New om617a injectors choice
New om617a injectors choice
Been a bit sence last questions,
After listening to a nailing injector for some time now it'd be nice to replace them all.
I've gotten a 7.5mm M-pump with upgraded turbo and IC.
Looking for a compatible injector to work with this setup, have the fuel turned down and believe 315's would be too much as coal can be rolled easily enough now makes me think 265's would be the way to go.
Where can these be found and what brand should be sought after?
Thanks, Howard
Hi All,
Been a bit sence last questions,
After listening to a nailing injector for some time now it'd be nice to replace them all.
I've gotten a 7.5mm M-pump with upgraded turbo and IC.
Looking for a compatible injector to work with this setup, have the fuel turned down and believe 315's would be too much as coal can be rolled easily enough now makes me think 265's would be the way to go.
Where can these be found and what brand should be sought after?
Thanks, Howard
if the spray patern is good after ultrasonic cleaning, there´s no reason to swap tips to new ones.
besides that u have ebay with china made crap...
FD,
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well any bosch dealer can sell u that thing, besides that any diesel shop should have them , any 602/3 605/606 in junk yards have them remove the tips and use them in yours.
if the spray patern is good after ultrasonic cleaning, there´s no reason to swap tips to new ones.
besides that u have ebay with china made crap...
FD,
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Mercedessoure.com doesn't seem to have them right now, at least not for the OM617A.
Bosio (Italian) also makes 265 and 314 nozzles and are available here: http://www.idparts.com/bosio-sd265-injec...-3084.html and http://www.idparts.com/bosio-injector-no...-3085.html.
pilot53 may still have his six used Monark 265's for sale http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/merc...e-new.html, but they are likely sold by now.
314's are supposed to flow about 10% more than 265's.
I got my German-made Monark 265 nozzles from mercedessource.com a few years ago and had them installed and pop tested by greazzer (who posts at the peachparts.com Diesel Discussion forum) in my 78 300SD and my 83 300SD (with an OM617A from my prior 82 300SD).
Mercedessoure.com doesn't seem to have them right now, at least not for the OM617A.
Bosio (Italian) also makes 265 and 314 nozzles and are available here: http://www.idparts.com/bosio-sd265-injec...-3084.html and http://www.idparts.com/bosio-injector-no...-3085.html.
pilot53 may still have his six used Monark 265's for sale http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/merc...e-new.html, but they are likely sold by now.
314's are supposed to flow about 10% more than 265's.
314s are different to 315s.
Black smoke is fuel air ratio ie excess fuel...nothing to do with size of injector orifice - to my knowledge it only affects injection duration. Turn your max fuel down or don't step on the juice so far
1978 300D, 373,000km... OM617.912 with a Holset HX30W, 7.5mm IP, 711.113 5 speed (project car, 7 years off the road and counting ;/)
1977 250 270,000km (parts car)
1977 300D (ex 280) 500,000km
1981 240D 498,000
1975 HJ45 ???,000
2001 2.8TD Rodeo 4x2 - 456,000 - DD
I would recommend Greazzer for injectors. He made me a nice set of 315 equipped for me and shipped all the way across the pacific...
314s are different to 315s.
Black smoke is fuel air ratio ie excess fuel...nothing to do with size of injector orifice - to my knowledge it only affects injection duration. Turn your max fuel down or don't step on the juice so far
1978 300D, 373,000km... OM617.912 with a Holset HX30W, 7.5mm IP, 711.113 5 speed (project car, 7 years off the road and counting ;/)
1977 250 270,000km (parts car)
1977 300D (ex 280) 500,000km
1981 240D 498,000
1975 HJ45 ???,000
2001 2.8TD Rodeo 4x2 - 456,000 - DD
i have wondered for a while what the differences are between the injectors exactly. i know the DN0SD240's are the original OM61X engine nozzles, they were replaced with the 265's later. i have also seen DN0SD220's used for the early 300GD's. the 315's are from a ford 1.8l engine and are supposed to flow more at lower a pintle lift. from what i understand the 314's were developed for the later OM60X engines as a slightly more efficient/clean nozzle. just how different are the 240, 265 and the 314? and has anyone had any experience with the 220's?
The other comon problema is needle sealing, in IDI a defective sealing means that the injector will drip overtime pressure will be lost and the injection quantity will be 1% lower, carbon deposits will build in the chambers , white smoke will result due to outoff time injection, in a DI injector the same condition lead to carbon build up in the tipnozzle , uneven loading of the cylinder, the drip will overheat certain parts of the piston and premature damage will happen(pistons melted)
basically , the 220, 240, 315 this numbers has to do with fabrication process and quality, type of sealing and also the main hole... but in the end the IDI injector is just a valve, sometimes the same tip is used in diff injector holders and in diff brands with diff specs....
for instance the 606 turbo injector uses a nozle marked 316, is compatible with all the other IDI injectors in the MB world , and i belive was the last update in that tecnology. 606 was the last of the last automotive engines to employ IDI tech.
