W210 OM606 450bhp/456lb
W210 OM606 450bhp/456lb
03-02-2017, 12:57 PM
#1
Hi I am a first time poster from Fresno, California. I recently acquired a 1999 e300turbodiesel with absolutely no rust, clean title, 179k miles, amazing interior. So I've been looking into how to get some more torque and hp out of it and of course the amazing 35-40mpg when you drive sensibly. I was wondering if anyone has a full recipe of everything I need to do to achieve my goal. Money will not be a problem. Thanks, not very many high hp om606 cars in the USA any help would be appreciated. Also why doesn't anybody like the w210 body? It looks good with some chrome amg rims and a dark window tint.
03-02-2017, 01:40 PM
#2
I think the issue with the W210 body is that is is CAN bus based. That makes it difficult to use the mechanical injection pumps that are favored by many superturbo builders. The same performance should be achievable with the EDC pump, larger elements, and suitable tuning.
03-02-2017, 01:46 PM
#3
(03-02-2017, 01:40 PM)GAlanMcR I think the issue with the W210 body is that is is CAN bus based. That makes it difficult to use the mechanical injection pumps that are favored by many superturbo builders. The same performance should be achievable with the EDC pump, larger elements, and suitable tuning.
What is can bus based and I though the pump and tranny will work fine with a remap which I have found a source for.
(03-02-2017, 01:40 PM)GAlanMcR I think the issue with the W210 body is that is is CAN bus based. That makes it difficult to use the mechanical injection pumps that are favored by many superturbo builders. The same performance should be achievable with the EDC pump, larger elements, and suitable tuning.
What is can bus based and I though the pump and tranny will work fine with a remap which I have found a source for.
03-02-2017, 03:08 PM
#4
(03-02-2017, 01:46 PM)Val7The whole car is CAN based, which is fine with me. And, yes, a remap with an element upgrade and new turbo will get you the power you want. Most people here want to go mechanical, not you or I. I'd like to hear details of your build.(03-02-2017, 01:40 PM)GAlanMcR I think the issue with the W210 body is that is is CAN bus based. That makes it difficult to use the mechanical injection pumps that are favored by many superturbo builders. The same performance should be achievable with the EDC pump, larger elements, and suitable tuning.
What is can bus based and I though the pump and tranny will work fine with a remap which I have found a source for.
Note that the W210/E300 722.6 transmission is the WA330 version rated for 330nm input, which just happens to be the factory output of the E300. You might want to swap out the transmission for a sturdier WA580 version if you plan on exercising that extra power often. On the other hand, you might just want to wait until it grenades, and then replace it.
(03-02-2017, 01:46 PM)Val7The whole car is CAN based, which is fine with me. And, yes, a remap with an element upgrade and new turbo will get you the power you want. Most people here want to go mechanical, not you or I. I'd like to hear details of your build.(03-02-2017, 01:40 PM)GAlanMcR I think the issue with the W210 body is that is is CAN bus based. That makes it difficult to use the mechanical injection pumps that are favored by many superturbo builders. The same performance should be achievable with the EDC pump, larger elements, and suitable tuning.
What is can bus based and I though the pump and tranny will work fine with a remap which I have found a source for.
Note that the W210/E300 722.6 transmission is the WA330 version rated for 330nm input, which just happens to be the factory output of the E300. You might want to swap out the transmission for a sturdier WA580 version if you plan on exercising that extra power often. On the other hand, you might just want to wait until it grenades, and then replace it.
03-02-2017, 03:22 PM
#5
(03-02-2017, 03:08 PM)AlanMcRWell I was planning on buying a 7.5mm pump from dieselpumpuk. Also I think I'm going to keep the stock tranny till it goes out and swap in a BMW zf6 tranny dieselpumpuk has an adaptor kit.(03-02-2017, 01:46 PM)Val7The whole car is CAN based, which is fine with me. And, yes, a remap with an element upgrade and new turbo will get you the power you want. Most people here want to go mechanical, not you or I. I'd like to hear details of your build.(03-02-2017, 01:40 PM)GAlanMcR I think the issue with the W210 body is that is is CAN bus based. That makes it difficult to use the mechanical injection pumps that are favored by many superturbo builders. The same performance should be achievable with the EDC pump, larger elements, and suitable tuning.
What is can bus based and I though the pump and tranny will work fine with a remap which I have found a source for.
