S202 OM605 build .
S202 OM605 build .
I'll get some more info on a car in my price range next week . It's a 124 estate which means a om602 engine .
My end goal is in the 400 hp range with the very rare full power drive .
I see two options right now . Change the head or just buy a turbo engine and modify that .
I'll have a stab at redoing the pump myself . 7.5mm on that with ALDA .
Inlet and exhaust manifolds will be changed .
And a GT3071 with water cooling will be used with an external wastegate .
So for the stock engine oil feed for the turbo will be from the filter housing and dumped in the sump .
But what about the water cooling for the turbo ?
And what size intercooler can you fit and keep the AC ?
How much does the powertrain on those hold ?
Cheers
So I've been doing some reading on forums and binge watching videos .
I'll get some more info on a car in my price range next week . It's a 124 estate which means a om602 engine .
My end goal is in the 400 hp range with the very rare full power drive .
I see two options right now . Change the head or just buy a turbo engine and modify that .
I'll have a stab at redoing the pump myself . 7.5mm on that with ALDA .
Inlet and exhaust manifolds will be changed .
And a GT3071 with water cooling will be used with an external wastegate .
So for the stock engine oil feed for the turbo will be from the filter housing and dumped in the sump .
But what about the water cooling for the turbo ?
And what size intercooler can you fit and keep the AC ?
How much does the powertrain on those hold ?
Cheers
slight progress to report .
An OM605 turbo was bought on the cheap and is now proudly weighing on a cart in my garage . Came up with a super simple exhaust manifold which I'll show a bit later .
Also a simple design of an intake is on the way .
Still no car to put it in, though I'm working on that as well .
It's gonna be a 124 estate .
So some questions :
Will a 53dz gearbox fit in a 124 tunel behind a 605 ?
The shifter will need modifications, that's clear but I'd rather not drill/cut.beat up the original tunnel .
Anybody have experience with a s200sxe with a 0.82 AR ? When can I expect boost ?
And will the stock 411 box hold about 200hp ?
Edit :
Some pictures of the intake and exhaust
It's a two piece construction . The bottom pieces are 20 mm thick and use a gasket from a 606 . the seal to the top piece uses O rings . And the top piece is attached with three studs to the bottom pieces .
The exhaust is just flat stock laser cut to fit and the space in between is made from 33.7 90 degree beds just cut up and welded together .
So,
slight progress to report .
An OM605 turbo was bought on the cheap and is now proudly weighing on a cart in my garage . Came up with a super simple exhaust manifold which I'll show a bit later .
Also a simple design of an intake is on the way .
Still no car to put it in, though I'm working on that as well .
It's gonna be a 124 estate .
So some questions :
Will a 53dz gearbox fit in a 124 tunel behind a 605 ?
The shifter will need modifications, that's clear but I'd rather not drill/cut.beat up the original tunnel .
Anybody have experience with a s200sxe with a 0.82 AR ? When can I expect boost ?
And will the stock 411 box hold about 200hp ?
Edit :
Some pictures of the intake and exhaust
It's a two piece construction . The bottom pieces are 20 mm thick and use a gasket from a 606 . the seal to the top piece uses O rings . And the top piece is attached with three studs to the bottom pieces .
The exhaust is just flat stock laser cut to fit and the space in between is made from 33.7 90 degree beds just cut up and welded together .
Since I'll e doing my own pump I started with the ALDA .
Using a valve spring from an old head on a 40 mm cylinder gives proportional
to pressure travel starting from almost 0 bar . It's linear to 5-6 bar . Haven't measured the travel mm/bar yet .
To my mind it should keep smoking very low as the pressure rises .
And the slots allow for some fine tuning on how fueling picks up as boost is applied .
Here's a photo of the intake side
And the exhaust manifold
Still waiting on the flanges and aluminium parts from the laser guys . Will have some practice TIG welding aluminium .
Some more pictures .
Since I'll e doing my own pump I started with the ALDA .
Using a valve spring from an old head on a 40 mm cylinder gives proportional
to pressure travel starting from almost 0 bar . It's linear to 5-6 bar . Haven't measured the travel mm/bar yet .
