OM648 tuning ?
OM648 tuning ?
05-17-2016, 02:51 PM
#2
FD,
Powered by tractor fuel
05-18-2016, 05:12 PM
#4
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ex: 525tds 130kW, C250TD 160kW, E320CDI 200kW, ML400CDI 230kW, A6 R5TDI 130kW
Now: Q7 V8TDI 240kW, 320d 150kW, 335d 210kW
648 can give 300PS without touching or upgrading anything other than ECU. Getting free flowing exhaust and big intercooler is kinda logical for 50kW over stock I guess.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ex: 525tds 130kW, C250TD 160kW, E320CDI 200kW, ML400CDI 230kW, A6 R5TDI 130kW
Now: Q7 V8TDI 240kW, 320d 150kW, 335d 210kW
05-19-2016, 01:43 AM
#6
(05-18-2016, 05:12 PM)starynovy 648 can give 300PS without touching or upgrading anything other than ECU. Getting free flowing exhaust and big intercooler is kinda logical for 50kW over stock I guess.
I haven never heard or seen of that, can please tell me how that is going to be done without blowing turbo or rail and injectors to kingdom come!?
we are talking om648 not om642 that have pizo injectors!
(05-18-2016, 05:12 PM)starynovy 648 can give 300PS without touching or upgrading anything other than ECU. Getting free flowing exhaust and big intercooler is kinda logical for 50kW over stock I guess.
I haven never heard or seen of that, can please tell me how that is going to be done without blowing turbo or rail and injectors to kingdom come!?
we are talking om648 not om642 that have pizo injectors!
05-19-2016, 01:56 AM
#7
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ex: 525tds 130kW, C250TD 160kW, E320CDI 200kW, ML400CDI 230kW, A6 R5TDI 130kW
Now: Q7 V8TDI 240kW, 320d 150kW, 335d 210kW
I am pushing just 280PS on my 613 with everything stock except large FMIC. The think that you have not seen it does not mean it cant be done. Just by raising rail pressure on 648 there is just much more head room than 613 so 300PS no problem. It will come with some smoke tough, turbo wont give enough air to clear it completely-but hey..still les than 606 with turbo from truck.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ex: 525tds 130kW, C250TD 160kW, E320CDI 200kW, ML400CDI 230kW, A6 R5TDI 130kW
Now: Q7 V8TDI 240kW, 320d 150kW, 335d 210kW
05-19-2016, 05:28 AM
#8
The 648 is a high press DI engine wich by its nature will not turn very high , so high HP will come with high TQ values in mid revs..
What i think need to be done to get, a lot of power .... the first thing is enable the engine periferals to inject 50% more fuel , and 50% more cool air , yes...
1- high pressure pump flow , rack pressure regulator valve, rack pressure sensor .
2- suply enough air at a decent temperature to burn the extra 50% fuel, MAP able to read 3.5 absolute , MAF can be eliminated , big intercooler .
3- Being this one a DI engine the injectors have to be modded to be able to inject the 50% more , increasing rail press will no do the job,
bigger capacity nozzle and mod in the master needle is needed, usually a AMG setings specs can do this trick.
4- Then , the more dificult thing to do, this engine as stock runs about 60%EGR , wich means that it will ingest in certain conditions a max of 60% exaust gas, and a min of 30% all time , (except for cold start ... dadad), wich is not a problem , but will became a problem once one switch off the EGR ingestion, as many people do... this amount of gas will not be able to run through the GT23V turbine, even with the vanes at the max flow position... so dealing with this will be the most tricky thing to achieve. the gt23turbo is able to produce enough air for 300HP(i dont belive it will do more than that)
5- reprogram the ECU, this type of ECU does not use flash tune maps or what ever , is a program that analises conditions and run the engine according to a certain protocol wich changes with the changes in the conditions . Reprograming this thing must not be so dificult as it may seem first hand , but build a program to run the engine smooth for 20% more power might me chalenging...
well, i do not forsee it so easy to reach the desired 300HP just by reprograming the ECU , but if people say it can be done why can´t it be... give it a chance a report back...
regards
FD,
Powered by tractor fuel
hy fine people ,
The 648 is a high press DI engine wich by its nature will not turn very high , so high HP will come with high TQ values in mid revs..
What i think need to be done to get, a lot of power .... the first thing is enable the engine periferals to inject 50% more fuel , and 50% more cool air , yes...
