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+--- Thread: Turbo on a sucker (/showthread.php?tid=339)
Turbo on a sucker - lars - 04-28-2009
Hi again
Those 601,2 and 3 suckers are easily available at salvageyards here in Norway for cheap.
We also have a 2,2l 4banger with 16 valves, 95hp. Made from 95 and on until cdi came in 1999. think it is very similar to a 601.. You guys heard of this beauty? is it good hiflow shit?
I see Kamel here has a 617 sucker with a moderate turbo. Is that possible with the NA 60x as well or does it NEED a turbo IP?
Not sure, but does the 617 plungers fit into a 60x IP with good result?
Just thinking of a moderate turbo with maxing out the stock IP and supply enough air. Does the NA IPs have 5,5 pistons like the turbo IP?
Yes the engine might break if abused, but is it doable at all?
RE: Turbo on a sucker - ForcedInduction - 04-28-2009
Its doable but don't expect it to last as long or hold as much power as a real turbo engine.
The 16valve engine is an OM604, nonexistent in the USA and it would be a great engine to start with compared to the 601/2/3. You're very lucky to live in Norway, those engines are common over there, all we ever find in the yards are 616/7 and the occasional rare 601/2/3.
Here is a comparison of the turbo and non-turbo rod and piston in the om604/5/6.
RE: Turbo on a sucker - lars - 04-28-2009
Oki, thanks.
I see the compression ratio is 22 on both NA and turbo version
. Those IPs are electronically controlled, so I guess it would require a IP from a similar banger 601/2/3 to swap and fit the mechanical control-parts to the 4/5/6 pump.
Is there any electronic catalogue or something from MB available on net that can give me an exploded drawing on the engines.
Im a true BMW man so not used to MB.
I think an engine like this would fit sweetly into a light old 3 series
RE: Turbo on a sucker - MB TECH - 04-28-2009
(04-28-2009, 03:15 PM)lars Is there any electronic catalogue or something from MB available on net that can give me an exploded drawing on the engines.What kind of exploded diagram are you looking for? Just the engine itself?
RE: Turbo on a sucker - ForcedInduction - 04-28-2009
(04-28-2009, 03:15 PM)lars Those IPs are electronically controlled, so I guess it would require a IP from a similar banger 601/2/3 to swap and fit the mechanical control-parts to the 4/5/6 pump.Yes, they will bolt right on.
Quote:Is there any electronic catalogue or something from MB available on net that can give me an exploded drawing on the engines.https://epc.startekinfo.com/epc/
RE: Turbo on a sucker - lars - 05-01-2009
Thanks for that link, FI.
But it wouldn`t log in without credcard. hmm
Q: What is the IP plunger dia of the om604?
RE: Turbo on a sucker - ForcedInduction - 05-01-2009
If its non-turbo, 5.5mm
6mm if turbo.
RE: Turbo on a sucker - Einar - 05-02-2009
Did you get OM604A with IDI, I have only seen those as CDI(220CDI)
LARS: Hva med 220CDI-motor med datasprut, Bosch leverer programmerbare hjerner, ,mulig man kan få datasprut som megasquirt til å funke på common-rail også
English: How about a 220CDI-engine with "computer-controlled injection", Bosch delivers programmable ECU`s, maybe you can get example megasquirt to work with commonrail-injection.
RE: Turbo on a sucker - lars - 05-02-2009
Norwegen über alles
Do the NA 601/2/3 also have 5,5mm plungers?
Yes my man. The NA C- and Eclass 220d 1995-1998 with 95 angry horses is IDI with computer controlled IP though..
Anybody have a link to the Bosch dieselinjection programmable?
I have driven a MB commercial vehicle - the 2006 313cdi. It has an ignition key like a car from 1980 without any battery - in opposition to normal modern MB cars. Does that mean these engines do not have any CANBUScrap or immobilizers? good for cannibalizing..
RE: Turbo on a sucker - ForcedInduction - 05-02-2009
A CDI requires a computer by nature. The Sprinter just has less body electronics.
RE: Turbo on a sucker - lars - 05-02-2009
(05-02-2009, 04:46 PM)ForcedInduction A CDI requires a computer by nature. The Sprinter just has less body electronics.
Yes, there is less comfort equipment like power windows, AC and stuff.
-But is the engine wiringharness less complicated? What I mean is: On old (until 1994) BMWs engines have their own wiring harness with ecu, and are pretty easily swappable to other cars. just plug up some wires: 12V, ground, gaspumprelay, and a few others. They have simple plastic ign keys.
from 95 until 98 you need the ignitionkey with ignitionlockantenna that is communicating with the microchip in the key. And some black immo boxes (the whole Immob wiring from the donorcar). Doable, but a little more work.
1999 and newer is all fucked impossible up cuz CANBUS (special ign key and engine wiring is integrated in the car
).---When I saw that simple key on the 313cdi, is when I thought maybe MB did not install immob on comm vehicles...?
lookin forward to a MB powered BMW. old BMW Turbodiesels suck with cracking heads, bad parts availability and tuning knowledge availability.
PS. Appreciate your help FI
RE: Turbo on a sucker - ForcedInduction - 05-02-2009
You would have to double check the key switch for wiring. The sender in the key is only about the size of a grain of rice.
RE: Turbo on a sucker - Einar - 05-05-2009
(05-02-2009, 03:53 PM)lars Norwegen über allesOM604A=Turbodiesel, did the OM604 came with IDI and turbo, or only CDI?
Do the NA 601/2/3 also have 5,5mm plungers?
Yes my man. The NA C- and Eclass 220d 1995-1998 with 95 angry horses is IDI with computer controlled IP though..
Anybody have a link to the Bosch dieselinjection programmable?
Link for the bosch ECU HERE, it`s not cheap.
I`ve allways wondered f you can get commonrail to work with in example MS, you have 1 injector for each cylinder, no throttlehouse and a pressure-regulating leak-valve, do you think Megasquirt or something could control that?
I thought about "commonrailing" my old OM617, and had probably tried if I knew what to do with the "pre-combustions-chambers".
Heilt ræva engelsk på meg :-)
RE: Turbo on a sucker - lars - 05-05-2009
Nice shit with programmable, Einar, but not sheep stuff. I didn`t know there was something called Diesel aftermarket ecu before now
Regarding turbocharging Suckers.. The 4-valve seems to handle it pretty well.http://www.holysmoke.fi/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3291&sid=85bdfad67f1fc6597356f0b1c319c1fa
Q 1:How would a NA IP(601,2,3) react with 5,5plungers and turbo?
I can imagine It will puke smoke if not easy on pedal before boost- cuz there is no alda. Okay that is fine.
Other than that, will it idle well and behave like a smooth engine(with other words will it behave like a turbo IP)?
Q2: Will an IP with 6mm plungers behave well and just provide more fuel all over the line within the standard revrange, or will the engine run like shit?
Read a lot on different forums, and still learning
RE: Turbo on a sucker - lars - 05-05-2009
Look at this guy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIXhKqGiBBQ
OM601 turbo`d and 7mm.
Ooh, NICE. Seems like the suckers can withstand some punch eventhough they dont have squirters and stuff
But the story does not say how it ended...