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+--- Thread: DIY Turbo manifold. (/showthread.php?tid=7988)
DIY Turbo manifold. - winmutt - 02-28-2018
I've talked myself into learning welding, buying a MIG setup and building my own manifold. I plan on using schedule 40 piping as it's relatively easy to work with, but am unsure about the size. The om606 head port measures something like 2 1/2" x 1 1/8". I was thinking about 1 1/2" pipe but that seems monstrous and could potentially decrease exit velocity where 1 1/4" would be closer to that smaller head port dimension.
All of the references I could find were in MM and none seem to match up with schedule 40 metric charts.
Thoughts? I'd like to start working on the collector as that seems like something that will take time. I found trupply.com has great pricing on mild steel els but want to knock out the collector first to start setting up for mock/fitment.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - atypicalguy - 03-01-2018
(02-28-2018, 02:02 PM)winmutt All of the references I could find were in MM and none seem to match up with schedule 40 metric charts.
Thoughts? I'd like to start working on the collector as that seems like something that will take time. I found trupply.com has great pricing on mild steel els but want to knock out the collector first to start setting up for mock/fitment.
A collector is pretty ambitious for someone starting out, and it would almost always be done with TIG.
I would suggest you purchase a collector from columbia mandrel bending or similar, and focus your fabrication on the rest of it. But actually I would just buy a bunch of scraps of the material you want to use, and practice welding them together before you start even working on the manifold, so you end up with something you like instead of something you want to throw away. You will probably need a band saw, unless you are good with CAD and can have it cut and bent with a cnc laser or something.
Have Fun and post some photos. You will need to think carefully through the welding sequence to ensure access to all the welds as it goes together.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - winmutt - 03-02-2018
Thanks. I am using this guy as my inspiration https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQzM3ZxxQYE and he is using 1.5" schedule 40.I'm unable to find any 6->1 collectors in mild steel.
I pulled a 603 gasket out of the mess and it is 1.5" NPS, so 1.25" would be a downsizing. The 606 exhaust outlet is a wierd 73mm X 28mm oval or 174mm circumference which equates to ~ 2.18". 2" doesn't sound like a lot but once I got it in my hand at the home depot it seemed monstrous. I can't seem to find mild steel elbows in 1.75" or something else between 1.5" vs 2".
Scraps are hard to come by but schedule 40 pipe is pretty cheap.
Another challenge I have is the flared oval. I'm not sure your average tail pipe expander is going to be able to take a 1.5" schedule 40 thickness and expand it to 2". I have a shop near by with a huge hydraulic pipe expander and I'm not even sure thats up to the task. I thought about getting a conical die on a press and doing it that way. I've seen where people have cut the schedule 40 pipe and inserted a wedge along the but but that seems less than graceful. I've found buttwelds but I am pretty sure they are cast and I am not sure how they would respond to getting ovaled out (assume they would crack).
I've found trupply.com to have the best pricing and options on mild el's.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - Bigpanda16 - 03-04-2018
Have you sourced your manifold flange yet?
2" seems to be what they "oval up" to weld to the flange. Some flanges have the oval to round transition machined into them, so you don't have to worry about the cone fabrication.
There was a thread on here a while back with a video of a guy who was knocking up and machining these cones and offered them up for sale. Would have to check my pm's for his username...
If you have a 606.962 factory turbo manifold, I'd be down to trade my 1/2" laser cut/ water jet/ flange for it.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - Bigpanda16 - 03-04-2018
Simpler=Better was the guy, same one I got my flange from
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - atypicalguy - 03-04-2018
(03-04-2018, 09:54 AM)Bigpanda16 Simpler=Better was the guy, same one I got my flange from
To get the transition milled into the flange, I think they use 1" material. F-tune and others, maybe dieselpumpuk also but they probably just buy them from ftune or kkd and mark them up.
Sched 40 certainly seems like overkill. I would think you could find some tubing for that.
Look at BMW manifolds for 6:1 merge collectors. There are dudes all over instagram that do them.