Bosio is a good brand for DI injectors , they have high flow tips with multiple holes for lowpress DI, expecially the dual stage injectors benefit from having them, but that is TDI teritory not ours.
regards
FD,
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this are very low press injectors we are discussing here , and they will perform in Indirect injection cycle, even if u have one peeing wich means it canot atomize anymore the engine will work anyway, in a Direct injection engine if u have one doing the same it will work limp, probably in idle the engine will not work or have a defective operation ... loading unevenly the cylinders leading to premature damage.
The other comon problema is needle sealing, in IDI a defective sealing means that the injector will drip overtime pressure will be lost and the injection quantity will be 1% lower, carbon deposits will build in the chambers , white smoke will result due to outoff time injection, in a DI injector the same condition lead to carbon build up in the tipnozzle , uneven loading of the cylinder, the drip will overheat certain parts of the piston and premature damage will happen(pistons melted)
basically , the 220, 240, 315 this numbers has to do with fabrication process and quality, type of sealing and also the main hole... but in the end the IDI injector is just a valve, sometimes the same tip is used in diff injector holders and in diff brands with diff specs....
for instance the 606 turbo injector uses a nozle marked 316, is compatible with all the other IDI injectors in the MB world , and i belive was the last update in that tecnology. 606 was the last of the last automotive engines to employ IDI tech.
Bosio is a good brand for DI injectors , they have high flow tips with multiple holes for lowpress DI, expecially the dual stage injectors benefit from having them, but that is TDI teritory not ours.
regards
FD,
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i know the IDI's are much less sensitive to the injector choice than a DI engine. theres not a lot of power to be gained by swapping injectors. however they do have an effect on the engine characteristics. the 315' on their own don't flow that much more but they maintain lower pintle lift and better atomization when you are flowing more fuel than the stock pump. the 240's tend to develop more low end torque than the 265's at the cost of emissions. i am wondering how the 314's work vs the 240's and 265's in an OM61X. does anyone have any experience with them?
USE ... #46s or 5/4s which are intended for that engine.
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
I suggest folks do NOT use injectors from a OM602 or 603 engine into a OM616 or OM617 engine. Those injectors are normally KCA 30 S 44 and they should not be used in an OM616 or OM617 engine.
USE ... #46s or 5/4s which are intended for that engine.
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
when you say injectors you mean the nozzle holders? i know im not using them right now i running the stock 135 bar injectors with DN0SD265's reset to 140 bar and balanced within 1.5 bar of each other. i am working on getting a set of AAZ two stage injectors set right now. i have the injectors however they need to be balanced and the nozzle and pintles replaced. they have the stock VW DN0SD308's in them still and i have heard those destroy glowplugs if you run them. i am debating between DN0SD314's or 315's. i am waiting for Dieselmeken to release the 7.5mm MW elements i have a pump waiting to go once he does. i figure 100-120cc/1000. what i am trying to work out is do i need the higher flow out of the 315's with the dual stage injectors or would the slightly better atomization from the 314's be better?
Injector = entire 'item'
Nozzle Holder = Injector less the nozzle
Nozzle = the element, includes pintle
Sort of like saying car wheel. The wheel obviously consists of the tire and rim, but is referred to as a 'wheel' by many folks.
Still doing injectors for forum members. I slowed down a little over the summer because of the intense heat and my garage was like an oven, hitting 110F by the mid-afternoon.
Per some older posts, the #315s are the known COTS solution for flowing the most fuel in the OM617 engine absent re-ground pintles in other nozzle types.
For the folks who emailed me in the last week, I have responded to your emails but they keep getting returned as undeliverable. PLEASE PM me here on this forum. I generally don't come here every day, but I will try.
For DD, there are tiny differences between the 240/, 261, 265, and 314. The following 4 have been used successfully in turbo applications OM617. For the most fuel, as noted above, #315.
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
Currently, I do not have any new nozzles. I could order some but as noted in the past, I need to be pre-paid because too many forum members have left me holding the bag in the past. I have plenty of tested USED German nozzles which do not pee or have a split cone pattern, et cet. Per the post a few above,
Injector = entire 'item'
Nozzle Holder = Injector less the nozzle
Nozzle = the element, includes pintle
Sort of like saying car wheel. The wheel obviously consists of the tire and rim, but is referred to as a 'wheel' by many folks.
Still doing injectors for forum members. I slowed down a little over the summer because of the intense heat and my garage was like an oven, hitting 110F by the mid-afternoon.
Per some older posts, the #315s are the known COTS solution for flowing the most fuel in the OM617 engine absent re-ground pintles in other nozzle types.
For the folks who emailed me in the last week, I have responded to your emails but they keep getting returned as undeliverable. PLEASE PM me here on this forum. I generally don't come here every day, but I will try.
For DD, there are tiny differences between the 240/, 261, 265, and 314. The following 4 have been used successfully in turbo applications OM617. For the most fuel, as noted above, #315.
Ninth Year Anniversary with STD on 1-9-2020
visit: www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
Project 2018: Really get the car finished -- Turbo OM617 greater than 175 MPH goal.
RED W123 - left Germany as 240D in 1982. Full AMG body kit less rear apron, 2:65LSD, five speed Getrag 717.400, manual steering, read leather interior, manual brake conversion, electric water pump (EWP), and a bunch of other goodies ...
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