1- high pressure pump flow , rack pressure regulator valve, rack pressure sensor .
2- suply enough air at a decent temperature to burn the extra 50% fuel, MAP able to read 3.5 absolute , MAF can be eliminated , big intercooler .
3- Being this one a DI engine the injectors have to be modded to be able to inject the 50% more , increasing rail press will no do the job,
bigger capacity nozzle and mod in the master needle is needed, usually a AMG setings specs can do this trick.
4- Then , the more dificult thing to do, this engine as stock runs about 60%EGR , wich means that it will ingest in certain conditions a max of 60% exaust gas, and a min of 30% all time , (except for cold start ... dadad), wich is not a problem , but will became a problem once one switch off the EGR ingestion, as many people do... this amount of gas will not be able to run through the GT23V turbine, even with the vanes at the max flow position... so dealing with this will be the most tricky thing to achieve. the gt23turbo is able to produce enough air for 300HP(i dont belive it will do more than that)
5- reprogram the ECU, this type of ECU does not use flash tune maps or what ever , is a program that analises conditions and run the engine according to a certain protocol wich changes with the changes in the conditions . Reprograming this thing must not be so dificult as it may seem first hand , but build a program to run the engine smooth for 20% more power might me chalenging...
well, i do not forsee it so easy to reach the desired 300HP just by reprograming the ECU , but if people say it can be done why can´t it be... give it a chance a report back...
regards
FD,
Powered by tractor fuel
05-17-2017, 11:19 PM
#14
When I got my car it was tuned by Carlsson in Germany.
They had the same number on stock car.
Upgraded the exhaust, intercooler, aitfilter, and did the EGR delete,
After that I got it tuned at a local shop here in Norway and we got very near 280hp and just over 700m,.
But the problem wasn't getting power out from the engine (or torque) it was getting the gearbox to use it.
I have new plans for Injectors, H-pump, Turbo, exhaust manifold during next winter.
But for now, the priority is getting a new controller for the gearbox installed.
See thread: http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=3105
I can't see any need for more power when the gearbox don't shift when needed, I have my power band between 1400-2800rpm but the gearbox is going way past this (4500rpm) before shifting.
Waste of time during acceleration.
I believe the car will feel to perform like it got dubble the HP just by tuning the gearbox.
But.. The standard ECU tuning without any upgrades did NOT get me to 300HP at the wheels.
I will follow this thread with interest
N.
(04-30-2017, 10:03 AM)Kennobi75 265hp 600nm so far..
Some upgrades and remaping ?
Is that on the wheels? Dynoed?
When I got my car it was tuned by Carlsson in Germany.
They had the same number on stock car.
Upgraded the exhaust, intercooler, aitfilter, and did the EGR delete,
After that I got it tuned at a local shop here in Norway and we got very near 280hp and just over 700m,.
But the problem wasn't getting power out from the engine (or torque) it was getting the gearbox to use it.
I have new plans for Injectors, H-pump, Turbo, exhaust manifold during next winter.
But for now, the priority is getting a new controller for the gearbox installed.
See thread: http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=3105
I can't see any need for more power when the gearbox don't shift when needed, I have my power band between 1400-2800rpm but the gearbox is going way past this (4500rpm) before shifting.
Waste of time during acceleration.
I believe the car will feel to perform like it got dubble the HP just by tuning the gearbox.
But.. The standard ECU tuning without any upgrades did NOT get me to 300HP at the wheels.
I will follow this thread with interest
N.
(04-30-2017, 10:03 AM)Kennobi75 265hp 600nm so far..
Some upgrades and remaping ?
05-18-2017, 08:13 PM
#15
whipplem104
05-18-2017, 08:13 PM #15Be careful thinking that peak engine output is the most important. It is peak output from the transmission that is more important. You need to take your dyno graph for your power band and then run it through excel and multiply times each gear ratio. When tq in 1st drops below tq in 2nd after the shift point then you you should shift. You will find that you will normally will never have enough rpms to do what you really ought to. For example if you are only making 200nm at 4600 rpm in 1st gear you would be making 718nm at the output shaft. You need to make 326nm. Also it is very hard to use tq in the low rpms because the tq converter has to be so tight that the engine will even run in those rpms. Your stall on your converter will put you well into the 2k or higher rpm on launch. You would need to have a tighter converter put in to even try and run in those low rpm ranges. You would need almost full lock by around 2k rpm.
