2009, 08:58 PM
#14
In addition, we will also offer the MW65 Holly element swap for the OM617 engine and it's respective MW injection pump.
This will be a complete swap of the existing elements for either the M or MW injection pumps, for the 7.5mm or 6.5mm elements respectively, ready to reinstall on your car.
Please let me know if anyone is interested in this service.
DervTuning
11-19-2009, 08:58 PM #14For anyone considering fitting the M75 Floyd elements here in the US, we now have an option, in lieu of sending our pumps to Finland, et al. I am working together with tomnik, and contracting out a shop to get the pumps on the bench for the critical element balancing, as well as governor tuning.
In addition, we will also offer the MW65 Holly element swap for the OM617 engine and it's respective MW injection pump.
This will be a complete swap of the existing elements for either the M or MW injection pumps, for the 7.5mm or 6.5mm elements respectively, ready to reinstall on your car.
Please let me know if anyone is interested in this service.
11-20-2009, 06:46 AM
#15
(11-19-2009, 08:58 PM)DervTuning For anyone considering fitting the M75 Floyd elements here in the US, we now have an option, in lieu of sending our pumps to Finland, et al. I am working together with tomnik, and contracting out a shop to get the pumps on the bench for the critical element balancing, as well as governor tuning.
In addition, we will also offer the MW65 Holly element swap for the OM617 engine and it's respective MW injection pump.
This will be a complete swap of the existing elements for either the M or MW injection pumps, for the 7.5mm or 6.5mm elements respectively, ready to reinstall on your car.
Please let me know if anyone is interested in this service.
Hey Derv,
Are you set up to balance the electronic M series pumps?
(11-19-2009, 08:58 PM)DervTuning For anyone considering fitting the M75 Floyd elements here in the US, we now have an option, in lieu of sending our pumps to Finland, et al. I am working together with tomnik, and contracting out a shop to get the pumps on the bench for the critical element balancing, as well as governor tuning.
In addition, we will also offer the MW65 Holly element swap for the OM617 engine and it's respective MW injection pump.
This will be a complete swap of the existing elements for either the M or MW injection pumps, for the 7.5mm or 6.5mm elements respectively, ready to reinstall on your car.
Please let me know if anyone is interested in this service.
Hey Derv,
Are you set up to balance the electronic M series pumps?
11-20-2009, 12:48 PM
#17
For my application, I will install the 603 pump, but the 606 will be installed with a Getrag 5MT. I can understand why you need to continue to use the 606 pump in your E300, with rack voltage manipulation.
(11-20-2009, 06:46 AM)E300TSC(11-19-2009, 08:58 PM)DervTuning For anyone considering fitting the M75 Floyd elements here in the US, we now have an option, in lieu of sending our pumps to Finland, et al. I am working together with tomnik, and contracting out a shop to get the pumps on the bench for the critical element balancing, as well as governor tuning.
In addition, we will also offer the MW65 Holly element swap for the OM617 engine and it's respective MW injection pump.
This will be a complete swap of the existing elements for either the M or MW injection pumps, for the 7.5mm or 6.5mm elements respectively, ready to reinstall on your car.
Please let me know if anyone is interested in this service.
Hey Derv,
Are you set up to balance the electronic M series pumps?
DervTuning
11-20-2009, 12:48 PM #17E300TSC, if you have a chance, could you please let me know of the bosch pump number? I have this same pump, but not with me at the moment.
For my application, I will install the 603 pump, but the 606 will be installed with a Getrag 5MT. I can understand why you need to continue to use the 606 pump in your E300, with rack voltage manipulation.
(11-20-2009, 06:46 AM)E300TSC(11-19-2009, 08:58 PM)DervTuning For anyone considering fitting the M75 Floyd elements here in the US, we now have an option, in lieu of sending our pumps to Finland, et al. I am working together with tomnik, and contracting out a shop to get the pumps on the bench for the critical element balancing, as well as governor tuning.
In addition, we will also offer the MW65 Holly element swap for the OM617 engine and it's respective MW injection pump.
This will be a complete swap of the existing elements for either the M or MW injection pumps, for the 7.5mm or 6.5mm elements respectively, ready to reinstall on your car.
Please let me know if anyone is interested in this service.
Hey Derv,
Are you set up to balance the electronic M series pumps?