To my mind it should keep smoking very low as the pressure rises .
And the slots allow for some fine tuning on how fueling picks up as boost is applied .
Here's a photo of the intake side
And the exhaust manifold
Still waiting on the flanges and aluminium parts from the laser guys . Will have some practice TIG welding aluminium .
junkyarddawg
04-14-2023, 06:17 AM #10Your work is very good and thank you for the information it looks like you are able to make it "exactly like you want it" and having some fun so keep rolling......
Last week I took the engine apart . All in all, nothing to report there . I'm impressed at the state of it after this undefined amount of kilometers behind it .
I plan to cerakote the piston tops, still contemplating doing the head surface and valves . Valves need a regrind, but that is to be expected .
Con rods will be here this week, they'll be necessary to calculate the bobweights . I'll have the crank balanced .
But first I'll have to remove the plug I broke !
Fun times .
P.S. Anybody have any drawings of the sprinter flywheel ? Thinking of making one from aluminum .
Thanks !
Last week I took the engine apart . All in all, nothing to report there . I'm impressed at the state of it after this undefined amount of kilometers behind it .
I plan to cerakote the piston tops, still contemplating doing the head surface and valves . Valves need a regrind, but that is to be expected .
Con rods will be here this week, they'll be necessary to calculate the bobweights . I'll have the crank balanced .
But first I'll have to remove the plug I broke !
Fun times .
P.S. Anybody have any drawings of the sprinter flywheel ? Thinking of making one from aluminum .
So this thing arrived .
I'll have to correct the drawings and upload them . A couple of bolts didn't line up .
Got my hands on a 648 oil pump and 18 tooth chain sprockets .
Gonna reduce the speed of the pump .
For the bolt of the girdle plate I'm using Dacia 1.5 dci head bolts . If you get them from Febi they're 12.9 grade .
They are 20 25mm longer that needed . I plan to experiment with torquing values .
In the book it's 55 Nm + 90 degrees . Plan is to sacrifice a bolt and check at what angle it gives .
Remove 40 degrees and torque it to that .
No pictures of that, but the space is already filled in . Machined a piece of 42CrMo4+QT . No heat treat needed .
An update.
So this thing arrived .
I'll have to correct the drawings and upload them . A couple of bolts didn't line up .
Got my hands on a 648 oil pump and 18 tooth chain sprockets .
Gonna reduce the speed of the pump .
For the bolt of the girdle plate I'm using Dacia 1.5 dci head bolts . If you get them from Febi they're 12.9 grade .
They are 20 25mm longer that needed . I plan to experiment with torquing values .
In the book it's 55 Nm + 90 degrees . Plan is to sacrifice a bolt and check at what angle it gives .
Remove 40 degrees and torque it to that .
No pictures of that, but the space is already filled in . Machined a piece of 42CrMo4+QT . No heat treat needed .
I reshaped the intake valves, as this costs nothing and improves flow .
Not sure if I feel comfortable removing material from the exhaust valves .
It was a bit unorthodox but turned out pretty alright .
Also the pistons are balanced and skimmed 0.2mm .
Next is the cerakote on them and the valves .
Here's a bit of an update :
I reshaped the intake valves, as this costs nothing and improves flow .
Not sure if I feel comfortable removing material from the exhaust valves .
It was a bit unorthodox but turned out pretty alright .
Also the pistons are balanced and skimmed 0.2mm .
Next is the cerakote on them and the valves .
Pictures as follows :
7.7mm elements (I got a very good deal on them )
The rear bearing was shot, so that got replaced (it's a 6204)
The space between the element fingers (or whatever you call them ) was set to exact measurement with a gauge block .
This will later be set on the stand, but I expect a goot starting point .
Made a simple tool for the rear nut .
And this is how I "phased" the pump . Quite sketchy .
So this weekend I put the new elements in . Also phased the pump . the method was rather unorthodox, but working . I assembled the pump without delivery valves, and pressurized it with a simple fuel pump . The angles were measured with a digital protractor . I managed to get everything within about 0.5 degrees . The conditions are far from sterile but I expect thing to work out alright .