Here is one that is tacked together for a T4: http://www.jegs.com/i/Vibrant-Performance/231/2456/10002/-1?CAWELAID=230006180001379735&CAGPSPN=pla&CAAGID=44693592161&CATCI=pla-209593559351&CATARGETID=230006180039219294&cadevice=c&gclid=CjwKCAiAz-7UBRBAEiwAVrz-9XICe7Md4zipaL4qLrLxCGzI00otIi4HFo-myXUKRVBT48gfc1dMQBoC2FMQAvD_BwE
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - Turbo - 03-04-2018
What turbo you going to use? VNT, single or twin scroll?
manifold of short or long tubes? same length?
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - winmutt - 03-05-2018
Well, I got started.
My welds are terrible and will probably crack but we'll deal with that if and when it happens.
I'll take more pics tonight but I have a collector. Currently the angles are all too wide so I haven't tack'ed it up, but it's looking good. Fitting 6* 1.9" OD pipe in roughly 1.5* the side of one 1.9" pipe is a bit of a challenge but so far so good.
I started with 3x 1' sections of pipe and cut them at a sharp angle (I'll measure it later) in the middle to make my V's. This made the fitment almost 99.9% perfect as my chopsaw rolled a bit at the end.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - fordheaded - 03-05-2018
Try "weldingtipsandtricks.com" for some great instructional videos on mig welding everything pipe.
Lots of practice and patience will be useful, too.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - winmutt - 03-05-2018
Decided I wasn't running hot enough and went up a notch. Way better penetration. I ended up re welding all of the welds from the inside to make up for the outside welds. Stepping up my noob level a notch. Cleaned up most of it with a deburr bit and need to chase it with a brillo bit. Now I'm down to the last bit before the flange goes on.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - SurfRodder - 03-05-2018
Looking good so far brotha!
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - Mallinman - 03-06-2018
Looking good. Not a bad effort for a first start. Deffo turn the amps up tho. She’s running 2 cold. Also turn your gas up a little and you will be able to run more stick out so you will find it easier getting into the tight joints.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - winmutt - 03-06-2018
(03-06-2018, 01:36 AM)Mallinman Looking good. Not a bad effort for a first start. Deffo turn the amps up tho. She’s running 2 cold. Also turn your gas up a little and you will be able to run more stick out so you will find it easier getting into the tight joints.
I did this with 0.030 FCAW, my regulator is in the mail. I may end up having to do this over again as I'm not sure about fitment of the flange. I think I nailed the narrow width right but am short on the longer width. If nothing else, I've learned a lot so far.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - Mallinman - 03-08-2018
It’s all about the practice bud. Just keep messing and you will get it. At least you are getting stuck in. As posted above, Jody does some really good useful videos on weldingtipsandtrucks on YouTube.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - winmutt - 03-11-2018
I couldn't find any pipe vids on that site, however I've found a few others that cover butt-weld pretty well
Primarily for cage welding
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - winmutt - 03-16-2018
Ugly as sin and not done yet but it fits!!! Pretty magical considering I didn't measure anything.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - starynovy - 03-19-2018
Too cold still. Weld should be fused into each tube and even/slightly convex between them. These spits will crack at first start.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - baldur - 03-19-2018
(03-19-2018, 12:29 PM)starynovy Too cold still. Weld should be fused into each tube and even/slightly convex between them. These spits will crack at first start.
Yeah, needs much more heat. Crank the amps up.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - hooblah - 03-20-2018
Consider slowing down as well to get a bigger weld pool and more fusion. It will also make your welds look better. Also keep the torch as close as possible to the weld.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - baldur - 03-20-2018
Here's a mild steel manifold I built back in 2004 and it's still in service. TIG welding makes it so much easier to control the weld quality and get welds that
penetrate through the entire thickness of the material.
You can still do it with MIG, it just takes some practice.
A little tip, grind the pipes so that there's a gap between them at the top and you have a little groove that allows the weld metal to get in between them.
That way it'll be easier to get some penetration. Also make sure the wire isn't feeding too fast. You may clog some MIG nozzles if you go too slow but too slow
is better than too fast, as too much wire feed cools the weld down.
