project idea feeler: 1986 190E 2.3-16 swap to o602
project idea feeler: 1986 190E 2.3-16 swap to o602
I have 4 options really:
#1 sell it and forget about it, regretting it for the rest of my life.
#2 do the repairs, and replace known bad sensors and hope that is it. Expensive and power limited.
#3 convert to EFI with a spare Megasquirt setup I have. Probably the easiest and lowest cost option since I have most of the stuff already.
#4 throw in a OM602 turbo and build that up. Could sell 16v motor to help with some of the costs.
Throwing any diesel bias aside, what would you do?
I'm just throwing an idea around, a seed that Winmutt planted last year. I have an 86 16v, dogleg manual with 3.27 LSD rear. The fuel distributor died on me so the car doesn't currently run. While the motor is strong, there are a few bugs I have yet to figure out, such as an erratic idle.
I have 4 options really:
#1 sell it and forget about it, regretting it for the rest of my life.
#2 do the repairs, and replace known bad sensors and hope that is it. Expensive and power limited.
#3 convert to EFI with a spare Megasquirt setup I have. Probably the easiest and lowest cost option since I have most of the stuff already.
#4 throw in a OM602 turbo and build that up. Could sell 16v motor to help with some of the costs.
Throwing any diesel bias aside, what would you do?
1987 300SDL 6spd manual om606.962 swap project
1985 300td euro 5spd wagon running
willbhere4u
03-25-2014, 03:25 PM #2option #4 the original engine is a money pit with little to no performance potential unless you are going to completely restore the car to factory original.
1987 300SDL 6spd manual om606.962 swap project
1985 300td euro 5spd wagon running
(03-25-2014, 03:25 PM)willbhere4u option #4 the original engine is a money pit with little to no performance potential unless you are going to completely restore the car to factory original.
you can get a lot of HP with a turbo on that engine, but you have to put a lot of money into it... build manifold, get megasquirt injection built+programmed,
Id go for a om602 in your case, but save/use the gearbox, the 717.404 is teh shit.
or get a om605 or om606 in there since you have a badass car, you should have a badass engine
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
swampmonkey
03-26-2014, 04:41 AM #4(03-25-2014, 03:25 PM)willbhere4u option #4 the original engine is a money pit with little to no performance potential unless you are going to completely restore the car to factory original.
you can get a lot of HP with a turbo on that engine, but you have to put a lot of money into it... build manifold, get megasquirt injection built+programmed,
Id go for a om602 in your case, but save/use the gearbox, the 717.404 is teh shit.
or get a om605 or om606 in there since you have a badass car, you should have a badass engine
---------------------------------
daily driver
w115 240d 72hp 3.07 rearend
w123 om602 turbo 200whp 7.5mm pump fivespeed 3.07 rearend
+ a few more.
mbturbo.com
I would consider a 602 if the value of the car was pretty low. Bad interior, not so straight body.
If the car is pretty nice, the choice is clear. Megasquirt. The 16v is a rare classic that will become increasingly sought after.
raysorenson
03-26-2014, 07:33 AM #6Cons of the 602 are very little room for intercooling and the rear diff setup won't work out. The LSD carrier might accommodate a 3.07, which is still way too short for a non-overdrive trans. Weight distribution will be messed up too.
I would consider a 602 if the value of the car was pretty low. Bad interior, not so straight body.
If the car is pretty nice, the choice is clear. Megasquirt. The 16v is a rare classic that will become increasingly sought after.
-1982 300D Turbo, 280k miles, ALDA apparently maxxed, fram 8038, 12 lbs boost, non-egr manifolds, W/M injection, 4 brake light mod, Gen II w126 front rotors/calipers, 4-speed swap
In the works: A/W IC, adjust pump, turbo rebuild (w/60 trim comp wheel)
-1980 300SD, 110k, project car. Goal is to get it lookin' like it did on the showroom floor (body and interior wise, not necessarily under the hood )
-1974 240D, FRESH PAINT!!!!!!
sassparilla_kid
03-26-2014, 02:56 PM #7I say 4
-1982 300D Turbo, 280k miles, ALDA apparently maxxed, fram 8038, 12 lbs boost, non-egr manifolds, W/M injection, 4 brake light mod, Gen II w126 front rotors/calipers, 4-speed swap
In the works: A/W IC, adjust pump, turbo rebuild (w/60 trim comp wheel)
-1980 300SD, 110k, project car. Goal is to get it lookin' like it did on the showroom floor (body and interior wise, not necessarily under the hood )
-1974 240D, FRESH PAINT!!!!!!