Note that the W210/E300 722.6 transmission is the WA330 version rated for 330nm input, which just happens to be the factory output of the E300. You might want to swap out the transmission for a sturdier WA580 version if you plan on exercising that extra power often. On the other hand, you might just want to wait until it grenades, and then replace it.
(03-02-2017, 03:08 PM)AlanMcRWell I was planning on buying a 7.5mm pump from dieselpumpuk. Also I think I'm going to keep the stock tranny till it goes out and swap in a BMW zf6 tranny dieselpumpuk has an adaptor kit.(03-02-2017, 01:46 PM)Val7The whole car is CAN based, which is fine with me. And, yes, a remap with an element upgrade and new turbo will get you the power you want. Most people here want to go mechanical, not you or I. I'd like to hear details of your build.(03-02-2017, 01:40 PM)GAlanMcR I think the issue with the W210 body is that is is CAN bus based. That makes it difficult to use the mechanical injection pumps that are favored by many superturbo builders. The same performance should be achievable with the EDC pump, larger elements, and suitable tuning.
What is can bus based and I though the pump and tranny will work fine with a remap which I have found a source for.
Note that the W210/E300 722.6 transmission is the WA330 version rated for 330nm input, which just happens to be the factory output of the E300. You might want to swap out the transmission for a sturdier WA580 version if you plan on exercising that extra power often. On the other hand, you might just want to wait until it grenades, and then replace it.
03-02-2017, 11:11 PM
#9
(03-02-2017, 10:39 PM)AlanMcR Similarly, I didn't see any EDC pumps on the dieselpumpuk site. Only mechanical ones. You need the electronic pump.
Why do I need an edc pump what wrong with mechanical, my tuner said he has a map for 7.5mm and 8mm pump so it will work with ecu
03-03-2017, 03:45 AM
#10
(03-02-2017, 11:11 PM)Val7(03-02-2017, 10:39 PM)AlanMcR Similarly, I didn't see any EDC pumps on the dieselpumpuk site. Only mechanical ones. You need the electronic pump.
Why do I need an edc pump what wrong with mechanical, my tuner said he has a map for 7.5mm and 8mm pump so it will work with ecu
I don't understand what you are trying to say. You want to remap ecu for mechanical pump, right? That's something new.
On facebook page dpuk has picture of EDC pumps also, btw they sell Dieselmeken pumps.
This post was last modified: 03-03-2017, 03:46 AM by erx.
(03-02-2017, 11:11 PM)Val7(03-02-2017, 10:39 PM)AlanMcR Similarly, I didn't see any EDC pumps on the dieselpumpuk site. Only mechanical ones. You need the electronic pump.
Why do I need an edc pump what wrong with mechanical, my tuner said he has a map for 7.5mm and 8mm pump so it will work with ecu
I don't understand what you are trying to say. You want to remap ecu for mechanical pump, right? That's something new.
On facebook page dpuk has picture of EDC pumps also, btw they sell Dieselmeken pumps.
03-03-2017, 12:55 PM
#11
(03-03-2017, 03:45 AM)erx(03-02-2017, 11:11 PM)Val7(03-02-2017, 10:39 PM)AlanMcR Similarly, I didn't see any EDC pumps on the dieselpumpuk site. Only mechanical ones. You need the electronic pump.
Why do I need an edc pump what wrong with mechanical, my tuner said he has a map for 7.5mm and 8mm pump so it will work with ecu
I don't understand what you are trying to say. You want to remap ecu for mechanical pump, right? That's something new.
On facebook page dpuk has picture of EDC pumps also, btw they sell Dieselmeken pumps.
Yea that's what the tuner I talked to said. Where can I buy an edc pump?
(03-03-2017, 03:45 AM)erx(03-02-2017, 11:11 PM)Val7(03-02-2017, 10:39 PM)AlanMcR Similarly, I didn't see any EDC pumps on the dieselpumpuk site. Only mechanical ones. You need the electronic pump.
Why do I need an edc pump what wrong with mechanical, my tuner said he has a map for 7.5mm and 8mm pump so it will work with ecu
I don't understand what you are trying to say. You want to remap ecu for mechanical pump, right? That's something new.
On facebook page dpuk has picture of EDC pumps also, btw they sell Dieselmeken pumps.
Yea that's what the tuner I talked to said. Where can I buy an edc pump?
