OM603 rebuilt engine
OM603 rebuilt engine
One important thing I'd like to note is that my dad has a 94 S350 OM603 3.5L. Same car and same engine obviously, except his redline is 4,750 while mine is only 4,250. Anyone know why that is?
Also, I'm thinking about upgrading the engine for more power. I have an HX40 lying around and I'm thinking maybe 8mm elements for the IP. The problem is that I won't try to push more power out of the 603 if it doesn't have the stronger rods. If it does though, I'd also like to know how much RPM these engines can take, because 4,250 is a bit low for me.
Anyone wanna give their insight?
So I have a 93 300SD OM603 3.5L... how can I tell if this engine was rebuilt with the stronger rods?
One important thing I'd like to note is that my dad has a 94 S350 OM603 3.5L. Same car and same engine obviously, except his redline is 4,750 while mine is only 4,250. Anyone know why that is?
Also, I'm thinking about upgrading the engine for more power. I have an HX40 lying around and I'm thinking maybe 8mm elements for the IP. The problem is that I won't try to push more power out of the 603 if it doesn't have the stronger rods. If it does though, I'd also like to know how much RPM these engines can take, because 4,250 is a bit low for me.
Anyone wanna give their insight?
1978 300D, 373,000km... OM617.912 with a Holset HX30W, 7.5mm IP, 711.113 5 speed (project car, 7 years off the road and counting ;/)
1977 250 270,000km (parts car)
1977 300D (ex 280) 500,000km
1981 240D 498,000
1975 HJ45 ???,000
2001 2.8TD Rodeo 4x2 - 456,000 - DD
The rebuilt engines had a tag on the rear right of the block I think...
1978 300D, 373,000km... OM617.912 with a Holset HX30W, 7.5mm IP, 711.113 5 speed (project car, 7 years off the road and counting ;/)
1977 250 270,000km (parts car)
1977 300D (ex 280) 500,000km
1981 240D 498,000
1975 HJ45 ???,000
2001 2.8TD Rodeo 4x2 - 456,000 - DD
Also, even though I'm not asking the engine to rev all that much, I still need to know if that engine (being the rebuilt one) can take this kind of power/RPM without causing trouble.
I also plan to throw in either a 722.6 or a manual transmission (don't know which one) but either way, I will probably only do that after the 722.3 in it breaks, which I know it will for the kind of torque I'm going to be pushing. Reckless, I know, but it'll be a fun learning experience. So you're saying I'd need to raise the governor on the transmission too? Any instructions on that?
Also, as for the tag - is there anything else I should look for to be able to tell if it's the rebuild? Anybody have any pictures or anything
I plan to set my governor on the IP to limit the revs to 5,500 and have peak HP at 5,250, and I probably won't ever rev past 5,250 anyway. This is more of a low end torque build than a high end horsepower build.
Also, even though I'm not asking the engine to rev all that much, I still need to know if that engine (being the rebuilt one) can take this kind of power/RPM without causing trouble.
I also plan to throw in either a 722.6 or a manual transmission (don't know which one) but either way, I will probably only do that after the 722.3 in it breaks, which I know it will for the kind of torque I'm going to be pushing. Reckless, I know, but it'll be a fun learning experience. So you're saying I'd need to raise the governor on the transmission too? Any instructions on that?
Also, as for the tag - is there anything else I should look for to be able to tell if it's the rebuild? Anybody have any pictures or anything
Sorry if what i about to say will disapoint u.
The governor in your pump , most probably is max idle at 2600, being a 2 valve D35 engine , i u want i can see that in bosch specs , just need the pump number. Wich means that the governor will have complete cut off at 5200RPM. that does not mean it can´t be set to deliver full output at 5.2k, is just a question of springs and turns....
The 4 valve engines wich i´m more familiar with, tend to have peak tq from 2.5 to 4.5 being most noticeable at 3.5 to 4k. the 2 valve might have lower numbers for peak tq.
i used to run one N/A as std 3bar 150cc for long time , nothing hapened to it, usually was the trans that broke at least 3 times. that engine is like any other, it will handle till it quits , but sure u have to reconsider your goals to be inside a feasible margin. A 8mm pump 150cc and peak torq 3.5k and u can squeze 2 bar inlet press, and watch out EGT´s and EGP´s, maybe u can achieve 400hp wich will last longuer .
BTW this 3.5 engines are low tq engines , or they were meant to be.
regards
Get us posted
FD,
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HY,
Sorry if what i about to say will disapoint u.