I was leaning more towards a megasquirt setup, but sometimes I really yearn for the simplicity of the diesel engine. Plus the mileage of diesel is superior. Best I got in my old 300D 2.5 turbo was 39mpg. Best I got with my 16v was 18.
Body of the car is pretty straight, just one rust spot and it definitely needs paint. Seats need to be redone but are solid and all motors work.
I was leaning more towards a megasquirt setup, but sometimes I really yearn for the simplicity of the diesel engine. Plus the mileage of diesel is superior. Best I got in my old 300D 2.5 turbo was 39mpg. Best I got with my 16v was 18.
Steve.
I agree that the 602 turbo engine is great for these cars, but I think you'd be disappointed coupling it to the "Dogleg" Getrag transmission. I have an OM602 turbo transplanted into a '93 190E, but I'm using one of the "diesel spec" 5-speeds from a much earlier 190D 2.2 (not sure of trans #). Combined with a 3.07 rearend, the driveability is great, city and highway.
Steve.
raysorenson
04-01-2014, 04:27 PM #10The dogleg is pretty good with a 2.65 axle. Same top gear ratio as the 201 and 124 turbo diesels.
602, IMHO. I envy my wife's '93 vintage 602. It's unnaturally quiet and smooth. A 603 would turn a 201 into a front-heavy understeering pig. Like an Audi Quattro without the traction.
raysorenson
04-01-2014, 10:27 PM #12*ding*
602, IMHO. I envy my wife's '93 vintage 602. It's unnaturally quiet and smooth. A 603 would turn a 201 into a front-heavy understeering pig. Like an Audi Quattro without the traction.
Early on in my drivetrain swapping projects, I ran a 190E "gasser" 5-speed behind the OM602 Turbo with the stock 2.65 rear in an '87 190D 2.5T.
1st gear was a complete dog with that setup. If a hill was steep at all, I could barely get moving pointed uphill.
How "tall" is 1st gear with the dogleg trans and 2.65 rear? Sounds like that might be a decent option.
Early on in my drivetrain swapping projects, I ran a 190E "gasser" 5-speed behind the OM602 Turbo with the stock 2.65 rear in an '87 190D 2.5T.
1st gear was a complete dog with that setup. If a hill was steep at all, I could barely get moving pointed uphill.
mike-81-240d
04-06-2014, 11:31 PM #15602 because because
1981 Mercedes 300TD Lowered 4 speed manual Holset HX30
(04-02-2014, 11:24 AM)Jetmugg How "tall" is 1st gear with the dogleg trans and 2.65 rear? Sounds like that might be a decent option.
Early on in my drivetrain swapping projects, I ran a 190E "gasser" 5-speed behind the OM602 Turbo with the stock 2.65 rear in an '87 190D 2.5T.
1st gear was a complete dog with that setup. If a hill was steep at all, I could barely get moving pointed uphill.
It could be a little tall. When I had combustion issues with my 603 causing a lack of low end torque and delayed boost onset, it was irritating. Now it's great. A great launch and easy to drive in traffic. I'm turning 3k at 80mph
raysorenson
04-09-2014, 11:32 AM #16(04-02-2014, 11:24 AM)Jetmugg How "tall" is 1st gear with the dogleg trans and 2.65 rear? Sounds like that might be a decent option.
Early on in my drivetrain swapping projects, I ran a 190E "gasser" 5-speed behind the OM602 Turbo with the stock 2.65 rear in an '87 190D 2.5T.
1st gear was a complete dog with that setup. If a hill was steep at all, I could barely get moving pointed uphill.
It could be a little tall. When I had combustion issues with my 603 causing a lack of low end torque and delayed boost onset, it was irritating. Now it's great. A great launch and easy to drive in traffic. I'm turning 3k at 80mph
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