11-25-2009, 12:10 AM
#19
(11-21-2009, 12:51 AM)kmaser I would be interested in the MW65 elements for the 617a MW pump, what is the cost ?
Thanks
ditto
GREASY_BEAST
11-25-2009, 12:10 AM #19(11-21-2009, 12:51 AM)kmaser I would be interested in the MW65 elements for the 617a MW pump, what is the cost ?
Thanks
ditto
12-16-2009, 04:32 PM
#23
(11-19-2009, 08:58 PM)DervTuning For anyone considering fitting the M75 Floyd elements here in the US, we now have an option, in lieu of sending our pumps to Finland, et al. I am working together with tomnik, and contracting out a shop to get the pumps on the bench for the critical element balancing, as well as governor tuning.
In addition, we will also offer the MW65 Holly element swap for the OM617 engine and it's respective MW injection pump.
This will be a complete swap of the existing elements for either the M or MW injection pumps, for the 7.5mm or 6.5mm elements respectively, ready to reinstall on your car.
Please let me know if anyone is interested in this service.
Definitely interested!!!
1981 300SD 230k miles "Gently Modified" Daily Driver
1999 F-250 7.3L Power Stroke 150k miles "The Usual Mods" Tow Rig
1981 300SD 190k miles "Heavily Modified"
GONE
DrewGerhan
12-16-2009, 04:32 PM #23(11-19-2009, 08:58 PM)DervTuning For anyone considering fitting the M75 Floyd elements here in the US, we now have an option, in lieu of sending our pumps to Finland, et al. I am working together with tomnik, and contracting out a shop to get the pumps on the bench for the critical element balancing, as well as governor tuning.
In addition, we will also offer the MW65 Holly element swap for the OM617 engine and it's respective MW injection pump.
This will be a complete swap of the existing elements for either the M or MW injection pumps, for the 7.5mm or 6.5mm elements respectively, ready to reinstall on your car.
Please let me know if anyone is interested in this service.
Definitely interested!!!
1981 300SD 230k miles "Gently Modified" Daily Driver
1999 F-250 7.3L Power Stroke 150k miles "The Usual Mods" Tow Rig
1981 300SD 190k miles "Heavily Modified"
GONE
12-18-2009, 02:42 AM
#24
the very first and fast set up of the M75 Floyd elements showed a perfect idle quantity (in this case 9.5 ccm/1000) without measurable differences between the cylinders and resulting in +- one ccm/1000 difference in the 80 ccm/1000 range where I want this IP adjusted to.
Max. quantity (within the operation range of the IP) is about 140-150 ccm/1000.
This set up was without any fine adjustment, just a fast job and shows the (expected) quality of the elements.
With the production I am still in the acceptance series, so the available quantity is limited right now.
Against my plan to give some elements with my colleague this weekend he told me that he has already over load. But I try to have the parcel in the US before X-mas.
(besides Evan) Who will be in for one single set of 5 or 6 M75 elements shipped next week to Virginia for the cost of 60 EUR/piece + 15 EUR (shared shipping cost) to be paid to my colleague in Virginia.
It would make sense that the one who takes this set install it some when soon in an already modified car and report the results and not for a far future project just to have it.
The manufacturer is waiting for my o.k. to start the production run (200 pieces) and I have to pay in advance!
Tom
Edit: No more M75 Floyd elements available (out of the pre series). Let's wait for the results of the lab rats. Tom
This post was last modified: 12-18-2009, 03:24 PM by tomnik.
First bench data:
the very first and fast set up of the M75 Floyd elements showed a perfect idle quantity (in this case 9.5 ccm/1000) without measurable differences between the cylinders and resulting in +- one ccm/1000 difference in the 80 ccm/1000 range where I want this IP adjusted to.
Max. quantity (within the operation range of the IP) is about 140-150 ccm/1000.
This set up was without any fine adjustment, just a fast job and shows the (expected) quality of the elements.
With the production I am still in the acceptance series, so the available quantity is limited right now.
Against my plan to give some elements with my colleague this weekend he told me that he has already over load. But I try to have the parcel in the US before X-mas.
(besides Evan) Who will be in for one single set of 5 or 6 M75 elements shipped next week to Virginia for the cost of 60 EUR/piece + 15 EUR (shared shipping cost) to be paid to my colleague in Virginia.