Pictures as follows :
7.7mm elements (I got a very good deal on them )
The rear bearing was shot, so that got replaced (it's a 6204)
The space between the element fingers (or whatever you call them ) was set to exact measurement with a gauge block .
This will later be set on the stand, but I expect a goot starting point .
Made a simple tool for the rear nut .
And this is how I "phased" the pump . Quite sketchy .
The clutch pressure plate arrived . It's an e34 M5 (PN: 3082 147 033) unit and those springs are tough .
So with the NSG-370 gearbox the flywheel ends up 30 mm thick, which means 1045 will be used to make that .
Face of the flywheel ends up being flat, which is easy enough, and the entire thickness of the friction disk is inside the pressure plate .
Things end up fitting nicely tho .
I'm planning on using a friction disk with organic material on the pressure plate side and ceramic on the flywheel side .
Should have enough bite .
Sort of an update .
The clutch pressure plate arrived . It's an e34 M5 (PN: 3082 147 033) unit and those springs are tough .
So with the NSG-370 gearbox the flywheel ends up 30 mm thick, which means 1045 will be used to make that .
Face of the flywheel ends up being flat, which is easy enough, and the entire thickness of the friction disk is inside the pressure plate .
Things end up fitting nicely tho .
I'm planning on using a friction disk with organic material on the pressure plate side and ceramic on the flywheel side .
Should have enough bite .
I'm not very happy with the way it turned out on the pistons . It was fine at first but started boiling on a couple of spots after a while .
I guess I didn't prepare the surface well enough . Will have to redo them .
The steel on the valves was easy enough .
Some recent work in pictures :
I'm not very happy with the way it turned out on the pistons . It was fine at first but started boiling on a couple of spots after a while .
I guess I didn't prepare the surface well enough . Will have to redo them .
The steel on the valves was easy enough .
The flywheel is done
and machined a keyway on the crank .
Crank journals don't show any wear.
Next, send it off for balancing .
As far as main bolts go I tested the dacia head bolts with less than satisfactory results .
They seem to stretch quite easy . Odd thing is that I got Elring which have no narking on them .
Unlike the febi which are listed as 12.9 .
Anybody have any experience ?
Apart from that I believe this ARP kit will fit 204-4205 Audi 5 Cylinder 10V - ARP Head Studs .
Cheers
It's been a while since I last posted .
The flywheel is done
and machined a keyway on the crank .
Crank journals don't show any wear.
Next, send it off for balancing .
As far as main bolts go I tested the dacia head bolts with less than satisfactory results .
They seem to stretch quite easy . Odd thing is that I got Elring which have no narking on them .
Unlike the febi which are listed as 12.9 .
Anybody have any experience ?
Apart from that I believe this ARP kit will fit 204-4205 Audi 5 Cylinder 10V - ARP Head Studs .
Cheers
So I had these brake calipers from an alfa 159 that originally run on 330mm discs .
Haven't machined the bracket yet but have a pretty good idea how it'll turn out .
Welded up an 18 tooth sprocket on the front for the oil pump .
Did some final fitting on the flywheel, and am happy with the way it goes together .
Now it's off for balancing . Calculated bobweight is 1031 gr .
Overall, a good weekend .
Some more progress to share .
So I had these brake calipers from an alfa 159 that originally run on 330mm discs .
Haven't machined the bracket yet but have a pretty good idea how it'll turn out .
Welded up an 18 tooth sprocket on the front for the oil pump .
Did some final fitting on the flywheel, and am happy with the way it goes together .
Now it's off for balancing . Calculated bobweight is 1031 gr .
Overall, a good weekend .
I have two accelerometers and a neat place to put them. I decided against designing specialized electronics for this as it's more informative to have direct signal from an oscilloscope . All that's left is the drive roller which I'll machine soon .
Some movement :
I have two accelerometers and a neat place to put them. I decided against designing specialized electronics for this as it's more informative to have direct signal from an oscilloscope . All that's left is the drive roller which I'll machine soon .