05-19-2017, 08:04 AM
#17
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ex: 525tds 130kW, C250TD 160kW, E320CDI 200kW, ML400CDI 230kW, A6 R5TDI 130kW
Now: Q7 V8TDI 240kW, 320d 150kW, 335d 210kW
300ps at the wheels? No.. Nobody stated that, you can get 300 at the crank by remap. Agreed on GB, it shifts like crazy and car feels powerless. But with standalone controller you should buy stronger torque converter or it will surely fail from locking down low.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ex: 525tds 130kW, C250TD 160kW, E320CDI 200kW, ML400CDI 230kW, A6 R5TDI 130kW
Now: Q7 V8TDI 240kW, 320d 150kW, 335d 210kW
06-28-2017, 05:37 PM
#18
(05-17-2017, 11:19 PM)seconika No dyno. Yes i think it was on the wheels..
Upgrade turbo airfilter and end mufflers next and then new mapping ?
Its done at motoropti.no here in Norway
Is that on the wheels? Dynoed?
When I got my car it was tuned by Carlsson in Germany.
They had the same number on stock car.
Upgraded the exhaust, intercooler, aitfilter, and did the EGR delete,
After that I got it tuned at a local shop here in Norway and we got very near 280hp and just over 700m,.
But the problem wasn't getting power out from the engine (or torque) it was getting the gearbox to use it.
I have new plans for Injectors, H-pump, Turbo, exhaust manifold during next winter.
But for now, the priority is getting a new controller for the gearbox installed.
See thread: http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=3105
I can't see any need for more power when the gearbox don't shift when needed, I have my power band between 1400-2800rpm but the gearbox is going way past this (4500rpm) before shifting.
Waste of time during acceleration.
I believe the car will feel to perform like it got dubble the HP just by tuning the gearbox.
But.. The standard ECU tuning without any upgrades did NOT get me to 300HP at the wheels.
I will follow this thread with interest
N.
(04-30-2017, 10:03 AM)Kennobi75 265hp 600nm so far..
Some upgrades and remaping ?
(05-17-2017, 11:19 PM)seconika No dyno. Yes i think it was on the wheels..
Upgrade turbo airfilter and end mufflers next and then new mapping ?
Its done at motoropti.no here in Norway
Is that on the wheels? Dynoed?
When I got my car it was tuned by Carlsson in Germany.
They had the same number on stock car.
Upgraded the exhaust, intercooler, aitfilter, and did the EGR delete,
After that I got it tuned at a local shop here in Norway and we got very near 280hp and just over 700m,.
But the problem wasn't getting power out from the engine (or torque) it was getting the gearbox to use it.
I have new plans for Injectors, H-pump, Turbo, exhaust manifold during next winter.
But for now, the priority is getting a new controller for the gearbox installed.
See thread: http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=3105
I can't see any need for more power when the gearbox don't shift when needed, I have my power band between 1400-2800rpm but the gearbox is going way past this (4500rpm) before shifting.
Waste of time during acceleration.
I believe the car will feel to perform like it got dubble the HP just by tuning the gearbox.
But.. The standard ECU tuning without any upgrades did NOT get me to 300HP at the wheels.
I will follow this thread with interest
N.
(04-30-2017, 10:03 AM)Kennobi75 265hp 600nm so far..
Some upgrades and remaping ?
06-28-2017, 05:54 PM
#19
(05-17-2017, 11:19 PM)seconika I think the transmission shifts good, around 3500rpm.
This guy have done this engine up to around 600hp ?
Motoropti.no
Its at vålerbanen racetrack.
Is that on the wheels? Dynoed?
When I got my car it was tuned by Carlsson in Germany.
They had the same number on stock car.
Upgraded the exhaust, intercooler, aitfilter, and did the EGR delete,
After that I got it tuned at a local shop here in Norway and we got very near 280hp and just over 700m,.
But the problem wasn't getting power out from the engine (or torque) it was getting the gearbox to use it.
I have new plans for Injectors, H-pump, Turbo, exhaust manifold during next winter.
But for now, the priority is getting a new controller for the gearbox installed.
See thread: http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=3105
I can't see any need for more power when the gearbox don't shift when needed, I have my power band between 1400-2800rpm but the gearbox is going way past this (4500rpm) before shifting.