It would make sense that the one who takes this set install it some when soon in an already modified car and report the results and not for a far future project just to have it.
The manufacturer is waiting for my o.k. to start the production run (200 pieces) and I have to pay in advance!
Tom
Edit: No more M75 Floyd elements available (out of the pre series). Let's wait for the results of the lab rats. Tom
12-18-2009, 10:20 AM
#25
I just have to learn how to keep my foot off the pedal!
I will also volunteer to handle any US shipping of other parts so Peter doesn't have to deal with it.
This post was last modified: 12-18-2009, 10:22 AM by E300TSC.
1998 MB E300 - 194,000 miles. Current/future mods: 7.5mm pump elements, Holset HX40 Turbo feeding Eaton M90 supercharger through custom fabbed intake system. Aeroturbine muffler, scratch-built 4" stainless exhaust. EGR eliminated, ECM recalibrated, modified rack position feedback circuit. Porterfield RS brake pads, Bilstein sport shocks, VDO EGT, oil and boost gauges.
2000 Ford F250 - 150,000 miles. Current/future mods: DP Tuner 3 map chip, scratch-built high flow intake, high output IDM, open circuit fuel system, ball bearing turbo, South Bend full metal clutch, slotted and drilled rotors. Autometer Sport Comp EGT and boost gauges.
Tom, I'll work with your associates in MD to get the elements installed as soon as they're ready. For now, I'll just run stock induction and asess drivability.
I just have to learn how to keep my foot off the pedal!
I will also volunteer to handle any US shipping of other parts so Peter doesn't have to deal with it.
1998 MB E300 - 194,000 miles. Current/future mods: 7.5mm pump elements, Holset HX40 Turbo feeding Eaton M90 supercharger through custom fabbed intake system. Aeroturbine muffler, scratch-built 4" stainless exhaust. EGR eliminated, ECM recalibrated, modified rack position feedback circuit. Porterfield RS brake pads, Bilstein sport shocks, VDO EGT, oil and boost gauges.
2000 Ford F250 - 150,000 miles. Current/future mods: DP Tuner 3 map chip, scratch-built high flow intake, high output IDM, open circuit fuel system, ball bearing turbo, South Bend full metal clutch, slotted and drilled rotors. Autometer Sport Comp EGT and boost gauges.
12-24-2009, 10:12 AM
#26
I'm working on a 603 pump with 6mm elements installed, which should be good for ~200hp or so (maybe a bit more). I wonder what kind of power would be generated with the 7.5mm elements.
Dave M.
Boise, ID, USA
1997 E420 - 149kmi (Bugeyes)
1994 E420 - 136kmi (Blondie)
1994 E500 - 116kmi (Q-ship)
1992 500E - 179kmi (Mach 5)
1987 300D - 330kmi (Sportline Stage 2)
Click here for my website!
What is the specific advantage of the 7.5mm Floyd elements, compared with the 7.0mm Myna elements? Is it strictly more fuel, or are there other benefits? Also, what is the approximate cost per element, shipped to the USA?
I'm working on a 603 pump with 6mm elements installed, which should be good for ~200hp or so (maybe a bit more). I wonder what kind of power would be generated with the 7.5mm elements.
Dave M.
Boise, ID, USA
1997 E420 - 149kmi (Bugeyes)
1994 E420 - 136kmi (Blondie)
1994 E500 - 116kmi (Q-ship)
1992 500E - 179kmi (Mach 5)
1987 300D - 330kmi (Sportline Stage 2)
Click here for my website!
12-24-2009, 03:25 PM
#27
(12-24-2009, 10:12 AM)gsxr What is the specific advantage of the 7.5mm Floyd elements, compared with the 7.0mm Myna elements? Is it strictly more fuel, or are there other benefits? Also, what is the approximate cost per element, shipped to the USA?
I'm working on a 603 pump with 6mm elements installed, which should be good for ~200hp or so (maybe a bit more). I wonder what kind of power would be generated with the 7.5mm elements.
2 main things:
all after market 7 mm elements I tried failed in quality. I also have original Bosch 7 mm elements but they are different in the fuel port diameter.
The result is that the IP can not be adjusted according to Bosch specs, the tolerances especially in balancing are far far away from acceptable (at least for me) but also geometrical issues resulting in disorientation of the barrel and the plunger will snap out of the control rod "shoe".