![[Image: exmani030007.jpg]](http://www.foo.is/albums/newturbo/exmani030007.jpg)
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - Mallinman - 03-22-2018
What turbo are you going to put on?? Or turbos?
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - atypicalguy - 04-04-2018
(03-20-2018, 04:23 PM)baldur Here's a mild steel manifold I built back in 2004 and it's still in service. TIG welding makes it so much easier to control the weld quality and get welds that
penetrate through the entire thickness of the material.
You can still do it with MIG, it just takes some practice.
A little tip, grind the pipes so that there's a gap between them at the top and you have a little groove that allows the weld metal to get in between them.
That way it'll be easier to get some penetration. Also make sure the wire isn't feeding too fast. You may clog some MIG nozzles if you go too slow but too slow
is better than too fast, as too much wire feed cools the weld down.
Those are some very nice welds.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - starynovy - 04-04-2018
Yes gap is a must even with TIG for full fusion. But I would say you will destroy turbo with MIG because there is just too much shit flying and balls everywhere. There is a reason for TIG-clean weld.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - atypicalguy - 04-05-2018
Has anyone here ever ruined a turbo compressor housing by welding on it? I was told by a guy that sometimes it will warp the whole cover and render it useless.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - firen456 - 04-06-2018
I welded a lot comp housings (v-band clamps or hose connectors) and there were never issues about wrapping.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - TurboTim - 04-13-2018
I have a few head flanges for cheap if ya need.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - atypicalguy - 06-11-2018
(04-06-2018, 09:42 AM)firen456 I welded a lot comp housings (v-band clamps or hose connectors) and there were never issues about wrapping.
Thanks. I see people welding stuff to the compressor cover outlet and inlet all the time, and nobody ever talks about it warping. But a pretty smart guy from a turbo manufacturer told me they see it sometimes.
Sorry for hijack. How is your manifold coming along, Winmutt?
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - g wizz - 10-22-2018
(04-05-2018, 05:54 PM)atypicalguy Has anyone here ever ruined a turbo compressor housing by welding on it? I was told by a guy that sometimes it will warp the whole cover and render it useless.
i tig with stainless 308l rod most the time i mess with cast iron cause it wets the best or si bronze if im really worried about precipitation cracking. to warp a housing you would have to throw a bunch of heat at it, or really a BIG glob of weld. wich realistically is user error not cause of the process.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - atypicalguy - 10-23-2018
(10-22-2018, 01:09 AM)g wizz(04-05-2018, 05:54 PM)atypicalguy Has anyone here ever ruined a turbo compressor housing by welding on it? I was told by a guy that sometimes it will warp the whole cover and render it useless.
i tig with stainless 308l rod most the time i mess with cast iron cause it wets the best or si bronze if im really worried about precipitation cracking. to warp a housing you would have to throw a bunch of heat at it, or really a BIG glob of weld. wich realistically is user error not cause of the process.
Thanks but I was talking about the compressor housing, i.e. aluminum. Aluminum shrinks when you weld it so it always distorts a bit, but I think welding a vband flange on the outlet should be OK.
RE: DIY Turbo manifold. - g wizz - 11-05-2018
(10-23-2018, 08:06 PM)atypicalguy(10-22-2018, 01:09 AM)g wizz(04-05-2018, 05:54 PM)atypicalguy Has anyone here ever ruined a turbo compressor housing by welding on it? I was told by a guy that sometimes it will warp the whole cover and render it useless.
i tig with stainless 308l rod most the time i mess with cast iron cause it wets the best or si bronze if im really worried about precipitation cracking. to warp a housing you would have to throw a bunch of heat at it, or really a BIG glob of weld. wich realistically is user error not cause of the process.
Thanks but I was talking about the compressor housing, i.e. aluminum. Aluminum shrinks when you weld it so it always distorts a bit, but I think welding a vband flange on the outlet should be OK.
aluminum is actually pretty good about dissipating heat. if there were any shrinkage/warping it would be isolated to the weld area. i wouldn't worry about it but im also a pretty decent tig weldor so ya. any proficient tig weldor should have no problem doing it. nothing on a compressor housing is super thin so thermally its pretty stable.