The governor in your pump , most probably is max idle at 2600, being a 2 valve D35 engine , i u want i can see that in bosch specs , just need the pump number. Wich means that the governor will have complete cut off at 5200RPM. that does not mean it can´t be set to deliver full output at 5.2k, is just a question of springs and turns....
The 4 valve engines wich i´m more familiar with, tend to have peak tq from 2.5 to 4.5 being most noticeable at 3.5 to 4k. the 2 valve might have lower numbers for peak tq.
i used to run one N/A as std 3bar 150cc for long time , nothing hapened to it, usually was the trans that broke at least 3 times. that engine is like any other, it will handle till it quits , but sure u have to reconsider your goals to be inside a feasible margin. A 8mm pump 150cc and peak torq 3.5k and u can squeze 2 bar inlet press, and watch out EGT´s and EGP´s, maybe u can achieve 400hp wich will last longuer .
BTW this 3.5 engines are low tq engines , or they were meant to be.
regards
Get us posted
FD,
Powered by tractor fuel
They ask what I would like the governor set to, as well as preferred CC and outside injection control - I could use some help on deciding what would be the best for these two questions as well.
But anyway, having peak torque at a relatively low RPM Is my goal.
@barrote Oh, well I'm actually going to buy a completely rebuilt pump from Finland - here is the link http://www.herlevi.fi/shop/diesellandia-...pump-copy/
They ask what I would like the governor set to, as well as preferred CC and outside injection control - I could use some help on deciding what would be the best for these two questions as well.
But anyway, having peak torque at a relatively low RPM Is my goal.
Sweet, Herlevi. I asked for my governor to be around 5500 but they just set it to 6000. You might as well do the same if you can just so it doesn't drop off, even if you never get that high. If you google "722.3 discussion" there is a thread on 500e board that talks about the trans rpm governor screw. I have also been told a relay from a gas trans can help raise the WOT shift points
I'd guess by the nature of your engine you will have more low end torque than a 3.0, but that HX40 is probably going to keep your peak in the mid to high rpms. This doesn't necessarily mean you wont have a ton of torque available down low as it is though. For example, you might make 400 ft lbs at 3500 but still have 300-320 at 2200. Good move on the 8mm, they make their own 8mm elements. I got 6mm but in retrospect should have gone with 7 at the same fueling, but I'm still happy.
I assume the w140 is like the w126 and has a ton of engine bay room, so make sure you get a big intercooler too. The US bumpers on w126 are ugly but I can probably fit a 27x12-13 IC without being visible. Mine is only 9"
Ok last thing, I don't know about the 3.5 but they also told me that the 603 head gasket can handle 2.5 bar, anything above that you need the steel 606 gasket.
I assume the w140 is like the w126 and has a ton of engine bay room, so make sure you get a big intercooler too. The US bumpers on w126 are ugly but I can probably fit a 27x12-13 IC without being visible. Mine is only 9"
W140 has good enough engine bay room for a large intercooler, and I plan on it. Just need to move a few things around and see what the packaging is like. 2.5 Bar is a hell of a lot already. Are those steel head gaskets from the 606 compatible with the 603 or would I need to modify it?
Also, the bumper I have on it is from an S600, it's the Wald bodykit.
@awsrock Yeah if I think about it the HX40 might be slightly large for my taste, but I already had it laying around anyway so I'm not gonna let it go to waste. That's a good point though, it's not like a torque curve of that nature would be bad, that'd be great actually. Is 150cc good for this kind of build?
W140 has good enough engine bay room for a large intercooler, and I plan on it. Just need to move a few things around and see what the packaging is like. 2.5 Bar is a hell of a lot already. Are those steel head gaskets from the 606 compatible with the 603 or would I need to modify it?
Also, the bumper I have on it is from an S600, it's the Wald bodykit.
For the 606 gasket you need to drill a couple holes that are present in the 603 gasket. I have not done this so maybe someone else who has can elaborate on it more.
150cc could, in theory, get you mid-upper 300s hp wise if everything else is in tune. I think that would be HX40 territory.
For the 606 gasket you need to drill a couple holes that are present in the 603 gasket. I have not done this so maybe someone else who has can elaborate on it more.
the 606 gasket does not fit the 603, it can be used , but since the cylinders are 87mm it wont do the trick , just like that, 603 gasket dont mate the 606 head. The best is a custom made MLS and since u´re having all that assle drop a 4 valve in it.
The pumps , well pekka or myna or dieselmeken or my ownes, are just kind off superpumps and differ in many ways .