The average price of those are about 40-45 EUR/piece.
these elements are made for a different IP with different cam profile.
The results of that is that the end of injection is too late when you want to achieve quantities in the 100 ccm/1000 range. The Floyd elements are calculated for this and on top for a governor setting that allows the governor to operate in its range.
This is btw. what causes delay for recalculation and prove on the bench.
The price for them is 60 EUR/piece + 30 EUR shipping to the US, which could be shared, + money transfer fees (this is not sure for now how I will handle this for the future).
Right now one test set is installed here and we still fight with best settings. Two sets are going to the US for the same purpose.
When everything is o.k. the 200 piece production run will start.
Merry X-mas,
Tom
(12-24-2009, 10:12 AM)gsxr What is the specific advantage of the 7.5mm Floyd elements, compared with the 7.0mm Myna elements? Is it strictly more fuel, or are there other benefits? Also, what is the approximate cost per element, shipped to the USA?
I'm working on a 603 pump with 6mm elements installed, which should be good for ~200hp or so (maybe a bit more). I wonder what kind of power would be generated with the 7.5mm elements.
2 main things:
all after market 7 mm elements I tried failed in quality. I also have original Bosch 7 mm elements but they are different in the fuel port diameter.
The result is that the IP can not be adjusted according to Bosch specs, the tolerances especially in balancing are far far away from acceptable (at least for me) but also geometrical issues resulting in disorientation of the barrel and the plunger will snap out of the control rod "shoe".
The average price of those are about 40-45 EUR/piece.
these elements are made for a different IP with different cam profile.
The results of that is that the end of injection is too late when you want to achieve quantities in the 100 ccm/1000 range. The Floyd elements are calculated for this and on top for a governor setting that allows the governor to operate in its range.
This is btw. what causes delay for recalculation and prove on the bench.
The price for them is 60 EUR/piece + 30 EUR shipping to the US, which could be shared, + money transfer fees (this is not sure for now how I will handle this for the future).
Right now one test set is installed here and we still fight with best settings. Two sets are going to the US for the same purpose.
When everything is o.k. the 200 piece production run will start.
Merry X-mas,
Tom
12-24-2009, 04:00 PM
#28
If the "lab rats" turn up good results, I would be very interested in a set of these, as long as I can get a US shop to properly set up the pump on a Bosch calibration bench. Thanks again for all the info!
This post was last modified: 12-24-2009, 04:00 PM by gsxr.
Tom, that is very intriguing. Will these elements work in a stock 1987 OM603 injection pump, or does the pump require modifications (different cam, modified governor, etc)? Or is a different 603 pump required as a donor? This is the tag from the pump I have now.
If the "lab rats" turn up good results, I would be very interested in a set of these, as long as I can get a US shop to properly set up the pump on a Bosch calibration bench. Thanks again for all the info!
12-24-2009, 04:22 PM
#29
David (Dervtuning) will care about the swap and set up in the US and you can be sure that it will be done properly. We currently work on custom instruction for the Floyd elements set up.
Tom
I will check the instruction for your IP but it will work on any 60x turbo-IP.
David (Dervtuning) will care about the swap and set up in the US and you can be sure that it will be done properly. We currently work on custom instruction for the Floyd elements set up.
Tom
12-24-2009, 05:23 PM
#30
We will take care of the swap and all the necessary adjustments whilst the pump is on the bench. This includes the element to element delivery adjustments, as well as the governor settings. You would simply send in your pump, and after a short turnaround time, reinstall the pump
and you are good to go. Upcoming results will be posted
(12-24-2009, 04:00 PM)gsxr Tom, that is very intriguing. Will these elements work in a stock 1987 OM603 injection pump, or does the pump require modifications (different cam, modified governor, etc)? Or is a different 603 pump required as a donor? This is the tag from the pump I have now.
If the "lab rats" turn up good results, I would be very interested in a set of these, as long as I can get a US shop to properly set up the pump on a Bosch calibration bench. Thanks again for all the info!
DervTuning
12-24-2009, 05:23 PM #30The M75 Floyd elements were designed specifically for the M pumps that Mercedes uses, and will work directly with the OM603 pump. The governor settings do need to be adjusted accordingly, but all the hardware (save for the element swap) will work.