03-03-2017, 01:39 PM
#13
(03-03-2017, 01:15 PM)97e300 You can buy an EDC pump from Dieselmeken or talk to Luke at Dieselpumpuk they might have some. You can also send yours in. If you end up sending it in, PM me maybe we can get a group deal.
Who's your tuner btw? Are they in CA?
His name is seanyt, he's overseas. Why buy an edc pump when I can get a mechanical one that will work just fine with a remanufactured ecu with a remap.?
(03-03-2017, 01:15 PM)97e300 You can buy an EDC pump from Dieselmeken or talk to Luke at Dieselpumpuk they might have some. You can also send yours in. If you end up sending it in, PM me maybe we can get a group deal.
Who's your tuner btw? Are they in CA?
His name is seanyt, he's overseas. Why buy an edc pump when I can get a mechanical one that will work just fine with a remanufactured ecu with a remap.?
03-03-2017, 01:57 PM
#14
(03-03-2017, 01:39 PM)Val7(03-03-2017, 01:15 PM)97e300 You can buy an EDC pump from Dieselmeken or talk to Luke at Dieselpumpuk they might have some. You can also send yours in. If you end up sending it in, PM me maybe we can get a group deal.
Who's your tuner btw? Are they in CA?
His name is seanyt, he's overseas. Why buy an edc pump when I can get a mechanical one that will work just fine with a remanufactured ecu with a remap.?
Some terminology:
Mechanical pump - This type of pump is entirely mechanically controlled. Fuel quantity is managed by a sophisticated set of cams, flywheels, and bellows sensors. This mechanism pushes the fuel control rod one way or another to set fuel injection quantity.
EDC pump - This type of pump has a voice coil driver that pushes the fuel control rod back and forth to set fuel injection quantity. The voice coil driver is driven by the ECU that interprets electrical sensors with software and numerical tables. It is those tables that are changed when the ECU is "tuned".
Either way the business end of the pump is accomplished with mechanical pistons and valves. In fact the mechanical and electrical pumps are nearly identical in that respect.
On the W210, you need to keep the ECU if you want the rest of the car to work. The ECU needs to talk to an EDC pump.
(03-03-2017, 01:39 PM)Val7(03-03-2017, 01:15 PM)97e300 You can buy an EDC pump from Dieselmeken or talk to Luke at Dieselpumpuk they might have some. You can also send yours in. If you end up sending it in, PM me maybe we can get a group deal.
Who's your tuner btw? Are they in CA?
His name is seanyt, he's overseas. Why buy an edc pump when I can get a mechanical one that will work just fine with a remanufactured ecu with a remap.?
Some terminology:
Mechanical pump - This type of pump is entirely mechanically controlled. Fuel quantity is managed by a sophisticated set of cams, flywheels, and bellows sensors. This mechanism pushes the fuel control rod one way or another to set fuel injection quantity.
EDC pump - This type of pump has a voice coil driver that pushes the fuel control rod back and forth to set fuel injection quantity. The voice coil driver is driven by the ECU that interprets electrical sensors with software and numerical tables. It is those tables that are changed when the ECU is "tuned".
Either way the business end of the pump is accomplished with mechanical pistons and valves. In fact the mechanical and electrical pumps are nearly identical in that respect.
On the W210, you need to keep the ECU if you want the rest of the car to work. The ECU needs to talk to an EDC pump.
03-03-2017, 01:59 PM
#16
If you were to put a early pump in you would loose a lot of functionality. Like how the transmission works. Etc.
whipplem104
03-03-2017, 01:59 PM #16Your car already has an edc pump in it. The difference is how the rack is controlled and shut down. Early cars had what people call a mechanical pump. They have a cable to run throttle to the pump. Your car the computer controls rack position instead. Your gas pedal is just going to a sensor. Drive By Wire.
If you were to put a early pump in you would loose a lot of functionality. Like how the transmission works. Etc.
03-03-2017, 02:13 PM
#18
(03-03-2017, 02:03 PM)seanyt Just to clear up what is being said.
As AlanMcR has put it but in greater detail.
Val7 both pumps are mechanical, but you need an upgraded EDC pump with either 7.5 /8mm elements.
Dieselpumpuk and dieselmeken can both provide you with these.
Oh okay that's makes more sense, but I want to keep my stock 6mm pump, and buy a separate edc pump with 7.5mm that way I can swap the 6mm pump in to pass smog in California. I am too interested in doing a group buy.