What i can tell u about my experience is that the pump must be able to idle as per factory , 8 to 10 cc in idle and cylinders sycronised between 8 to 10. cylinder balance in the .2º at idle and at least .5º at 2000 pump RPM wich is where all the work will be done. This is regarding the low idle caracteristics, the high idle caracteristic will depend on the quality of the element , when i build a pump i´m after 150cc + - 3cc at 2000RPM with feed pressure .5 bar , very often that can´t be done , due to pump wear and other dificiencies , and type of pump , (early vs old late models). the witdth and quality of the element determines if u can do this or not more than the pump itself.
The high idle caracteristic, this governor cuts fuel in a gently manner , means that the window to cut completely is of about 500rpm
in my pumps i try to leave them at 3000, full fuel delivery , wich will cut half by 3150 3200 and complete cut off by 3300/400 this will mean that this engine will turn at least by 6500rpm in dry conditions , some may reach 7000
the tq caracteristic, well usually max available , means that the tq capsule will be deactivated, some engines may exibit jerking expecially those with fagile clutches, in the autos the TC dampens the jerking.
but this tq has many trics wich is if the pump dont have a means of controling the "out of boost" delivery (ALDA kind device) the engine will smoke like a steam train.... at WOT.
1.5 bar of boost will kill almost all the smoke of a 150cc pump , 2 bar will definetly turn that left haze in a gaser exaust.
The width of the element will determine total injection time more than anything else, so for a 150cc even it it was possible with a 6mil this injection tipe would be the full stroke about 12º pump cam, 20º to 30º in the engine, so i dont need to say more, in a stock pump the 40cc happens in 2º pump degrees, so not the idea is finding a compromise will all this.
BTW the Holset crap 40 is a way too big for a day driver, hx 35 may be the best choice , i´ve done trials with the #12 turbine housing in a 606 and boost take long time to come to life , but when it does if hits the wall.
for my own build i´m using a rather small VNT and next i will be trying and sequential thing. wich seems not to work people say.
lets see if it does or not.
that pump in the url, looks very good indeed.
FD,
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Hy fellas ,
the 606 gasket does not fit the 603, it can be used , but since the cylinders are 87mm it wont do the trick , just like that, 603 gasket dont mate the 606 head. The best is a custom made MLS and since u´re having all that assle drop a 4 valve in it.
The pumps , well pekka or myna or dieselmeken or my ownes, are just kind off superpumps and differ in many ways .
What i can tell u about my experience is that the pump must be able to idle as per factory , 8 to 10 cc in idle and cylinders sycronised between 8 to 10. cylinder balance in the .2º at idle and at least .5º at 2000 pump RPM wich is where all the work will be done. This is regarding the low idle caracteristics, the high idle caracteristic will depend on the quality of the element , when i build a pump i´m after 150cc + - 3cc at 2000RPM with feed pressure .5 bar , very often that can´t be done , due to pump wear and other dificiencies , and type of pump , (early vs old late models). the witdth and quality of the element determines if u can do this or not more than the pump itself.
The high idle caracteristic, this governor cuts fuel in a gently manner , means that the window to cut completely is of about 500rpm
in my pumps i try to leave them at 3000, full fuel delivery , wich will cut half by 3150 3200 and complete cut off by 3300/400 this will mean that this engine will turn at least by 6500rpm in dry conditions , some may reach 7000
the tq caracteristic, well usually max available , means that the tq capsule will be deactivated, some engines may exibit jerking expecially those with fagile clutches, in the autos the TC dampens the jerking.
but this tq has many trics wich is if the pump dont have a means of controling the "out of boost" delivery (ALDA kind device) the engine will smoke like a steam train.... at WOT.
1.5 bar of boost will kill almost all the smoke of a 150cc pump , 2 bar will definetly turn that left haze in a gaser exaust.
The width of the element will determine total injection time more than anything else, so for a 150cc even it it was possible with a 6mil this injection tipe would be the full stroke about 12º pump cam, 20º to 30º in the engine, so i dont need to say more, in a stock pump the 40cc happens in 2º pump degrees, so not the idea is finding a compromise will all this.
BTW the Holset crap 40 is a way too big for a day driver, hx 35 may be the best choice , i´ve done trials with the #12 turbine housing in a 606 and boost take long time to come to life , but when it does if hits the wall.
for my own build i´m using a rather small VNT and next i will be trying and sequential thing. wich seems not to work people say.
lets see if it does or not.
that pump in the url, looks very good indeed.
FD,
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