We will take care of the swap and all the necessary adjustments whilst the pump is on the bench. This includes the element to element delivery adjustments, as well as the governor settings. You would simply send in your pump, and after a short turnaround time, reinstall the pump and you are good to go.
Upcoming results will be posted
(12-24-2009, 04:00 PM)gsxr Tom, that is very intriguing. Will these elements work in a stock 1987 OM603 injection pump, or does the pump require modifications (different cam, modified governor, etc)? Or is a different 603 pump required as a donor? This is the tag from the pump I have now.
If the "lab rats" turn up good results, I would be very interested in a set of these, as long as I can get a US shop to properly set up the pump on a Bosch calibration bench. Thanks again for all the info!
12-31-2009, 12:32 PM
#31
(11-25-2009, 12:10 AM)GREASY_BEAST(11-21-2009, 12:51 AM)kmaser I would be interested in the MW65 elements for the 617a MW pump, what is the cost ?
Thanks
ditto
Me three.
leadphinger
12-31-2009, 12:32 PM #31(11-25-2009, 12:10 AM)GREASY_BEAST(11-21-2009, 12:51 AM)kmaser I would be interested in the MW65 elements for the 617a MW pump, what is the cost ?
Thanks
ditto
Me three.
01-01-2010, 09:31 AM
#33
Tom
(12-31-2009, 03:21 PM)Jtn190D Derv so what your saying is that i could send you the pump and you would install them and then set everything up right then send it back to me for install, and i would not have to mess with any thing?
Either you tell what max. quantity you want to have adjusted or you might have to turn the full load screw to adapt quantity to your individual engine set up.
Tom
(12-31-2009, 03:21 PM)Jtn190D Derv so what your saying is that i could send you the pump and you would install them and then set everything up right then send it back to me for install, and i would not have to mess with any thing?
01-01-2010, 11:45 PM
#40
(01-01-2010, 06:55 PM)Jtn190D Will there be any power improvements running stock turbo?
not tested yet. All other mods came first then we ran out of fuel.
But in theory regarding the shorter spray time (end of delivery much earlier) there must be some advantages in efficiency and power.
In my opinion only the Floyd mod leaving other stuff stock is too expensive but as a first step possible and at a certain grade necessary as soon as air supply is sufficient.
The Floyd elements will fit the M IP, not MW.
Tom
(01-01-2010, 06:55 PM)Jtn190D Will there be any power improvements running stock turbo?
not tested yet. All other mods came first then we ran out of fuel.
But in theory regarding the shorter spray time (end of delivery much earlier) there must be some advantages in efficiency and power.
In my opinion only the Floyd mod leaving other stuff stock is too expensive but as a first step possible and at a certain grade necessary as soon as air supply is sufficient.
The Floyd elements will fit the M IP, not MW.
Tom
01-02-2010, 01:58 PM
#41
Indeed, depending on the fuel quantity desired, the pump can be set up accordingly to your needs.
(01-01-2010, 09:31 AM)tomnik Either you tell what max. quantity you want to have adjusted or you might have to turn the full load screw to adapt quantity to your individual engine set up.
Tom
(12-31-2009, 03:21 PM)Jtn190D Derv so what your saying is that i could send you the pump and you would install them and then set everything up right then send it back to me for install, and i would not have to mess with any thing?
DervTuning
01-02-2010, 01:58 PM #41Jtn190D, yes, in combination with Tom's answer, that is correct. It is a straightforward process
Indeed, depending on the fuel quantity desired, the pump can be set up accordingly to your needs.
(01-01-2010, 09:31 AM)tomnik Either you tell what max. quantity you want to have adjusted or you might have to turn the full load screw to adapt quantity to your individual engine set up.
Tom
(12-31-2009, 03:21 PM)Jtn190D Derv so what your saying is that i could send you the pump and you would install them and then set everything up right then send it back to me for install, and i would not have to mess with any thing?
01-04-2010, 12:26 PM
#43
(11-20-2009, 12:48 PM)DervTuning E300TSC, if you have a chance, could you please let me know of the bosch pump number?
To answer the question back in post #17... the electronic OM606 pump used in the 606.912 non-turbo (96-97 E300) is Bosch # 0-400-196-002, this pump has 5.5mm elements.
The pump used in the 606.962 turbo engine (98-99 E300 Turbo) is Bosch # 0-400-196-003, this pump has 6.0mm elements.