Waste of time during acceleration.
I believe the car will feel to perform like it got dubble the HP just by tuning the gearbox.
But.. The standard ECU tuning without any upgrades did NOT get me to 300HP at the wheels.
I will follow this thread with interest
N.
(04-30-2017, 10:03 AM)Kennobi75 265hp 600nm so far..
Some upgrades and remaping ?
- 93 300TDTMyna
- 05 S211 280cdi
(05-17-2017, 11:19 PM)seconika I think the transmission shifts good, around 3500rpm.
This guy have done this engine up to around 600hp ?
Motoropti.no
Its at vålerbanen racetrack.
Is that on the wheels? Dynoed?
When I got my car it was tuned by Carlsson in Germany.
They had the same number on stock car.
Upgraded the exhaust, intercooler, aitfilter, and did the EGR delete,
After that I got it tuned at a local shop here in Norway and we got very near 280hp and just over 700m,.
But the problem wasn't getting power out from the engine (or torque) it was getting the gearbox to use it.
I have new plans for Injectors, H-pump, Turbo, exhaust manifold during next winter.
But for now, the priority is getting a new controller for the gearbox installed.
See thread: http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=3105
I can't see any need for more power when the gearbox don't shift when needed, I have my power band between 1400-2800rpm but the gearbox is going way past this (4500rpm) before shifting.
Waste of time during acceleration.
I believe the car will feel to perform like it got dubble the HP just by tuning the gearbox.
But.. The standard ECU tuning without any upgrades did NOT get me to 300HP at the wheels.
I will follow this thread with interest
N.
(04-30-2017, 10:03 AM)Kennobi75 265hp 600nm so far..
Some upgrades and remaping ?
- 93 300TDTMyna
- 05 S211 280cdi
07-08-2017, 04:32 PM
#20
(06-28-2017, 05:54 PM)Kennobi75(05-17-2017, 11:19 PM)seconika Turbo can take 270hp crank so its not on the wheels.
Upgrading turbo and injectors next.
Turbotohtori in Finland will upgrade turbo, 350-400hp
Herlevi tractor pulling team have nozzles, or use another source, will know soon.
Update to come.
I think the transmission shifts good, around 3500rpm.
This guy have done this engine up to around 600hp ?
Motoropti.no
Its at vålerbanen racetrack.
Is that on the wheels? Dynoed?
When I got my car it was tuned by Carlsson in Germany.
They had the same number on stock car.
Upgraded the exhaust, intercooler, aitfilter, and did the EGR delete,
After that I got it tuned at a local shop here in Norway and we got very near 280hp and just over 700m,.
But the problem wasn't getting power out from the engine (or torque) it was getting the gearbox to use it.
I have new plans for Injectors, H-pump, Turbo, exhaust manifold during next winter.
But for now, the priority is getting a new controller for the gearbox installed.
See thread: http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=3105
I can't see any need for more power when the gearbox don't shift when needed, I have my power band between 1400-2800rpm but the gearbox is going way past this (4500rpm) before shifting.
Waste of time during acceleration.
I believe the car will feel to perform like it got dubble the HP just by tuning the gearbox.
But.. The standard ECU tuning without any upgrades did NOT get me to 300HP at the wheels.
I will follow this thread with interest
N.
(04-30-2017, 10:03 AM)Kennobi75 265hp 600nm so far..
Some upgrades and remaping ?
- 93 300TDTMyna
- 05 S211 280cdi
(06-28-2017, 05:54 PM)Kennobi75(05-17-2017, 11:19 PM)seconika Turbo can take 270hp crank so its not on the wheels.
Upgrading turbo and injectors next.
Turbotohtori in Finland will upgrade turbo, 350-400hp
Herlevi tractor pulling team have nozzles, or use another source, will know soon.
Update to come.
I think the transmission shifts good, around 3500rpm.
This guy have done this engine up to around 600hp ?
Motoropti.no
Its at vålerbanen racetrack.
Is that on the wheels? Dynoed?
When I got my car it was tuned by Carlsson in Germany.
They had the same number on stock car.
Upgraded the exhaust, intercooler, aitfilter, and did the EGR delete,
After that I got it tuned at a local shop here in Norway and we got very near 280hp and just over 700m,.
But the problem wasn't getting power out from the engine (or torque) it was getting the gearbox to use it.