(03-03-2017, 02:03 PM)seanyt Just to clear up what is being said.
As AlanMcR has put it but in greater detail.
Val7 both pumps are mechanical, but you need an upgraded EDC pump with either 7.5 /8mm elements.
Dieselpumpuk and dieselmeken can both provide you with these.
Oh okay that's makes more sense, but I want to keep my stock 6mm pump, and buy a separate edc pump with 7.5mm that way I can swap the 6mm pump in to pass smog in California. I am too interested in doing a group buy.
03-03-2017, 02:35 PM
#19
(03-03-2017, 02:13 PM)Val7You shouldn't have problems passing smog with a properly tuned system. They basically look to see if the ECU thinks things are OK (should be), then look under the hood for the EGR parts, crankcase vent, and catalytic converter. I don't think that there is a tailpipe test, so the contents of the cat aren't at issue. Obvious smoke would be a problem.(03-03-2017, 02:03 PM)seanyt Just to clear up what is being said.
As AlanMcR has put it but in greater detail.
Val7 both pumps are mechanical, but you need an upgraded EDC pump with either 7.5 /8mm elements.
Dieselpumpuk and dieselmeken can both provide you with these.
Oh okay that's makes more sense, but I want to keep my stock 6mm pump, and buy a separate edc pump with 7.5mm that way I can swap the 6mm pump in to pass smog in California. I am too interested in doing a group buy.
Our E300 is stock. The only smog problem I've had is when I decided to clear all the ECU codes and managed to clear the "readiness codes". For reasons unknown, it took 4+ months of normal driving for the codes to come ready again. You can't pass smog with those codes set.
The G300 is what I plan on tuning. It is a 1996 and currently exempt from smog testing. I'm looking for a fairly light tune on that. It gets taken out to the boondocks regularly and I don't want to reduce the reliability.
(03-03-2017, 02:13 PM)Val7You shouldn't have problems passing smog with a properly tuned system. They basically look to see if the ECU thinks things are OK (should be), then look under the hood for the EGR parts, crankcase vent, and catalytic converter. I don't think that there is a tailpipe test, so the contents of the cat aren't at issue. Obvious smoke would be a problem.(03-03-2017, 02:03 PM)seanyt Just to clear up what is being said.
As AlanMcR has put it but in greater detail.
Val7 both pumps are mechanical, but you need an upgraded EDC pump with either 7.5 /8mm elements.
Dieselpumpuk and dieselmeken can both provide you with these.
Oh okay that's makes more sense, but I want to keep my stock 6mm pump, and buy a separate edc pump with 7.5mm that way I can swap the 6mm pump in to pass smog in California. I am too interested in doing a group buy.
Our E300 is stock. The only smog problem I've had is when I decided to clear all the ECU codes and managed to clear the "readiness codes". For reasons unknown, it took 4+ months of normal driving for the codes to come ready again. You can't pass smog with those codes set.
The G300 is what I plan on tuning. It is a 1996 and currently exempt from smog testing. I'm looking for a fairly light tune on that. It gets taken out to the boondocks regularly and I don't want to reduce the reliability.
03-03-2017, 02:38 PM
#20
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=4998
raysorenson
03-03-2017, 02:38 PM #20These guys put 7.5mm dieselmeken elements in a mechanical pump for me. The job is easier with an EDC pump.
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=4998
03-03-2017, 04:55 PM
#24
(03-03-2017, 04:18 PM)Val7(03-03-2017, 03:01 PM)97e300 Can confirm. My ECU has been tuned and it passed smog easily. They only do an OBD check and a visual inspection of emissions devices and smoke.what tune did you get for for your car?
Just the stage 2 tune from speedtuning USA a couple years ago. Claimed 220hp but I've never dynoed it.
(03-03-2017, 04:18 PM)Val7(03-03-2017, 03:01 PM)97e300 Can confirm. My ECU has been tuned and it passed smog easily. They only do an OBD check and a visual inspection of emissions devices and smoke.what tune did you get for for your car?
Just the stage 2 tune from speedtuning USA a couple years ago. Claimed 220hp but I've never dynoed it.
04-13-2017, 07:21 AM
#25
hummermaniac88
04-13-2017, 07:21 AM #25I'm also interested in a built EDC pump. I'm trying to pair it with a HE351VE. Should go for baldur s ecu? Or will a stock ecu suffice?
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