Detailed photos of both of these pumps (including some pics of the electronic "governor" ass'y) are on my website at this link.
This post was last modified: 01-04-2010, 12:39 PM by gsxr.
Dave M.
Boise, ID, USA
1997 E420 - 149kmi (Bugeyes)
1994 E420 - 136kmi (Blondie)
1994 E500 - 116kmi (Q-ship)
1992 500E - 179kmi (Mach 5)
1987 300D - 330kmi (Sportline Stage 2)
Click here for my website!
(11-20-2009, 12:48 PM)DervTuning E300TSC, if you have a chance, could you please let me know of the bosch pump number?
To answer the question back in post #17... the electronic OM606 pump used in the 606.912 non-turbo (96-97 E300) is Bosch # 0-400-196-002, this pump has 5.5mm elements.
The pump used in the 606.962 turbo engine (98-99 E300 Turbo) is Bosch # 0-400-196-003, this pump has 6.0mm elements.
Detailed photos of both of these pumps (including some pics of the electronic "governor" ass'y) are on my website at this link.
Dave M.
Boise, ID, USA
1997 E420 - 149kmi (Bugeyes)
1994 E420 - 136kmi (Blondie)
1994 E500 - 116kmi (Q-ship)
1992 500E - 179kmi (Mach 5)
1987 300D - 330kmi (Sportline Stage 2)
Click here for my website!
01-04-2010, 03:38 PM
#44
(01-04-2010, 12:26 PM)gsxr To answer the question back in post #17... the electronic OM606 pump used in the 606.912 non-turbo (96-97 E300) is Bosch # 0-400-196-002, this pump has 5.5mm elements.
The pump used in the 606.962 turbo engine (98-99 E300 Turbo) is Bosch # 0-400-196-003, this pump has 6.0mm elements.
Detailed photos of both of these pumps (including some pics of the electronic "governor" ass'y) are on my website at this link.
Get yours swapped yet?
1987 300D Sturmmachine
1991 300D Nearly Perfect
1985 300D Weekend/Camping/Dog car
1974 L508D Motoroam Monarch "NightMare"
OBK #42
(01-04-2010, 12:26 PM)gsxr To answer the question back in post #17... the electronic OM606 pump used in the 606.912 non-turbo (96-97 E300) is Bosch # 0-400-196-002, this pump has 5.5mm elements.
The pump used in the 606.962 turbo engine (98-99 E300 Turbo) is Bosch # 0-400-196-003, this pump has 6.0mm elements.
Detailed photos of both of these pumps (including some pics of the electronic "governor" ass'y) are on my website at this link.
Get yours swapped yet?
1987 300D Sturmmachine
1991 300D Nearly Perfect
1985 300D Weekend/Camping/Dog car
1974 L508D Motoroam Monarch "NightMare"
OBK #42
01-05-2010, 11:27 AM
#45
(01-04-2010, 03:38 PM)winmutt Get yours swapped yet?Nope. I am still waiting for the 6mm pump to be completed, then shipped to me, so I can install it in my car. Hopefully it will show up within the next couple of months. I am very curious what kind of power it will make. I've got baseline test data from 0-100mph with a stock pump and maxed-out stock pump, along with dyno runs on the maxed-out pump, so I should be able to tell exactly what the improvement is with the 6mm pump.
(01-04-2010, 03:38 PM)winmutt Get yours swapped yet?Nope. I am still waiting for the 6mm pump to be completed, then shipped to me, so I can install it in my car. Hopefully it will show up within the next couple of months. I am very curious what kind of power it will make. I've got baseline test data from 0-100mph with a stock pump and maxed-out stock pump, along with dyno runs on the maxed-out pump, so I should be able to tell exactly what the improvement is with the 6mm pump.
squirrelmaster
01-21-2010, 07:37 PM #46So what is the price tag to buy and have you guys setup a pump with the m75 elements?
[edited for ridiculous use of cap lock]
01-23-2010, 01:26 PM
#47
one element is 60 EUR.
The final cost for the swap and adjustments will be more clear after the first IP is done.
Tom
(01-21-2010, 07:37 PM)squirrelmaster So what is the price tag to buy and have you guys setup a pump with the m75 elements?