I have a few edges to blend and they're done . I'll have them anodized .
Also got the plate for the bobweights on the balancer . But laser cut stock is nothing to photograph, so no pictures of that .
Another weekend another little machining job done .
I have a few edges to blend and they're done . I'll have them anodized .
Also got the plate for the bobweights on the balancer . But laser cut stock is nothing to photograph, so no pictures of that .
The bobweights are nearly done . Got the accelerometers glued on the the balancer .
While I was on this topic I made 6 weights, just in case I get a v6 to balance .
Today I managed to drill out the prechambers . center hole is now 3mm and those to the side
are 2.5 2.65 2.5 2.65 ....
It gets tricky pretty quick . The material is pretty hard at the tips, and really easy to deform on the side where the clamping bolt contacts it .
I used carbide drill bits for PCBs, and they're pretty brittle .
You really need to align them well before drilling as the different chip load on the side cracks them .
For that I turned a 2.25 diameter which fits snugly in the prechamber holes and use that as an alignment tool in my simple jig .
Nothing fancy, just a thick plate with a reamed 16mm hole and a bolt (with a flat face or better yet a copper bolt) to fix it in .
So I got some things done in the past couple of weekends .
The bobweights are nearly done . Got the accelerometers glued on the the balancer .
While I was on this topic I made 6 weights, just in case I get a v6 to balance .
Today I managed to drill out the prechambers . center hole is now 3mm and those to the side
are 2.5 2.65 2.5 2.65 ....
It gets tricky pretty quick . The material is pretty hard at the tips, and really easy to deform on the side where the clamping bolt contacts it .
I used carbide drill bits for PCBs, and they're pretty brittle .
You really need to align them well before drilling as the different chip load on the side cracks them .
For that I turned a 2.25 diameter which fits snugly in the prechamber holes and use that as an alignment tool in my simple jig .
Nothing fancy, just a thick plate with a reamed 16mm hole and a bolt (with a flat face or better yet a copper bolt) to fix it in .
(11-20-2023, 02:43 PM)Niko Some more progress on the balancing machine .
The bobweights are done . I made a set for a v6, just in case .
Belt drive and position sensor are in place . The accelerometers are glued in and cables neatly placed .
All that's left is to just do it .
Sick work, keep it going with posts please.
Regards
(11-20-2023, 02:43 PM)Niko Some more progress on the balancing machine .
The bobweights are done . I made a set for a v6, just in case .
Belt drive and position sensor are in place . The accelerometers are glued in and cables neatly placed .
All that's left is to just do it .
Sick work, keep it going with posts please.
Regards
Two things need attention! The cantilevers need to be longer. That's important as you get false readings at or below the natural frequency of the cantilever.
Second, It's better to build this with ADXL345 the digital output version of the accelerometer and use some pretty good signal filtration, as this Legend of a man describes below:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4DsQcoqlCo
Only thing about his designs is it need to be adapted for a 50kg piece of steel.
Anyway, I'll keep on with this, but I want to get stuff done so I'll send it to Romania for balancing .
To be honest I tried and failed to get meaningful readings from my balancing setup .
Two things need attention! The cantilevers need to be longer. That's important as you get false readings at or below the natural frequency of the cantilever.
Second, It's better to build this with ADXL345 the digital output version of the accelerometer and use some pretty good signal filtration, as this Legend of a man describes below:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4DsQcoqlCo
Only thing about his designs is it need to be adapted for a 50kg piece of steel.
Anyway, I'll keep on with this, but I want to get stuff done so I'll send it to Romania for balancing .
(03-17-2024, 03:00 AM)Niko So I got the crank t run pretty smooth . I'll have to see where to post pics and keep track of things, since it's a bit difficult here .
How much was the crank out of balance? And would you balance one for me if i send it to you? regards
Hi Deltaevo, the balancing machine shows accelerations, so I can't tell you how many grams were there . Are you building a 605 too ? I have a spare crank in my workshop . Selecting the bobweights is the most tedious job and for that you need to know the exact weight of all components and the weight distribution of the connecting rods .
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