I have new plans for Injectors, H-pump, Turbo, exhaust manifold during next winter.
But for now, the priority is getting a new controller for the gearbox installed.
See thread: http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=3105
I can't see any need for more power when the gearbox don't shift when needed, I have my power band between 1400-2800rpm but the gearbox is going way past this (4500rpm) before shifting.
Waste of time during acceleration.
I believe the car will feel to perform like it got dubble the HP just by tuning the gearbox.
But.. The standard ECU tuning without any upgrades did NOT get me to 300HP at the wheels.
I will follow this thread with interest
N.
(04-30-2017, 10:03 AM)Kennobi75 265hp 600nm so far..
Some upgrades and remaping ?
- 93 300TDTMyna
- 05 S211 280cdi
07-18-2017, 11:19 AM
#21
(07-08-2017, 04:32 PM)Kennobi75(06-28-2017, 05:54 PM)Kennobi75(05-17-2017, 11:19 PM)seconika Turbo can take 270hp crank so its not on the wheels.
Upgrading turbo and injectors next.
Turbotohtori in Finland will upgrade turbo, 350-400hp
Herlevi tractor pulling team have nozzles, or use another source, will know soon.
Update to come.
I think the transmission shifts good, around 3500rpm.
This guy have done this engine up to around 600hp ?
Motoropti.no
Its at vålerbanen racetrack.
Is that on the wheels? Dynoed?
When I got my car it was tuned by Carlsson in Germany.
They had the same number on stock car.
Upgraded the exhaust, intercooler, aitfilter, and did the EGR delete,
After that I got it tuned at a local shop here in Norway and we got very near 280hp and just over 700m,.
But the problem wasn't getting power out from the engine (or torque) it was getting the gearbox to use it.
I have new plans for Injectors, H-pump, Turbo, exhaust manifold during next winter.
But for now, the priority is getting a new controller for the gearbox installed.
See thread: http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=3105
I can't see any need for more power when the gearbox don't shift when needed, I have my power band between 1400-2800rpm but the gearbox is going way past this (4500rpm) before shifting.
Waste of time during acceleration.
I believe the car will feel to perform like it got dubble the HP just by tuning the gearbox.
But.. The standard ECU tuning without any upgrades did NOT get me to 300HP at the wheels.
I will follow this thread with interest
N.
so with all stock engine and transmission max numbers atainable are 270hp and 600nm.
next step would be Intercooler, Injectors, Downpipe and stronger Torque Converter, and an hybrid 2359.
I have an E320cdi bought new from me in 2003 and want to update it.
regards
(07-08-2017, 04:32 PM)Kennobi75(06-28-2017, 05:54 PM)Kennobi75(05-17-2017, 11:19 PM)seconika Turbo can take 270hp crank so its not on the wheels.
Upgrading turbo and injectors next.
Turbotohtori in Finland will upgrade turbo, 350-400hp
Herlevi tractor pulling team have nozzles, or use another source, will know soon.
Update to come.
I think the transmission shifts good, around 3500rpm.
This guy have done this engine up to around 600hp ?
Motoropti.no
Its at vålerbanen racetrack.
Is that on the wheels? Dynoed?
When I got my car it was tuned by Carlsson in Germany.
They had the same number on stock car.
Upgraded the exhaust, intercooler, aitfilter, and did the EGR delete,
After that I got it tuned at a local shop here in Norway and we got very near 280hp and just over 700m,.
But the problem wasn't getting power out from the engine (or torque) it was getting the gearbox to use it.
I have new plans for Injectors, H-pump, Turbo, exhaust manifold during next winter.
But for now, the priority is getting a new controller for the gearbox installed.
See thread: http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/show...p?tid=3105
I can't see any need for more power when the gearbox don't shift when needed, I have my power band between 1400-2800rpm but the gearbox is going way past this (4500rpm) before shifting.
Waste of time during acceleration.
I believe the car will feel to perform like it got dubble the HP just by tuning the gearbox.
But.. The standard ECU tuning without any upgrades did NOT get me to 300HP at the wheels.
I will follow this thread with interest
N.
so with all stock engine and transmission max numbers atainable are 270hp and 600nm.
next step would be Intercooler, Injectors, Downpipe and stronger Torque Converter, and an hybrid 2359.
I have an E320cdi bought new from me in 2003 and want to update it.
regards
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