[edited for ridiculous use of cap lock]
01-23-2010, 08:24 PM
#48
(01-05-2010, 11:27 AM)gsxr(01-04-2010, 03:38 PM)winmutt Get yours swapped yet?I've got baseline test data from 0-100mph with a stock pump and maxed-out stock pump, along with dyno runs on the maxed-out pump, so I should be able to tell exactly what the improvement is with the 6mm pump.
How much of an improvement did you see between stock and a maxed-out stock pump on the 0-100 acceleration? I have yet to touch mine.. other things to attend to as of yet.. still I am curious how much 25 or so HP makes
(01-05-2010, 11:27 AM)gsxr(01-04-2010, 03:38 PM)winmutt Get yours swapped yet?I've got baseline test data from 0-100mph with a stock pump and maxed-out stock pump, along with dyno runs on the maxed-out pump, so I should be able to tell exactly what the improvement is with the 6mm pump.
How much of an improvement did you see between stock and a maxed-out stock pump on the 0-100 acceleration? I have yet to touch mine.. other things to attend to as of yet.. still I am curious how much 25 or so HP makes
01-23-2010, 08:48 PM
#49
(01-23-2010, 08:24 PM)Jdmills How much of an improvement did you see between stock and a maxed-out stock pump on the 0-100 acceleration? I have yet to touch mine.. other things to attend to as of yet.. still I am curious how much 25 or so HP makesI was able to compare a freshly rebuilt & calibrated pump, and then a different pump that was maxed out. The difference was significant... the stock pump was about 38-40 seconds from 0-100mph, while the maxed out pump dropped that to about 30 seconds. Interestingly, the 0-60 times were not as radically different... 10.7 stock, 9.2 maxed out.
The difference really depends on how much fuel your pump is currently delivering, and if any previous owner or shop had tweaked the full load (or ALDA) settings. Based on my experiements, and Casey's, if you're fairly sure the pump is virgin, turn 2f and 2b a total of 1.5 turns, and re-adjust all external linkages. (That is, assuming you have an OM60x engine - can't help you with an OM61x).
If/when I eventually get that pump built with the 6mm elements, I'm hoping for a 0-100 time of 25 seconds, as compared to the current best of ~30 seconds. That time (25 sec) would equal the performance of my old 1986 300E. I'd like it to get closer to 20 but I'm pretty sure that would require larger elements than the 6.0's, especially with the low-BTU crap fuel we get here now.
This post was last modified: 01-23-2010, 08:49 PM by gsxr.
Dave M.
Boise, ID, USA
1997 E420 - 149kmi (Bugeyes)
1994 E420 - 136kmi (Blondie)
1994 E500 - 116kmi (Q-ship)
1992 500E - 179kmi (Mach 5)
1987 300D - 330kmi (Sportline Stage 2)
Click here for my website!
(01-23-2010, 08:24 PM)Jdmills How much of an improvement did you see between stock and a maxed-out stock pump on the 0-100 acceleration? I have yet to touch mine.. other things to attend to as of yet.. still I am curious how much 25 or so HP makesI was able to compare a freshly rebuilt & calibrated pump, and then a different pump that was maxed out. The difference was significant... the stock pump was about 38-40 seconds from 0-100mph, while the maxed out pump dropped that to about 30 seconds. Interestingly, the 0-60 times were not as radically different... 10.7 stock, 9.2 maxed out.
The difference really depends on how much fuel your pump is currently delivering, and if any previous owner or shop had tweaked the full load (or ALDA) settings. Based on my experiements, and Casey's, if you're fairly sure the pump is virgin, turn 2f and 2b a total of 1.5 turns, and re-adjust all external linkages. (That is, assuming you have an OM60x engine - can't help you with an OM61x).
If/when I eventually get that pump built with the 6mm elements, I'm hoping for a 0-100 time of 25 seconds, as compared to the current best of ~30 seconds. That time (25 sec) would equal the performance of my old 1986 300E. I'd like it to get closer to 20 but I'm pretty sure that would require larger elements than the 6.0's, especially with the low-BTU crap fuel we get here now.
Dave M.
Boise, ID, USA
1997 E420 - 149kmi (Bugeyes)
1994 E420 - 136kmi (Blondie)
1994 E500 - 116kmi (Q-ship)
1992 500E - 179kmi (Mach 5)
1987 300D - 330kmi (Sportline Stage 2)
Click here for my website!
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